dwaszoo
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session drummer -how do people create full drum tracks
How do people create full drum tracks usually ? you can get the basic groove with SD2 and then loop it. how about the fills etc and alternate patterns ?
do people add in manually using piano roll or play it with controller ?
I want to see what the easiest way is that people have found.
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planetearth
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Re:session drummer -how do people create full drum tracks
2010/10/18 12:58:32
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The smattering of loops that come with SD2 isn't terribly comprehensive. Smart Loops (the folks who made the loops that come with SD2) sells many other loops, including fills and percussion loops that you can add to the basic loops. Groove Monkee and other companies also offer fills and alternate patterns in their sets. I've tried using my keyboard to smack out a few fills or alternate patterns, but the keyboard really isn't great for playing with your hands. For best results, you need to play with your fingers, and if you're trying to play enthusiastically, "precision" is going to suffer. I've looked at the Alesis Control Pad as an inexpensive way to "play" the drum sounds I have. Roland and Yamaha make similar products, but the Alesis one is around $150, and you can play it with your hands, fingers or drum sticks. The Roland and Yamaha products are hundreds of dollars more, but they have drum samples where the Alesis is just a collection of pads, and they're probably better-made products. Some people here swear by using the PRV (piano roll view) to draw in the fills, and while I've done this on occasion, it isn't much fun, and you don't get that "live player" feeling when you're drawing notes on a screen. That's just my opinion, though.
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RobertB
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Re:session drummer -how do people create full drum tracks
2010/10/18 15:02:51
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"How do people create full drum tracks usually ? you can get the basic groove with SD2 and then loop it. how about the fills etc and alternate patterns ?"
Have you just looped one basic pattern, or have you tried using some or all of the 8 available patterns in a given program?
You can easily build a fairly interesting track, by piecing these together for basic grooves, fills, and turnarounds.
I like to let SD2 play, and hit the various patterns until I hear a combination I like.
Then highlight and drag the patterns into the appropriate sequence in the MIDI track.
If you have a long sequence that you would like to repeat, you can bounce that to a clip.
Then right click the clip, and enable Groove Clip Looping. This turns the whole thing into a new loop, which you can then drag out as far as you want.
That's the easiest way I have found.
You can always use the PRV to dress it up, add notes, change velocity, etc.
I tend to agree with planetearth on using the PRV to draw patterns in general. It just seems too mathematical.
But it is a great editing tool.
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dwaszoo
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Re:session drummer -how do people create full drum tracks
2010/10/18 19:39:49
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ah I was overlooking the obvious. I feel like I have read so much on this and am still asking questions.
also.......is there a knack to lining up the samples when you drag them to the track ? I set snap to grid and whole note as i read in scotts book but maybe this doesnt always work. do you line them up by eyeballing them ?
sorry if this is a stupid ?
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planetearth
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Re:session drummer -how do people create full drum tracks
2010/10/18 19:51:08
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☄ Helpful
Lining up the "samples"? Do you mean lining up the recorded clips/loops?
You can "snap-to-grid" for smaller amounts (such as a quarter-note), but you'll want to make sure your first measure starts at tick 1 of beat 1. If your first note is before what you want your first measure to be, then it will be difficult to line up the clips in track view.
For example, if you want your song to start at 2:01:000, make sure the first note is at 2:01:000 and not at 1:04:950 or something like that. The rest of the loop doesn't have to be quantized, but having the first note actually be on the first beat and tick is the easiest way I've found to line up clips in track view.
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RobertB
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Re:session drummer -how do people create full drum tracks
2010/10/18 19:56:05
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☄ Helpful
Not stupid at all.
Snap to grid is good when working with loops (which is what the patterns are). At the top of your track view, you will see markings that indicate measures, and beats within the measures. Generally, you will want to place the samples to start at a new measure. You can see the ends of a pattern (loop), by the clipped corners. For the most part, you will want to switch patterns at those points.
A loop does not have to complete, and you can come up with some interesting variations by inserting fills at different places. follow your ears on this sort of thing. Don't let the patterns overlap. Read the help files on slip edit and split. You can make room to insert fills in a steady groove.
Experiment. Once you get the hang of it, you can build an interesting drum track in literally minutes.
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dwaszoo
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Re:session drummer -how do people create full drum tracks
2010/10/19 14:23:37
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this is very helpful.
one more question. the fills dont always start right at clip beginning. what is the reason for this and is there a way to avoid it ?
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Fog
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Re:session drummer -how do people create full drum tracks
2010/10/19 16:00:34
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I'm guessing the fills don't start at the start due to the bias / emphasis being to the end of the loop.
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planetearth
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Re:session drummer -how do people create full drum tracks
2010/10/19 16:57:28
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Fog
I'm guessing the fills don't start at the start due to the bias / emphasis being to the end of the loop.
That would be my guess, too. Fills don't always take up a full measure, so there's no real reason for them to start at the beginning. If you're talking about a fill that should start at the beginning but seems to be a bit "off", it could be because the Smart Loops fills aren't excessively quantized, so they're not going to lock to the exact tick. If there's a fill in particular you're curious about, let me know what it is, and if I have it, I'll take a look at it for you.
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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