Chevy
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not solved: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip
Hi, been trying to get some support from Melodyne, but the person there just doesn't seem to be of much help at all. Very frustrating. Anyways.... The problem is, when I take a bass guitar 2-bar clip and correct the timing with Melodyne, Region FX, then do a "save" on the file, then try to paste the same clip into the next 2 bars on the same track, the Melodyne changes do not appear in the newly pasted clip. The newly pasted clip header does indeed say <Melodyne> on it, but the changes are not carried over to it. This is exasperating, as it means I have to alter every single clip in the song, can't just copy them over. Anyone experience this ?
post edited by Chevy - 2015/01/14 13:19:55
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mettelus
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Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e; W7pro,64, quad
2015/01/09 00:41:48
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Melodyne can have some flaky behavior to it, and getting too heavy-handed with edits can cause issues as well. Are you trying to repeat a 2-bar pattern for a longer duration? If so, I would be more apt to do the edits to taste, then "Bounce to Clip(s)" to embed the edits (right click the clip), next I would enable "Groove-Clip Looping" (also right click) and can drag the right edge to repeat as many times as you want. You can also Bounce to Clip(s) after you have the desired duration to create one clip from this. Melodyne is best-suited for surgical functions on small regions where an edit is made and then bounced. Excessive editing can be problematic, but I am not sure about copying Region FX specifically.
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Anderton
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Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e; W7pro,64, quad
2015/01/09 02:54:16
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I think you need to bounce to clip before copying. Melodyne is meant to work within a specific region, hence, Region FX. If you change where the clip resides, that changes the region. I don't know for sure if this is your issue, but there are other limitations to clips that are open in Melodyne...for example, you can't split the clip. When working with Melodyne I generally make my changes, then bounce. Once the clip is fixed, I don't see any reason to keep Melodyne open. If I think I may want to re-visit the changes, I work on a copy and archive the copy...but I very rarely do that.
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Chevy
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SOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/09 12:23:47
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OK, thanks for the tips and sorry to exhibit the newbie frustration... my thinking on the whole thing was that every time you bounce a clip, the audio quality level reduces, and that's not a good thing.
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Anderton
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Re: SOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/09 12:37:00
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Chevy OK, thanks for the tips and sorry to exhibit the newbie frustration... my thinking on the whole thing was that every time you bounce a clip, the audio quality level reduces, and that's not a good thing.
No worries, even though you are the first person ever to exhibit newbie frustration  But seriously, bouncing with a 64-bit audio engine is not like bouncing with tape. You can bounce all week and there's enough resolution to maintain the original sound quality. I sometimes bounce a Melodyne clip, then go in and do additional edits and re-bounce.
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Chevy
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Re: SOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/10 13:36:30
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Hi again, Thanks for the tips again, but have new problem... when I right click on and bounce the Melodyne'd clip, the audio waveform comes back as a flat line. When I remove the Region FX, then bounce it, it comes back properly as an audio waveform... what is happening here, any ideas ? I also tried to bounce it onto a new track, and the audio came back as a flat line as well....??????? Also, I tried to bounce a drum clip just for fun in a different project, and it came back visually altered from the original... so this again has me worried about bouncing and degrading audio quality. My Sonar is set up as 64 bit engine, 32 bit record/playback.
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mettelus
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Re: SOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/10 18:01:54
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Pay close attention to the pop-up that comes up with options for bouncing to clip(s) (there are many options on that pop-up you really need to read through and understand), as the checked items get embedded into the bounce. If you have Track mute/solo checked and that track is muted, the bounce will be a flat line (only time I have seen this). Sometimes SONAR does not show the wave form, and there is an option to redraw that (not sure where off the top of my head), but it is just a visual indicator (the audio will still play). It is more probable that you have embedded things you did not intend to into the audio bounce - but as always with music - trust your ears, not your eyes. As Craig said, digital rendering does not degrade audio as analog does, which is a massive advantage to using a DAW. I have also bounced a track multiple times, and the difference is in the processing precision of plugins used in most cases, which is incredibly accurate compared to analog (because they are working with "just numbers").
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Anderton
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Re: SOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/10 19:05:59
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Also note that it might be in a Take Lane and muted within that lane.
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Chevy
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not SOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/11 13:29:08
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Hmmm... no joy. I'm testing this in as simple as possible a configuration: I have a new project with only one unmuted track, containing a couple of clips that have been Melodyne'd. I select one clip by right-clicking, and get the option to bounce it or edit or convert to stereo, etc. on the pop-up. When I click on Bounce to Clip(s), it just goes and bounces to clip, no options at all. And the audio comes back flat-line, and no sound. When I remove Region FX, it bounces it just fine. ...................?????????????????????? Not using Take Lanes.
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Anderton
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Re: not SOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/11 14:27:05
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Try shift-dragging it into a new track and see what happens. I've had the same thing happen, but it was always something I wasn't taking into account, like what I mentioned above.
