AHA!
 
I discovered the reason for my difficulty... with alt-click splitting...
 
I've been expecting it to split the clip I click on and what I realize now is that I must first select the clip. then alt-click works fine splitting exactly where I want...
 
Now I have to see how working with monitoring/auditioning clips split uniquely will work. I seem to remember the other day that something I was doing was causing the clips to continually get chopped up without my intending to do so....
 
Probably me again missing the obvious! ;-)
 
Time will tell...
 
I must admit that being forced to re-learn to do this once simple work has been interesting. I still have more to go to get back my basic needs for editing (comping to me is a part of editing) and mixing
 
I meant to post this earlier... I actually wrote it just before 10am and it's now 7:43pm... My client actually showed up on time and just left... So I'm hoping my thoughts are complete in this... I have not re-read it as I'm a bit burnt...
 
But I solved one confusion and it was all on me... Not unusual... ;-)
 
Thanks for helping me pinpoint this Everybody...
 
Keni
 
 
 

Anderton

brundlefly
The only way I get more than one clip split by Alt+click is by selecting clips in other lanes in the same time range (or the whole track)...

If the Comp clip in the parent track is selected, that selects all Take Lanes and will also cause a split to affect all Take Lanes. I'm sure you know that, but maybe Keni has the Comp clip selected?

No... I don't believe it was selected, I'll double check... But as I just replied in my previous post, Yes, it is because I did not first select a clip and all clips in that location (where I was testing) were all muted...
 
I kept expecting that if I clicked on a specific lane/clip it would only split that one as I split across lane/layer groups in the past by selecting all the lanes/layers and locating the now time on the timeline...
 
Thanks for making my understanding of this more explicit...
 
Keni

I ran into some interesting things today regarding Lanes and other things...
 
My clients today came in with tracks recorded in 8.5.3... I opened them in X3d
 
On many tracks where they had multiple layers, some seemed normal and others strange... I don't know how or why...
 
I found a few locations where they had overlapping clips on the same Lane... For that matter, I found a few Lanes with a number of clips on top of each other (total) so that the topmost obscured whatever was below... All without fades of any kind (we don't use auto crossfade much)...
 
A little difficulty working in the Lanes, but I was able to do everything with a touch of cursing and a number of things redone...
 
My biggest problems were usually issues about zoom.... I'll post that elsewhere as it is related to more than the Lane zoom issues, but Lane zoom is still not useful to me at all... I never get close to what I want, so I must manually drag the lane to it's max height and then use another tool to zoom horizontally.... Very slow and tedious...
 
But at least Lanes didn't get chopped up weird and I was able to draw in my fades slowly (zoom, zoom, zoom) ;-)
 
Keni
 

Keni
 
I discovered the reason for my difficulty... with alt-click splitting...
 
I've been expecting it to split the clip I click on and what I realize now is that I must first select the clip. then alt-click works fine splitting exactly where I want...

FYI I specified in a response to you in another thread about Take Lanes that you had to select the clip and then alt-click.
 
BUT this isn't to give you a hard time! It's about the learning process. When your mindset was that Take Lanes didn't work, you overlooked something that would help you get better results out of Take Lanes. When you opened up to the possibility that Take Lanes would do what you wanted, you didn't need to be told, you found it for yourself (unless the tip had lodged into your subconscious).
 
This is a really important point about learning software. If you enter the learning process thinking that things are possible, it's more likely you'll find a solution or if not, a workaround because you will see reality through the filter of that mindset. Similarly, if you don't think something will work, reality will be seen through the filter of that mindset. It's simply the way the human mind works.
 
Of course there are always circumstances beyond one's control, but the odds of finding a solution will improve if you think there is a possibility of finding a solution. Now that you're moving in a positive direction, I suspect you'll find more solutions   Keep doing what you're doing!

Anderton

Keni
 
I discovered the reason for my difficulty... with alt-click splitting...
 
I've been expecting it to split the clip I click on and what I realize now is that I must first select the clip. then alt-click works fine splitting exactly where I want...

FYI I specified in a response to you in another thread about Take Lanes that you had to select the clip and then alt-click.
 

 
Hate to stir the pot on this any more than it already has been, but it should work with nothing selected as well.
 

brundlefly

Anderton

Keni
 
I discovered the reason for my difficulty... with alt-click splitting...
 
I've been expecting it to split the clip I click on and what I realize now is that I must first select the clip. then alt-click works fine splitting exactly where I want...

FYI I specified in a response to you in another thread about Take Lanes that you had to select the clip and then alt-click.
 

 
Hate to stir the pot on this any more than it already has been, but it should work with nothing selected as well.
 

One of my early pet peeves with X1 was that clicking on a clip moved the time there, but didn't select the clip as well... that got fixed... So here I thought that I could still click on the clip with the split tool and it would split that clip... I still believe that's how it should work, but I understand  how it is working... It slows my editing...
 
