Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]

SilkTone
 
SONAR on Mac is great news for about 2% of CW's current users. 

FWIW - the current survey results suggests 70% of people are interested in SONAR OS X Alpha. We're still collecting results, but it hasn't swayed much from 70% all day. Very different from your assumption of 2%.
 
Personally, I've been hearing "when will SONAR be released on a Mac?" directly from both Cakewalk customers and people who use competitor products for YEARS. I've heard it at tradeshows, on emails and phones in my support days, from my colleagues at my part-time job at Berklee (where everyone BUT me refused to use anything but a Mac). If I'm being honest, it started to become really tiresome because for so long we had zero agenda of ever making it a reality. In my circles, SONAR on Mac has been in high demand for years.
 
Anyhow, I could go on for a while with random anecdotes, but I just felt the need to point out a lot more then 2% of current Cakewalk customers are expressing interest. That is insanely off the mark with what our users are and have been telling us.
 
Edit: typos

I don't doubt your reported ~70% but being a statistician I DO DOUBT your survey method and the population sampled, sorry.
 
Sonar/CW is NOT a Mac product, per se, yet your numbers indicate that of the population, of PRIMARILY PC users of Sonar, that THAT 70% want a Mac version?   Really?
 
You can't ask the same 1000 Mac users over and over (in the studio mix booth, on the floor at conventions, etc.) and call that an increased sample (even in bootstrap sampling that's a foul).
 
I would suggest that your circle, not to mention  SAMPLE, sounds a little statistically biased. 
 
 

ampfixer
I'm just wondering if the multi-version bugs we work around will be built into the MAC version. Seriously.
 
I was hoping for an announcement about a ground up rebuild of Sonar PC that got rid of the legacy code that has caused issues in eliminating bugs. Other than the lifetime upgrade issue there is nothing immediate, everything is prefaced by we will, we can, we plan, stay tuned.

 
John, I'm being honest when I say this. The last thing you want from any software company like that has a product which has evolved over many years is a "ground up rewrite". Its a misconception that application rewrites result in better or bug free code. A rewrite of a complex feature rewrites introduce new bugs and in some cases reintroduce issues that were fixed years ago. Now multiply this by all the features that exist in an application. 
If we rewrote SONAR it would be many years before you saw the same level of maturity you see today.
What would happen if Microsoft rewrote Windows and discarded all the legacy code? You would have a new shiny OS with thousands of new bugs...

bluesplayer

Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]

SilkTone
 
SONAR on Mac is great news for about 2% of CW's current users. 

FWIW - the current survey results suggests 70% of people are interested in SONAR OS X Alpha. We're still collecting results, but it hasn't swayed much from 70% all day. Very different from your assumption of 2%.
 
Personally, I've been hearing "when will SONAR be released on a Mac?" directly from both Cakewalk customers and people who use competitor products for YEARS. I've heard it at tradeshows, on emails and phones in my support days, from my colleagues at my part-time job at Berklee (where everyone BUT me refused to use anything but a Mac). If I'm being honest, it started to become really tiresome because for so long we had zero agenda of ever making it a reality. In my circles, SONAR on Mac has been in high demand for years.
 
Anyhow, I could go on for a while with random anecdotes, but I just felt the need to point out a lot more then 2% of current Cakewalk customers are expressing interest. That is insanely off the mark with what our users are and have been telling us.
 
Edit: typos

I don't doubt your reported ~70% but being a statistician I DO DOUBT your survey method and the population sampled, sorry.
 
Sonar/CW is NOT a Mac product, per se, yet your numbers indicate that of the population, of PRIMARILY PC users of Sonar, that THAT 70% want a Mac version?   Really?
 
You can't ask the same 1000 Mac users over and over (in the studio mix booth, on the floor at conventions, etc.) and call that an increased sample (even in bootstrap sampling that's a foul).
 
I would suggest that your circle, not to mention  SAMPLE, sounds a little statistically biased.

I was obviously exaggerating when I said it affects only 2% of current SONAR users (pulled out of the air), but you do bring up a good point. Specifically, my original comment (which is what Ryan replied to) was made in the context of current SONAR users, who obviously use SONAR on Windows. We were told that the June 1 announcement will affect all current users, hence my comment that the Mac version ended up not affecting many current SONAR users. How many of those users want a Mac version? I can't believe that it could possibly be as high as 70%.
 
However I can believe that when you add in non SONAR users, that the number might be that high. Of course if you ask any Mac user if they want SONAR on Mac they would say yes, whether they actually plan to use it or not.

bluesplayer

Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]

SilkTone
 
SONAR on Mac is great news for about 2% of CW's current users. 

FWIW - the current survey results suggests 70% of people are interested in SONAR OS X Alpha. We're still collecting results, but it hasn't swayed much from 70% all day. Very different from your assumption of 2%.
 
Personally, I've been hearing "when will SONAR be released on a Mac?" directly from both Cakewalk customers and people who use competitor products for YEARS. I've heard it at tradeshows, on emails and phones in my support days, from my colleagues at my part-time job at Berklee (where everyone BUT me refused to use anything but a Mac). If I'm being honest, it started to become really tiresome because for so long we had zero agenda of ever making it a reality. In my circles, SONAR on Mac has been in high demand for years.
 
