T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Wed, 16 Jan 2019 22:06:52 GMT

Thanks, I'll give that a try.

Are you in the new forum? This one is closing today, just wondering if you're already registered there under the same name?

Fyi, I'm there already, but my screen name there is slightly different.... Musikman1

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (chris.r)

Tue, 15 Jan 2019 09:56:07 GMT

maybe try to uncheck 'Enable' in the ACT window and/or in Preferences>Control Surfaces

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Mon, 14 Jan 2019 19:49:50 GMT

It's the only thing I can think of. I haven't tried doing that yet, is there a way to disable it without completely removing/deleting it altogether?

I'd just rather not have to set it all back up again now that it's working with the rotary switch, unless absolutely necessary.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (chris.r)

Sun, 13 Jan 2019 04:00:38 GMT

Musikman
maybe has something to do with the ACT setup I used?

that would be my guess, have you tried to disable it and see what happens?

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Fri, 11 Jan 2019 22:58:40 GMT

Ok this is strange, now that I have the Leslie working, my Modwheel is not working at all with any of the other VSTi, tried with Lounge Lizard and some presets in DimPro including a couple of Lead sounds that should respond to the wheel, nothing at all. Doesn't even work in a separate, brand new project that doesn't include the Leslie plugin. Strange!...anyone? Must be missing something here, maybe has something to do with the ACT setup I used?

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Wed, 09 Jan 2019 23:06:12 GMT

Ahh...Kirk Franklin, I am familiar! Nice. Yeah that's a stock Gospel B3 for sure.

Something strange, until now I haven't actually tried recording with the Leslie, and when I did just now, it seems the automation for the rotary switch/FX isn't getting recorded. So when I play back the recording there's no Rotary FX in the places I flipped the switch to Fast, it just plays as if I never touched the modwheel at all. I checked to make sure Automation Read and Write were enabled on the plugin window, still nothing.

The only thing I can think of is it's either I have to try switching the configuration to "configure as synth", or maybe the Midi Event filter I have on DimPro B3 organ preset that I used to cancel out the DimPro modwheel data signal is somehow affecting things. Not sure on this one.

**UPDATE: I just tried using the VST2 version instead of VST3, and that seems to work consistently. The Automation Read and Automation Write must be on, and as Simeon mentioned earlier, the Leslie also has to be in focus during recording. I also see that written Automation graph shows up over the track whenever the Rotary Switch was used. I was also able to bounce the track to audio, and it keeps the Rotary effect in tact in the mixdown. I have not tested this extensively but so far I've had success with it.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (chris.r)

Wed, 09 Jan 2019 22:43:39 GMT

nice drive!

here's what I'm reaching for when it comes to B-3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggWBQzvWPuI
Bobby Sparx is a genius

Edit: Oh I see you edited your post too ;)
https://youtu.be/j0NFiSDvVzU?t=85

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Wed, 09 Jan 2019 22:16:22 GMT

sounds pretty good, listened to some of the demos, I like the price too, not outrageous. Here's a good tune with B-3/Leslie, funky grooves from Down To The Bone. A lot of their stuff is great if you're going for a drive, one of my favorite driving music bands. Check it out...

Yo Mama So Phat - DTTB
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnaB3heRc60

This one's good too, not a lot of B3 just good driving music...
Music Is My Drug - DTTB
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnQbd9RNN90

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (chris.r)

Wed, 09 Jan 2019 22:10:40 GMT

Musikman
I looked briefly at that "Spin" leslie, looks pretty cool. I thought it was kinda strange that they included a "Stop" position, but more so that they put Stop smack in the middle of Fast and Slow. Don't know how user friendly that would be with a ModWheel. What if you have a ModWheel that automatically springs back to the off position, and can't stop it in the middle of the arc? Just at first glace that didn't seem very practical.

What you describe is a mode for bender-lever only (a joystick). I don't recall any other software leslie is (or was at the time of releasing Spin) able to do the same. That's a brilliant way of controlling speed, that seem closest to the real thing - you nugde the lever right (bender) for fast or left for slow, just like the real half-moon switch! For special case if you want to stop, you push it far forward (modulation) but of course that will be used occasionally, that's why the "dead" area. Beside that there are tons of other options for controlling the whole system including your own MIDI Learn. Modwheel is no any problem. Above all that, what matters is the sound... mmm... select Custom leslie and listen :)

and no cpu hit at all.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Wed, 09 Jan 2019 21:38:36 GMT

yeah, finally got it going! I agree, not something they should have omitted, even harder to believe given they teamed up with Hammond themselves to produce it! Gotta give them credit for how it sounds though, closest thing I've ever heard to the real Leslie, and blows away any rotary effect that I've heard in any VST organ patch.