I feel that a good adjustment to this behavior would be an additional modifier for the alt-click so that when used it would do both, select the clip and execute the split with a single command... That would save an additional click every time...
 
In reference to Craig's prompt that one had to select the clip first went right by me as I believed I was selecting it when I alt-clicked on it as I had previously been doing...
 
I have been learning new software for a long time and I do pretty well, quickly, but when tools are changed and not behaving as one is used to it can sometimes be hard to realize what you're doing wrong...
 
As to the current editing, I feel that the approach needs to be adjusted... Tho it's still possible to do these things, some tools that are basic should not be changed, but added to.
 
I don't think anyone would be happy if for some reason, the developers decided that they would map delete to the spacebar and space to the S key.... ;-)
 
I remember pro audio and earlier.... I have learned many new tools over the years... I love to learn but all changes are not always good...
 
Keni
 

Keni
I feel that a good adjustment to this behavior would be an additional modifier for the alt-click so that when used it would do both, select the clip and execute the split with a single command... That would save an additional click every time...

 
It does work that way for me with no additional modifier. Selecting in advance is not necessary, and there are options in Editing Preferences for whether the left side, right side or both sides of the clip are left selected after splitting.
 
 

>Here are some things you CAN'T do with Take Lanes (at least I haven't figured out how):
 

• Do automatic crossfades within a Lane, because clips within the same lane can't overlap.

 
I find that in X2 clips actually can overlap and even sit on top of each other in a Take Lane. Don't know about X3. The fact that you can't crossfade with them is a good thing... for me anyway, because now I can learn to avoid CFs.
 
As I wrote in another post I was having the hardest time figuring out why I kept getting the crossfade grip when slipping a clip instead of the normal grip. I was pulling my hair out because I didn't know about CFs.
 
As Craig alludes to, I can now avoid them by slip editing in the TLs instead of the main track. Thank you Craig - THIS NOW MAKES PERFECT SENSE TO ME SO PLEEEEEESE DO NOT CHANGE IT!!!
 
When I do want to crossfade I can simply click the TL button closing them and then edit. I just have to remember to reopen them when wanting to avoid CFs.
 
I have no issues with Take Lanes. They are different than the old layers because they are supposed to be. Once I understand how they work I like them much better.
 
As I wrote in a different post, I like loop recording with TLs, tho I prefer X2's ascending numbering order better than X3's descending order.
 
 
 
>Add Automation envelopes (other than clip automation) within Lanes.
 
I believe this is because Automation Lanes are separate animals and affect the entire track of which each TL is also a part of. What affects one TL affects all TLs.
 
Steve

Anderton 
Here are some things you CAN'T do with Take Lanes (at least I haven't figured out how):
 

• Do automatic crossfades within a Lane, because clips within the same lane can't overlap. Workaround: Create a new Take Lane, move the clip you want to crossfade into it, and do a manual fade in/fade out for the overlapping clips. [Edit: Actually you can do crossfades on the Comp clip in the parent track if the Take Lanes aren't showing - see Brundlefly's post #4 below]

I just noticed this one. Actually you can do essentially do automatic crossfades within a take, just differently.  Use ALT+click within a lane to split a lane.  Then use the "cross comp tool" to make the fade between the two clips.  It takes an extra click to do it, but the nice thing compared to the auto crossfade option is that you can then move the entire crossfade around, adjusting its location and size, as a single unit.  This is a great feature of the cross comp tool and something I wish was available in tracks.  Note that this is the one way I am aware of where you can have clips overlapping within a lane.  
 
Here is where it gets more complicated.  Using the crossfade tool on the track with linear fades will result in the exact same thing as a fade on the take.  You can create the fade with takes collapsed using automatic crossfades, then expand the takes and use the cross comp tool on the crossfade.  But, on the track you can also make edits to the crossfade (e.g., linear vs. slow or fast, fade in and out at different rates) that you can not establish within takes, but you can edit within takes if it is already established within the track. If you create such an uneven/non-linear fade, the cross comp tool will no longer work at all on it. 
 
This to me is all unnecessarily confusing and adds to the frustration with takes.  Yes you can do what you want, but with many "this tool works here but not here" type situations that makes it is hard to remember how to do basic edits.  I don't think this is just a matter of rethinking my workflow from layers - had I never used Sonar at all before I think I would have the same problems and suggestions.
 
I suggest CW can consolidate some of these tools to make them as consistent as possible between tracks and takes.  For example, how about a single tool for crossfades that is the best of both worlds and is consistent (to the extent possible)  between takes and lanes?  Basically use the cross comp tool but with the added flexibility to adjust fade ins and outs the same as we can do in tracks, and make it available on both tracks and lanes.
 
 

brundlefly
Hate to stir the pot on this any more than it already has been, but it should work with nothing selected as well.

Keep stirring...I need to check this out further. There have been times when I couldn't split without selecting, so I need to find out why that happened.