Nutty
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Drum Map vs Drum Track
What exactly is a drum map? I want to create a basic drum pattern basically used for timing at this point. Also, I've never really used piano roll view, so I don't know my way around it too well. When I open it up, it has a keyboard along the side. I forget, how do I change it to get drum sounds? Sorry, really useless at this one. Thanks. Annette
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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Robomusic
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 19:11:08
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A drum map tell the program which drum sound to play for what note on for instance the piano roll. the drum track, well it plays drums fer ya!
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 19:22:35
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Ah okay...so now I know what the map is...but how do I get them ol drums to show up in PRV..I just have the keyboard....I know Gregy told me a long time ago, but I forget. I just really want to try a song without having to rely on Band in a Box for my timing. The metronome isn't enough for me. I try really hard to watch the time bar...but it's doesn't do it for me either...I need serious timing help.. I can only concentrate on so many things at once....the chords, the words, the melody and then the timing.it's all too much.... Thanks. Annette
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 19:28:59
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What softsynth are you using for yours drums Annette?
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 19:37:30
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I was just going to use TTS-1. I have Studio Instruments and Session Drummer 2, but I'm embarrassed to say I don't know how to use them. But I would like to come up with a half decent drum track that will keep me on target and in rhythm..so if it is a bit more than a click track...that would be great! Thanks. Annette
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 19:39:47
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If you write a pattern in the PRV, you can play it back through any of them! I can run you through setting up a decent drum loop to record to using the TTS-1 if you like.
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 19:48:33
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Me like, me like. I have a song now I'm writing at 100 bpm. So, if I could set up the basics that would be great. For some reason PRV always scared me LOL...so I've relied on BB to get me through, which is not a bad thing. It is a great program for what it does,,. I just need to branch out a bit. Thanks Steve. Annette
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 19:56:29
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No problem Annette! Open up a new project in SONAR 8 and select Blank (no tracks/busses) as the layout. Insert the TTS-1, for this example use these settings: Let me know when you're there Annette. If I seem to be taking a long time to reply, don't panic - I'm doing screenshots on the fly!!
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RobertB
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 20:14:01
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I'm sure Steve will do a fine job of walking you through this, but as a footnote, you don't need to mess with drum maps with TTS-1. If you select the Preset Rhythm Bank in your MIDI track, it will be mapped for you. It doesn't matter which channel you select, but channel 10 is most conventional.
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 20:16:36
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Okay..I'm there... Annette
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 20:24:53
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He he - nice one Bob!! Yeah - with the TTS-1 open on the screen, hit the button at the top of Channel 10 and the Standard Drum Kit will be waiting there for you. Make sure you've got this: Now minimise the TTS-1 and the Synthrack.
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 20:33:44
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Okay...got it...I closed the synthrack too soon so I good get back to that view...so I had to start over I was always told to ignore it...now I see it might have a purpose!! Thanks...ready Thanks Bob. I heard that before about the map, but I couldn't remember the reason. Of course I heard that AFTER I did the lesson on it that made no sense to me at the time! Annette
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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RobertB
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 20:44:21
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The reason it works is because TTS-1 uses the General MIDI drum map. Since this is a sort of universal map, the key that triggers a kick drum will always be a kick drum, or snare, or what have you. Some drum devices have unique settings, and the idea of a drum map is to make sure the proper key is assigned to the proper drum. GM takes the guesswork out of it and you can use the standard map to simplify things.
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SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 20:44:58
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OK, now expand the MIDI track (2) and set 10: Cakewalk TTS-1 in the Channel ( CH) dropdown options: Now make certain that the MIDI track (2) is highlighted and not Track 1 - also be sure the Now Time Marker is at the start of your project. Now click on the PRV icon - use the horizontal zoom control so that about two measures almost fill up your screen. The Time Ruler is displayed the same as it is in the Track View: Now, if all's well - try using your mouse to click on different piano keys - you should be hearing some drums!!
