ORIGINAL: TomN

Okay, I don't really get the Midi thing and the actually physcial process of using these midi loops.

First off, the midi won't work with GTP3 right? So I need something else. Is this something else going to be a whole new recording program that I have to learn from scratch?

Yes Tom, you're correct, MIDI will not work with GT3 - you will need a program with MIDI capability.

ORIGINAL: TomN

And them, how do I actually make the loops, edit the loops, rearrange the beats and measures of the loop? And where do I do this?
Am I doing from inside the environment of the new midi capable DAW? For instance, will I select a track(s) for the drums and put the Drum Software (Like EZdrummer) in the effects bin or something. Then open up the EZDrummer like I would an effect in GTP3? Then edit the patterns from there. And then what? Do I need to insert anything or will the track just trigger the drum software to play the measures and song I just did?
Or do I open and use the EZdrummer software to make a loop, then insert them as audio loops into the new DAW software? Then EZdrummer is out of the picture unless I want to edit something

Tom, I use EZ Drummer so I'll do a basic run through of how you end up with a drum track in your project. EZD has excellent quality samples and I've found the interface is really easy to use.

EZD is at its most versatile when added to your project as a track.

Once inserted, you set up your kit how you like - each part has several options which you can audition by clicking on each instrument, this is the main window:



The kit has 8 virtual microphones and these can be controlled (pan, level etc) in the EZD mixer:



Now you can create the basic 'loop' which will form your drum track, in this example, I've selected the POP/ROCK kit, the POP/ROCK 'style' from the 4/4 SHUFFLE section, GROOVE 18 loop with the Hats 8th Rock Open variation:



Once you're happy with the basic sound of the loop, you simpley drag it into the MIDI track created when EZD was inserted into the project:




As many different loops and fills as you like can be added to the drum track, plus you can apply groove clip looping so a single loop can be dragged to copy it, just as with audio loops.

The MIDI information can be edited in situ once in your project using the Piano Roll View (PRV) - this is the single most beneficial reason using MIDI in my opinion Tom. Plus, using the PRV you can quickly create your own loops and fills in seconds.

Another enormous benefit of using a MIDI drum kit like EZD is that each 'feed' from the eight microphones can be independently treated in your recording software, in addition to the flexibility of the actual EZD mixer.

You can 'freeze' EZD at any time, the CPU intensive MIDI track will be converted to an ordinary audio waveform. If and when you are completely happy with your drums, you can bounce the MIDI down 'permanently' to audio.

Hope this gives you something to go on Tom

Steve

ORIGINAL: KainThornn

Yes but I'm a cheapskate and want free stuff alla timeI'll check out Acid type loops though, thanks!

LOL - good luck in your search

Google Free Acid Drum Loops and you'll be occupied for hours!

ORIGINAL: stratmanforever

Does Sonar home studio xl have ezdrummer

No mate, it's a Toontrack product designed to work with (nearly all) MIDI-compatible DAW software applications.

HS6XL came with Cakewalk's Session Drummer 2, which is similar-ish to EZ Drummer (but not as good IMO):




With HS7 and HS7XL, Cakewalk have dropped Session Drummer and replaced it with their Studio Instrument Drums:

Hey Bill, what we all suffer from is called GAS - Gear Acquisition Syndrome!

Eventually, you have to give into it and get what you have to get - trouble is, once you've got it, you'll want something else. Luckily for us home recordists, most of the stuff is free or reasonably priced - imagine owning a real studio!

I get what you're saying about the Precision Bill, it's one of the classic sounds in all genres of music - thing is I suppose, compared to most other basses, there's not a lot you can do with the sound of a standard PB, what with only the single set of pickups, that's probably one of the reasons why the sound of one is so distinct.

I'm always ready to brush up on my theory Bill - like I said to you, I have a basic understanding but knowing how and when to apply it is often my undoing. I have books on theory which are written specifically for guitar which cover everything - trouble is they're all about 'how to' as opposed to 'why', if you see what I mean.

Here my stuff. I found the connector for the camera.

HEy SteveStrummer.

That's excellent. Thanks for taking the time to post and explain that. I really appreciate it.