Anyhow, I could go on for a while with random anecdotes, but I just felt the need to point out a lot more then 2% of current Cakewalk customers are expressing interest. That is insanely off the mark with what our users are and have been telling us.
 
Edit: typos

I don't doubt your reported ~70% but being a statistician I DO DOUBT your survey method and the population sampled, sorry.
 
Sonar/CW is NOT a Mac product, per se, yet your numbers indicate that of the population, of PRIMARILY PC users of Sonar, that THAT 70% want a Mac version?   Really?
 
You can't ask the same 1000 Mac users over and over (in the studio mix booth, on the floor at conventions, etc.) and call that an increased sample (even in bootstrap sampling that's a foul).
 
I would suggest that your circle, not to mention  SAMPLE, sounds a little statistically biased. 
 
 

Ryan meant that 70% of the people who responded to the form on this page were interested in the Mac version. Not 70% of our user base. 
 
>>I would suggest that your circle, not to mention  SAMPLE, sounds a little statistically biased. 
Not really. Its well known that there has been a large bias towards Mac in the music and art community as well as educational institutions that teach music and the fine arts. Ryan was quoting his experience at Berklee where until recently you couldn't even participate in their music programs without having a Mac.
I'm not arguing about the validity of this (we're have been a Windows company forever) but it is a reality. 

SilkTone
 
We were told that the June 1 announcement will affect all current users, hence my comment that the Mac version ended up not affecting many current SONAR users. How many of those users want a Mac version? I can't believe that it could possibly be as high as 70%.
 

The Mac announcement was 1/3 of the full announcement. A big parts of the announcement was lifetime updates. This info was intended for a small set of users but was leaked earlier despite clear instructions that this was only intended for them. We can't control the internet unfortunately :).
Anyway keep that in mind looking at it as a whole.

I don't understand why some people are so unhappy about mac version. why we shouldn't see one day that most of the studios are using sonar instead of logic or protools or the other DAWs. I think it was a big jump for company and  also for us in the near future. I know each company stay on their feet by supporting their clients, but we shouldn't forget we also stand on our feet in this industry by what ever these companies bring for us. based on what ever i paid during this last 20 years to cakewalk i earned much much more from it( technology and money). and I am sure each of us that stick with cakewalk for long time, it is not because we are idiot, because we know sonar as a user friendly and powerful DAW that always is beyond the other DAWs. I am sure very soon most of the other companies will test their products with sonar first before protools or logic. I know it takes time but it will. unless the other companies provide more features.
Cakewalk has not stop and I think it is just a new start with a new recipe. :)
Thanks CAKEWALK

Photo_G
Thanks Rocsee70, but that doesn't tell us what the right "SKU" is, so we don't make a mistake...whether buying from JRR or any other distributer.  For example, the name of the product directly from Cakewalk appears to be "SONAR Platinum (with Lifetime Updates)", but I don't see that name listed on any other web site....and I'm not sure that's considered a SKU anyway.

 
FYI, the new SKUs are there. If you follow the link from their June Deals mail it now shows you the same SKUs as what you can see in the Cakewalk Store or e.g. at Sweetwater's. There is no mention about Lifetime though, but it's clear from the wordings that it's those new SKUs. Also, I'm not getting the automatic discount they mention in their mail. I guess in replacing the SKUs, they forgot to also apply the auto-discount.
I dropped them a note on both Lifetime and auto-discount.
 
Link: https://www.jrrshop.com/c...p;order=news_from_date
 

I think it's pretty big of the Bakers to get on here and take care of the straight up tantrums that people are throwing over the Mac version news. I really don't think they're on the hook if 1/3 of the news announcement isn't "big enough" for some people.
 

Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]

SilkTone
 
SONAR on Mac is great news for about 2% of CW's current users. 

FWIW - the current survey results suggests 70% of people are interested in SONAR OS X Alpha. We're still collecting results, but it hasn't swayed much from 70% all day. Very different from your assumption of 2%.
 

 All power to Cakewalk's foray into macland, but that is some seriously flawed methodology you've got there Ryan. You are one skewed bell curve away from denying climate change

Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
The Mac announcement was 1/3 of the full announcement. A big parts of the announcement was lifetime updates. This info was intended for a small set of users but was leaked earlier despite clear instructions that this was only intended for them. We can't control the internet unfortunately :).

1/3 Mac -- this is a mixed bag for existing users.  Some want to go directly to Mac ASAP.  Many never want anything to do with Apple and are concerned that over time, your emphasis will drift to Mac.  Indeed, if the Mac market turns out to be as lucrative as indicated by the exuberance of some of the Cakewalk folks, that might be the best business decision.
 
1/3 lifetime updates -- We all know if something seems too good to be true, it probably is.  By coupling this with the Mac thing, the feeling of eventual abandonment is unavoidable.  I believe that was a marketing mistake, but it is what it is and everyone has no choice but to go on.
 
1/3 2016 enhancements -- Looks like nice stuff, but business as usual.  These are mostly features that are available in one or more other DAWs, so you have a competitive interest in bringing these things forward.   With the lifetime deal, you are asking for us to prepay for 2017 enhancements, after all.  We don't break even until we get 2018 enhancements. 
 
I am not unhappy.  I am simply trying to explain why the reaction has been different from what you might have had in mind.