I looked briefly at that "Spin" leslie, looks pretty cool. I thought it was kinda strange that they included a "Stop" position, but more so that they put Stop smack in the middle of Fast and Slow. Don't know how user friendly that would be with a ModWheel. What if you have a ModWheel that automatically springs back to the off position, and can't stop it in the middle of the arc? Just at first glace that didn't seem very practical.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (chris.r)

Wed, 09 Jan 2019 01:47:29 GMT

Glad to hear you made it to work! I was following this thread as I'm interested in this leslie and wanted to see it working in Sonar/CakeLab. That they (IKM) foozled such fundamental thing like MIDI control is beyond my imagination.

There's another leslie called Spin worth taking a look www.gg-audio.com. It's included when you buy Blue3 organ or you can buy it separately and it sounds amazing. It's also very easy to control, I mean veeery easy. It's my favorite. Cheers!

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Tue, 08 Jan 2019 22:35:33 GMT

Sure Grem, no problem. Sorry it took awhile, was a tricky bugger to figure out! Hopefully Simeon will have the updated video in the near future as well.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Grem)

Tue, 08 Jan 2019 22:25:21 GMT

Thanks for taking the time to come back and post an update, really helps.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Tue, 08 Jan 2019 22:13:40 GMT

Just wanted to update.....Since my last post here I had gotten in touch with Simeon and he helped me to work through this, finally got it working. It was a little tricky getting there, but it works now. Adding a Generic CW Control Surface didn't seem to get any response at all, but adding the ACT MIDI controller was what ultimately did work. You all had me on the right track, I just couldn't finish the task. When Simeon and I were going through this step by step, the thing that seemed to get me stuck was finding the correct parameter for the rotary switch in the ACT window. At first it seemed like it wasn't there, because there was a Slow/Fast controller parameter, but when I tried clicking on that one it wouldn't stay on MIDI Learn. I'd see the words change to "MIDI Learn" for a second or two, but before I could do anything it would bounce right back to reading "Slow/Fast".

Simeon somehow knew to ask me to look for a controller that said just "Slow". I didn't see one at first, but then I noticed there were more Banks to the left in a dropdown. So once I checked the other banks I found it in Bank #4. When I clicked on that control parameter, it still only seemed to want to give me seconds to move and automate the rotary switch to the Modwheel, but somehow it finally worked! Thanks to Simeon for the one on one help, and thanks to all of you here for setting me straight on this, much appreciated, and I couldn't have done it without all of you. I have a feeling the rotary switch will not be able to be automated in the Stand-Alone version of Leslie, but at least we've got it going in Sonar!

I believe Simeon said he is going to update the video he had posted in #33 to now include what we discovered in the process. I don't know if he'll re-post it here, but if not I will post the link once I get it. Thanks again to all who gave of their time and knowledge.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (chris.r)

Sat, 05 Jan 2019 03:04:45 GMT

Musikman
I went into Control Surfaces in Preferences and no drop down list is there??

click the yellow star and then choose ACT to create new position on the list, next select your MIDI I/O ports (by clicking the black small triangle), now you should be able to open the ACT window from Sonar's menu

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Sat, 05 Jan 2019 02:23:41 GMT

Thanks Simeon, I will watch the video, much appreciate your taking the time to do that! I"m sure it will help others as well who are dealing with this issue.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (simeon)

Sat, 05 Jan 2019 00:04:00 GMT

Here is a short demo I just put together to hopefully shed some more light on this.
It is unlisted (I might work on doing another polished one later).
Let me know if it helps.
Here you go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_QVYYk28O8

Some things to remember:
T-Racks Leslie must be in focus for the ACT control to work.
The switch is more of a TOGGLE and not necessarily based on a continuous controller.

Best regards,
Simeon

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Fri, 04 Jan 2019 23:00:35 GMT

I went into Control Surfaces in Preferences and no drop down list is there?? I'm gonna need someone to give me a detailed walkthrough on this if possible, I just don't know enough about MIDI to fake my way through this. If anyone can oblige I'd appreciate it, in the meantime I'm gonna watch a Cakewalk ACT video and Simeon's video again to see if I can pick up on what to do, then check back here later on. Thanks

BTW, can anyone tell me what I have to do to post a screenshot here? I tried pasting it from the clipboard but it wouldn't allow me to complete the post that way. I don't have a way to use an image link, I don't belong to photo server anymore.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Fri, 04 Jan 2019 04:41:17 GMT

Hi Simeon, yes yours was the video where I spotted the use of ACT with the Leslie plugin. I didn't even think to try to contact you here, I also very much enjoyed your video, thank you for joining us in this thread. I'm beginning to have a little hope at this point that this will eventually get done! In your video a couple of the menu items and numbers in the steps you were showing using ACT were a little out of focus on my screen, so I couldn't see everything you were doing 100% clearly but enough to get the basic idea. As Chris mentioned, I couldn't tell either if you were using VST2 or VST3.