I think I get. From that, I can understand how you a building a track from various loops. But does it allow you to alter the loops, or easily make your own 1 measure loop, like a drum machine, but with a drag and drop interface? Because I can never find a loop with accents and open high hat hits exactly where I want them.
But I will like the general idea of a loop. So instead of building every one of them from scratch with single hits, I am wondering if I can get the majority by shifting a few drums within a loop here or there, or add another bass drum hit, or a snare etc?
If that can be done, is it done in EZDrummer or in the DAW?


Also, I have no fricken clue what a PRV is ?????

Lastly. Apparently, now I finally have all the ins and outs of GTP3 all sorted out and I can use it on the fly really well, I have to completely scrap it and learn an entirely new Midi compatable DAW. Any suggestions for what I should get? Knowing that I like GTP3.

Thanks
Tom

Hi there Tom

ORIGINAL: TomN

I think I get. From that, I can understand how you a building a track from various loops. But does it allow you to alter the loops, or easily make your own 1 measure loop, like a drum machine, but with a drag and drop interface? Because I can never find a loop with accents and open high hat hits exactly where I want them.
But I will like the general idea of a loop. So instead of building every one of them from scratch with single hits, I am wondering if I can get the majority by shifting a few drums within a loop here or there, or add another bass drum hit, or a snare etc?
If that can be done, is it done in EZDrummer or in the DAW?

Also, I have no fricken clue what a PRV is ?????

There are three basic ways to get MIDI drums into a project:
1 Dragging or copying MIDI loops into your project (as in EZ Drummer)
2 Playing a MIDI keyboard using the keys that are 'mapped' to the various drum instruments
3 Inserting the single hits one at a time in the Piano Roll View - that's the PRV!

MIDI information contains no audio, this is why it's so versatile. What it does contain is information - information that tells a hardware synthesizer or a software synthesizer (also called a 'softsynth') what to play, how to play it and when to play it. The audio samples or a preset in a synth are 'triggered' by the MIDI information.

In example 1 above, the MIDI information is already written in EZ Drummer and this information will be played using the sounds in EZD when you drag it into your project.

In example 2, you can record the MIDI 'live' using a MIDI keyboard. The drum sounds in EZD (and in all MIDI synths) are directly mapped to certain keys on the hardware keyboard when they are set up to 'talk' to each other. For example pressing a certain key will 'play' the snare drum, another will play the hi-hat etc.

If you hit the record button and play the keyboard, your recording software will print the MIDI information to the track - you'll hear the drum sounds being produced by EZD, but no audio is being recorded - just the MIDI info.

To emphasise this point, if you were to keep the MIDI track but change the synth from EZD to a piano for example, the audio you'd hear on playback would be the 'notes' you originally played on your keyboard.

Using the Piano Roll View, as in 3 above, you simply enter the MIDI information onto a grid which represents a keyboard on the y-axis and time (usually measured in musical bars) along the x-axis. The same keys on this virtual keyboard are the same that are mapped out for a 'real' keyboard by EZD.

The 'notes' you write in the PRV are infinitely editable, that is why this part of the drum track equation makes the whole method so variable. You can edit anything that's in there, including data entered as a loop direct from EZD or from a hardware keyboard.

This is what it looks like Tom, the black 'blocks' represent the MIDI informartion:




Steve

Say! Does that say Bill Yari on your sonar Steve?

Kain you should post your music here.

ORIGINAL: stratmanforever

Say! Does that say Bill Yari on your sonar Steve?

It certainly does mate!

'Tis the file you sent me imported into SONAR HS and ready to rock!

ORIGINAL: stratmanforever

I finished the verses but the chorus hasn't come tro me yet

What's that mate, the lyrics?

Hey Bill, I can see the Songs Forum beckoning!

I think I'd better let you hang on to the Strat for a while

Whats a song's forum?

ORIGINAL: stratmanforever

Whats a song's forum?

It's just along the corridor Bill, third on the left: http://forum.cakewalk.com/tt.asp?forumid=27

A great place to hang out, very friendly and very helpful - for posters and critics alike.

ORIGINAL: stratmanforever

Kain you should post your music here.

How and where? Or just a link to my MySpace?