SOLVED: Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out??

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leealecbarrie
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2011/01/30 18:21:06 (permalink)

SOLVED: Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out??

I've selected some midi data on a track and want to apply a MIDI effect, but the whole menu is greyed out. Anyone know why this is happening?
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    chuckebaby
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/01/30 18:23:39 (permalink)
    do you have data in the midi track..and what kind of effects are you trying?
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    leealecbarrie
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/01/30 18:24:55 (permalink)
    Yes there is a bass line. The whole menu is greyed out... I can't access any audio or MIDI effects.
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    Kalle Rantaaho
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/01/31 04:17:59 (permalink)
    I don't think it's possible to Process>apply FX to MIDI data, because MIDI is just data. You can add FX events in the data stream, but they can not be applied in the way you mean. That data can be removed from the Event list at will, whereas applied FX in the audio are permanent. Maybe I don't know MIDI protocol enough, but my intuition says MIDI FX just don't work that way.
     
    And anyway...IMO, destructive editing, like Process>Apply is never a good idea.
    The recommendable way of adding FX to soft synth is putting them on the audio output track. 
    post edited by Kalle Rantaaho - 2011/01/31 04:20:30

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    guitarmikeh
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/01/31 04:23:43 (permalink)
    in a way you can process midi fx by bouncing to clips with the midi fx in the clips bin.

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    Middleman
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/01/31 12:33:25 (permalink)
    leealecbarrie, can you provide a step by step? You are generally describing the problem but I want to make sure I can duplicate your steps and see what the issue may be. From what you have described it may be that you are selecting from the timeline and expecting to apply the fx but if the track is not selected, that may not work.

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    rabeach
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/01/31 14:16:00 (permalink)
    leealecbarrie


    I've selected some midi data on a track and want to apply a MIDI effect, but the whole menu is greyed out. Anyone know why this is happening?


    To use process/apply effect/midi effects you must have the midi track selected and have previously inserted a midi effect.
    #7
    Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk]
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/01/31 14:39:58 (permalink)
    rabeach


    leealecbarrie


    I've selected some midi data on a track and want to apply a MIDI effect, but the whole menu is greyed out. Anyone know why this is happening?


    To use process/apply effect/midi effects you must have the midi track selected and have previously inserted a midi effect.

    Exactly. What this feature does is render any MFX in the FX bin to the actualy MIDI clip(s). But to do this you must have a MIDI effect in that track's FX bin or that clip's FX bin.
     
    If you just want to load some MIDI FX on that track, start in the Browser and drag n drop some MFX to said track.
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    leealecbarrie
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/01/31 15:27:59 (permalink)
    Thanks, everyone for your responses. I'll try the drag and drop, but..... as it turned out, I simply had to right-clck on the selected MIDI data and the MIDI Effects menu appeared as a popup menu window. From there, I could choose the effect I wanted. In this case, I wanted to use the Humanize effect from Frank's MIDI Plugins to make my entire MIDI bass track sound more lifelike. My confusion was due to the differences in how Sonar XI works from Sonar 8.5.
     
     
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    Middleman
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/01/31 19:39:02 (permalink)
    Glad you got it worked out.

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    Skyline_UK
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/03/27 14:00:35 (permalink)
    leealecbarrie


    Thanks, everyone for your responses. I'll try the drag and drop, but..... as it turned out, I simply had to right-clck on the selected MIDI data and the MIDI Effects menu appeared as a popup menu window. From there, I could choose the effect I wanted. In this case, I wanted to use the Humanize effect from Frank's MIDI Plugins to make my entire MIDI bass track sound more lifelike. My confusion was due to the differences in how Sonar XI works from Sonar 8.5.
     
     
    That works for a MIDI clip, but in 8.5.3 you used to be able to select groups of notes and invoke MIDI effects from the main menu.  X1 has now made this needlessly convoluted.  Something so simple (that worked) has been sacrificed on the alter of 'easier to use'. !?!?


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    Skyline_UK
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/15 07:40:06 (permalink)
    So how do I select a group of notes I've highlighted in the piano roll and process them to change all their velocities by +4?

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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/18 16:34:21 (permalink)
    "So how do I select a group of notes I've highlighted in the piano roll and process them to change all their velocities by +4?"

    I am also curious as to how this can be done.