Thanks for the run through Chris, I appreciate it. Yes I checked and the speed control is set to = 1. I wouldn't know if you missed any steps, but it does sound like the way to set up ACT according to the brief couple of YT videos I watched. When I watched Simeon's video I looked for that pull down menu item for ACT but I didn't see it in my Sonar. Now I know it's because it has to first be added in, didn't realize that before, the fog is beginning to lift. Simeon, if you have any additional info to add feel free to post, all is helpful!

Again, it is unfamiliar territory for me guys, so I may be a little slow in grasping all this, but I'm sure I'll get it. Unfortunately as excited as I am to hopefully finally get this wrapped up, I won't have time tonight, I have an appointment with a surgeon tomorrow morning (not fun!), but will get right back to it in the afternoon and post results (or questions) here.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (chris.r)

Fri, 04 Jan 2019 01:17:37 GMT

Musikman
What setup page are you referring to? Where?

here:

Musikman
In the Plugin itself, there is a gear icon and it does bring up a popup window for Midi Settings, but the only settings in there are: Speed Control Change = 1, and Brake Control Change = 64. Next to both of them is a “Latch” button. I think I tried using that too, but didn't change anything.

so just make sure the Speed Control Change = 1 if you are going to control it with your mod wheel

Musikman
...never done it before, and tbh I will have to spend some time reading and watching videos on how it works and how to set it up properly

Alright I've done this already some time ago and I might forgot some steps, but from the top of my head, I had to go to Sonar preferences and there add ACT to the Control Surface list (probably setup MIDI driver there). Then open ACT window from Sonar menu > Utilities and there click Enable on the bottom left. Now if you open leslie gui, you should be able to do MIDI learn: in ACT window click on the speed cell (R2) then move your modweel. If I didn't miss anything you should be able to toggle the speed now.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (chris.r)

Fri, 04 Jan 2019 00:27:25 GMT

Hi Simeon! I much enjoyed your leslie walkthrough and the bandlab blues! :D

One question, which version did you use for that walkthrough - VST2 or VST3? Or it doesn't matter? Thanks!

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (simeon)

Thu, 03 Jan 2019 23:36:35 GMT

Hey guys,
I did a review and walkthrough of the Leslie plugin here:
https://youtu.be/rvFr32F2JBw

There is a section of the video where I show how I worked around the Leslie speaker Speed issue around 16 or 17 minutes into the video.
Hope you find it helpful?

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Thu, 03 Jan 2019 23:06:11 GMT

Thanks chris.r.........Well I at least updated my support ticket with IKM just in case, letting them know the procedure we just tried out, just so they know that it's not an issue with Sonar. In the IKM thread link I posted in #3, the problem is the users there are not using Sonar, I think they are using Cubase and another DAW I can't remember which. The guy in the YT video I posted here in #9 seemed to have it working in Sonar using ACT, hard to tell in that video how he did it, he only shows it briefly around 17:00 into the video.

chris.r
IKM usually don't offer MIDI Learn pop-up menu. All MIDI settings are done on the setup page...

What setup page are you referring to? Where? (Forgive my lack of knowledge, I mostly work with audio, so I'm not that familiar with the inner workings of MIDI in Sonar, only because other than basic stuff I don't often need to get in depth with it.)

I did a test record, moving the switch with just the mouse, and it does register in the Automation lane in the track. I don't have time right now, but I'll have to try to learn how to use ACT, never done it before, and tbh I will have to spend some time reading and watching videos on how it works and how to set it up properly.... I'm not gonna ask you to teach it to me, unless it's only a couple of quick steps and you have the time to post it here. Gotta get to an appointment, but I'll be back around here later. Thanks again, much appreciate the help!

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (chris.r)

Thu, 03 Jan 2019 22:41:01 GMT

Musikman
...when I right clicked on the Leslie to get the Learn Global MIDI option, I didn't even get the popup box, nothing at all. When I tried just right clicking the rotary switch, it just moved the switch from slow to fast. Both left and right click just move the switch, no learn midi option. So what does that mean?

IKM typically don't offer MIDI Learn pop-up menu in t-racks modules. All MIDI settings are done on the setup page, make sure you left toggle slow/fast with CC#1 untouched.