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Chevy
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unSOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/12 16:01:52
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I've re-downloaded my entire Sonar Studio X3e and Melodyne Essentials and reinstalled them, and same problem. These problems make Melodyne and actually Sonar X3 useless to me... I tried again on a brand new project, a single track, unmuted, and these are the results: 1) When I Melodyne a clip, then save it, it works ok by itself. If I then try to paste it, it doesn't pass over the Melodyne changes to the pasted clip. If I close the project and open it up again, the changes then show up on the newly pasted clip. 2) When I right click on a Melodyne'd clip and select Bounce to Clip(s), the software does its thing, and the clip is rendered flat-line, without any audible audio on playback. The audio is squashed down to a flat line. So I can't bounce the Melodyne changes and use them that way. (Note that I can take a clip without Melodyne changes on it, and it Bounces just fine, no problem).
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Anderton
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Re: unSOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/12 16:38:43
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What happens if you do what I suggested in Post #10? I am trying to get some diagnostics here...I've bounced Melodyne tracks literally hundreds of times, but I don't know enough about what is going on with your project. For example when you say you "save" the clip, do you mean save the project? And if so, is Melodyne still open or is it closed? Remember that Melodyne processing is not like a standard audio effect, it works on a region. There are many things you can't do while it's open (e.g., split a clip) because it's actively working on the clip, and therefore you can't modify the clip. Also, show the Take Lanes for the track to see what's going on there. You mention it's a single track, but you don't say if it was just a single recording, or whether you recorded more than one pass or overdub in that track. The only time I can get Melodyne to flat line is under conditions involving a muted or soloed Take Lane. This forum is filled with people who have been able to bounce Melodyne clips. But remember there have been many examples in this forum of a problem not being solved until someone mentions something they thought was not significant, but then turns out to be the source of the difficulty. If you have Dropbox or some other place where you can upload the file, do so and either PM the link or post it here. If you don't have Dropbox or whatever, then you can go to www.hightail.com and send the project to yourself. That will give you a download link that you can PM to me or post here, then I can download the project and see what's happening. What you are experiencing is not normal. You could also try contacting tech support.
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Chevy
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Re: unSOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/13 13:04:49
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Yes, this is driving me nuts. Obviously it's an industry standard, and how can I be the only one with this problem ? I gotta be missing an option or something somewhere... thanks so much for your patience... being a newb, just discovered take lanes... looked at them, and nothing there is muted. Sorry, I initially responded about post #10, then overwrote it in an edit... but that shift dragging didn't do anything different. I've pared it down to the most simple situation possible: copied a short audio drum loop clip into a single unmuted track on a brand new project. Melodyne'd the clip, saved the project (tried Melodyne both opened and closed), copied and pasted the clip into the same track, next to the original. Saved the project again, closed it, opened it, and that is all I did. That is how I got to post #11. NOW... check this out... on this new project, now everything works as it should... no bugs as described above... at first it didn't, because I didn't set up the INPUT (it defaulted to NONE on that track when I started the new test project). The Bounce resulted in a flat line audio. (Exactly the same type of response as on the full project). Then, changing the INPUT to left channel of my Scarlett interface, it all worked as it should! No problems. So I got excited.... Then.... checking this option out on my full project, I had the Scarlett input selected, and the problem was still there. At least I was able to duplicate the problem, if not solve it. At the request of Melodyne support, about a week or so ago, I started a whole new project, copying over existing tracks, to see if it would resolve the problem. No dice. Will keep digging. On this project I have so much data, it's huge, don't know if it can be uploaded, will have to investigate further. But there's gotta be some option I'm missing; I've duplicated the problem with the input field selected to NONE. UPDATE: Aaargh... don't know why I didn't think of it before... I tried bouncing other vocal tracks on the same project, and no problem ! It actually works... my gosh, what a dufus... That one bass track has been giving me all this grief. Nothing muted on take lanes, INPUT and OUTPUT selected properly, but no joy. Don't know why, but this certainly narrows things down...
post edited by Chevy - 2015/01/13 13:28:39
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mettelus
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Re: unSOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/13 18:11:01
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As this seems to be only the bass track, is there anything "special" about that track? Is that audio data or MIDI into a soft synth?
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Chevy
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Re: unSOLVED Re: Melodyne Essentials; problem saving changes to new clip; Sonar X3e;
2015/01/13 20:36:07
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Take Lanes... ! That's the problem... No muting on the Take Lanes or anything else that I can find wrong, as in incorrect inputs or outputs... just the fact that the take lanes are on that track, for some reason, just can't get Melodyne to work on that track. Asked Melodyne support about it, and oddly enough, they don't seem to be familiar with Take Lanes. Perhaps somehow that track got corrupted... needs further investigation. So Anderton, you nailed it ! I still would've been scratching me 'ead about this without that tip !!! Thanks much ! I will have to try another new project to further investigate, but at least I'm in business for now.
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