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 21:01:47
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I wasn't getting any sound at first, but then i just started banging around and then hit one! So, I'm suspecting not all "keys" have drum sound associated with them? Is there a map somewhere? Thanks for your help Steve. Now, I hopefully can put something useful together. I think I recall that you have to use the paint brush tool to enter the 'hits".. can I use the keys from my Axiom controller keyboard? I don't have the pads set up yet. Annette
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 21:03:08
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Good stuff - now here's the trick! Now right click on any part of the keyboard - in the window that appears, check the radio dial next to Use these Note Names Instead From the drop-down list, choose General MIDI Drums Now when you hit OK you should see a list of all the percussion instruments instead of the keys:
post edited by SteveStrummerUK - 2009/02/02 21:08:16
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RobertB
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 21:14:17
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It may not be immediately obvious, but what Steve just did was tell the software to use the GM drum map. Pretty cool, huh?
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 21:15:28
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Ah, I was a little slow on that one..couldn't find a radio dial...but then you would have needed to tell me which was my right and which was my left!!! It's been a long day!!!! Thanks...i'm with ya!
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 21:33:10
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Won't be long Annette!! Right - let's make a drum loop! OK, for this exercise: * Set the Snap to Grid to Eighth * Set the note length from the toolbar to Sixteenth If it isn't already selected, click on the PRV Draw Tool At the resolution we're working at, you should see the first measure divided into four sections. Use the Draw Tool and left click at the start of the measure in the Acoustic Bass Drum row - it will insert a block of colour repersenting the striking of the bass drum and you should also hear the sound. Don't worry if you get it wrong - they can be moved around and resituated using drag and drop - personally, Ctrl+Z (Undo) is just as useful! (You can also remove notes at any time using the Erase Tool). Copy my pattern and enter the five drum strikes - as you can see there are 3 on the kick drum and two on the Acoustic Snare: If you're with me so far, you're almost there
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SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 21:48:37
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Now close the PRV to get back to the Track View, you should see the MIDI data you've entered displayed in the MIDI track: Click Play and you'll hear the measure. To use this right through your project to record to, right click on the MIDI track and select Groove-Clip Looping: Now hover the mouse pointer over the right hand edge of your newly created loop and an icon will appear (a box with a double headed arrow on the left side) - now left click and drag across to the right - your loop will be copied through your project for as long as you drag!!
post edited by SteveStrummerUK - 2009/02/02 21:53:58
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 21:52:49
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Be with you shortly...kids are going off to bed...
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 21:55:14
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ORIGINAL: Nutty Be with you shortly...kids are going off to bed... I'm away to my bed too now Annette. If you get any probs, Bob's still about! Hope this gets you going though - Goodnight
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57Gregy
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 22:05:01
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Good job, Steve. Annette, I used to use the brush tool, set my note resolution and drag the cursor out to the right side of the window. When I got to the edge of the window, the screen will start moving beneath the cursor allowing you to drag the brush as far as you want. That was before I discovered groove-clip looping (pretty recently, I'm embarrassed to write). It's much easier to make a short clip like Steve described, convert it to a groove clip and drag that thing out as far as you want.
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 22:23:47
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Sorry about that. I thought I did everything right, but I have no sound. I set up the midi track as I would for any other project, but still not sound. Annette
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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RobertB
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 22:24:49
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Nicely done, Steve. Yes, once the basic loop is built you can drag it out. You can also alter certain measures in the PRV if you so desire. You can use the pattern brush, or the pencil tool. This sort of thing reveals the real power of MIDI. You can lay down a basic track, and elaborate on it at will. Get the basics down, and run with it.
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RobertB
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 22:26:28
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Uh Oh. What is your MIDI track output set to? At what point did you lose sound?
post edited by RobertB - 2009/02/02 22:37:05
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 22:48:24
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I'm not sure....I may never have had it. I just set it up to play from TTS=1 to the rhythm preset...standard set.
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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57Gregy
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 22:51:15
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Yeah, the MIDI track still has to have an output selected, and make sure you didn't use the User Preset. If it's set up right, you should hear the drum beats as you click them in.
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 22:54:58
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Something squirrelly has happened to my view...I tried using the + and - tools, cut I can't get the view back? Help!
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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Nutty
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RE: Drum Map vs Drum Track
2009/02/02 22:56:38
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ORIGINAL: 57Gregy and make sure you didn't use the User Preset. Oh, so what do I use? I know this will be easy once I get through it once right? Thanks. Annette
Nutty /Annette http://www.soundclick.com/atmmusic Using: Sonar 8 Studio; Band in a Box; PreSonus Firebox; M-Audio Axiom 25; Mics: Audio Technica ATM610, MXL 990/991; M-Audio Studiophile AV 30 Reference Speakers and many guitars
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