I keep wondering how that guy in the YT video got his to work with ACT....I'll have to watch that again to see if I can pick up on what he's done there. It's only a small part of the video and the menu items he uses the text is kinda blurry, but I'll look at it again. I did watch a video or two on setting up ACT, looks to be a bit more complicated than the method we just tried.

I'm pretty sure it's doable, if the slow/fast parameter is showing up as an automation in your track then no reason you can't control it with ACT.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Thu, 03 Jan 2019 21:52:36 GMT

I know, that's ok, I appreciate your trying to help me solve this, it may turn out it can't be solved anyway. I checked my ticket and IKM has not responded yet. I did notice in that thread in the IKM forum, someone mentioned that the Amplitube version of the Leslie worked ok, but not the T-Racks version that I have. Also, from looking at a couple videos just now on how to setup ACT it looks a bit more complicated, but I guess there no guarantee that would even work.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (scook)

Thu, 03 Jan 2019 21:47:18 GMT

Not all plug-ins manufacturers implement MIDI the same way. I can only help with routing in general. The TH3 experiment was to confirm you could get MIDI data to any FX plug-in. I cannot help you with IKM specific questions.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Thu, 03 Jan 2019 21:38:00 GMT

Ok I tried the experiment with the TH3 in a brand new default project. Didn't work at first, but I think I moved the modwheel too many times, then just tried moving it once and then it worked. Good to know I can do that in the future, thanks!

However, I tried that same procedure with both Leslie VST2 and VST3, neither worked. In fact when I right clicked on the Leslie to get the Learn Global MIDI option, I didn't even get the popup box, nothing at all. When I tried just right clicking the rotary switch, it just moved the switch from slow to fast. Both left and right click just move the switch, no learn midi option. So what does that mean?

I keep wondering how that guy in the YT video got his to work with ACT....I'll have to watch that again to see if I can pick up on what he's done there. It's only a small part of the video and the menu items he uses the text is kinda blurry, but I'll look at it again. I did watch a video or two on setting up ACT, looks to be a bit more complicated than the method we just tried.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (scook)

Thu, 03 Jan 2019 04:10:03 GMT

I picked a simple example so the basic routing can be confirmed with a plug-in known to work.

Different plug-ins have different ways to set up MIDI. From the description in msg #16 the leslie has a predefined CC
config. Do not expect the instruction supplied for TH3 to work for IKM products, however; the method of connecting a controller via a MIDI track to an effect plug-in is the same for all plug-ins that use MIDI data to control features.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (Musikman)

Thu, 03 Jan 2019 03:51:11 GMT

scook
Add a MIDI track w/ input set to your controller, output to TH3, enable input echo

When I added a MIDI track like this for the Leslie last time, I looked at the options for input to set it to my controller and it gave me drop-down options of "Omni", and "1 thru 16". When I tried Chan 1 I got no sound so I set it for Omni. I assume that Omni is the correct setting? Also, with Input Echo on that track, I think it was set to "Auto-Thru" but must have been still working cuz I had sound. I did change that to "On" last time you mentioned it but that didn't seem to change anything, I got sound on both those settings.

I may get to this tonight, but more likely won't get to trying this out until morning. I'll get back to you when I do, thanks scook. Looks like a simple test, one other question...the Cry Baby would be a little different than the Leslie, in that it's just a wah pedal, so there's only one thing to control on it, whereas the Leslie has the Rotary Switch, and some other sliders and switches as well. So when I try this method on the Leslie, do I just right click anywhere, or right click on just the Rotary Switch?

This seems similar to the instructions for ACT, but we're not using the ACT button at the top menu of the plugin, so I assume this isn't the ACT method.

Re: T-Racks Leslie plugin not working with my controller's ModWheel (scook)

Wed, 02 Jan 2019 22:43:49 GMT

To test if the problem lies in the plug-in, try a plug-in known to work.

For example, TH3 has MIDI learn. Here is an easy test:
Drop it into an audio FX bin,
"Enable MIDI Input" in the VST3 drop down above the TH3 UI,
Add a MIDI track w/ input set to your controller, output to TH3, enable input echo
Drag a component from the right in TH3 into the TH3 workspace, I used the "Cry Maybe" pedal
right-click on the component and select "learn Global MIDI"
move the mod wheel back and forth on the controller
click OK on the TH3 MIDI learn dialog
the TH3 component should now react to the mod wheel.

To clear the setup in TH3:
click MIDI at the top of the TH3 UI
scroll down to the component (the Cry Mayby" is called Wah on this screen)
click CLEAR
click the X in the upper right of the MIDI options to close