    I no longer can use the Cakewalk FX tool except as a Midi Effect in a channel (which is compeltely worthless to me).

    Does anyone have an answer??????????

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    Guitarpima
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/18 17:53:26 (permalink)
    Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk
    ]

    rabeach


    leealecbarrie


    I've selected some midi data on a track and want to apply a MIDI effect, but the whole menu is greyed out. Anyone know why this is happening?


    To use process/apply effect/midi effects you must have the midi track selected and have previously inserted a midi effect.

    Exactly. What this feature does is render any MFX in the FX bin to the actualy MIDI clip(s). But to do this you must have a MIDI effect in that track's FX bin or that clip's FX bin.
     
    If you just want to load some MIDI FX on that track, start in the Browser and drag n drop some MFX to said track.


    This is another PITA things that was not a problem in 8.5 and before. I like how it was and not the way you discribe. If you need to process midi effects for multiple tracks, you've created loads of Xtra clicks. The old way was better. However, for those that want to know. You can select multiple tracks, right click  on a clip and you'll be able to process midi effects that way.
    post edited by Guitarpima - 2011/07/18 17:56:33

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    SCorey
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/18 18:22:20 (permalink)
    "So how do I select a group of notes I've highlighted in the piano roll and process them to change all their velocities by +4?"

    Use the Event Inspector and enter "+4" in the "Vel" area.

    The Event Inspector is in the Control Bar. If you can't see it, try hiding some of the Control Bar modules.

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    brundlefly
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/18 18:31:11 (permalink)
    MGC59




    "So how do I select a group of notes I've highlighted in the piano roll and process them to change all their velocities by +4?" 


    I am also curious as to how this can be done. 


    I no longer can use the Cakewalk FX tool except as a Midi Effect in a channel (which is compeltely worthless to me). 


    Does anyone have an answer??????????


    After selecting the notes in the PRV, hover the smart tool over the upper edge of one of them to get the velocity adjustment tool, and then drag upward to increase the velocity. Or Process > Interpolate from a range of 0-123 to 4-127.

    Alternatively, you can put a velocity offset envelope on the track, which will allow you to experiment with different offsets non-destructively.

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    brundlefly
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/18 18:37:13 (permalink)
    SCorey



    "So how do I select a group of notes I've highlighted in the piano roll and process them to change all their velocities by +4?"

    Use the Event Inspector and enter "+4" in the "Vel" area.

    The Event Inspector is in the Control Bar. If you can't see it, try hiding some of the Control Bar modules.
    I wasn't aware that you could do an offset with Event Inspector by entering a signed value. That's good to know.



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    eternal85
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/19 09:32:48 (permalink)
    You can also do scaling by using a % sign .... 

    ex. highlight 10 midi notes, then go to the even inspector and (for a crecendo) type in %120 and all notes will scale from 100 to 120 percent
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    MGC59
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/19 11:48:52 (permalink)
    Thank you for your responses and please keep in mind that I haven't had time to try out your suggestions as of yet.
    With the FX tool I used to be able to grab a specific bunch of notes within a cluster....set the velocity and randomize them with a numeric value.
    (for example; the sixteenth notes of a high hat, I could set the up beat differently from the downbeat)
    I am assuming this is no longer possible in one step?

    I guess I am curious as to why this feature is no longer available as it was.
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    MGC59
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/19 23:17:34 (permalink)
    Now I have had a chance to do try the suggested method.

    I had to do quite a bit of digging to get to the Event Inspector screen.

    What I am losing here is fairly substantial to what I do. In the past I would highlight a group of notes and call up the Cakewalf FX Velocity Plugin. Usually I would set a velocity value or make a percentage change. I then set Randomize to a specific amount and tendency.

    I could do this very quickly and precisely with the old method.

    For me the new method is NOT ease of use. It is a bunch of extra steps and it seems that it is unecessary since the FX Velocity component is still included in the program.

    Is there any way to restore the functionality back to the way it was? Why would Cakewalk change this feature?
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    Skyline_UK
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/20 03:54:39 (permalink)
    MGC59


    Now I have had a chance to do try the suggested method.

    I had to do quite a bit of digging to get to the Event Inspector screen.

    What I am losing here is fairly substantial to what I do. In the past I would highlight a group of notes and call up the Cakewalf FX Velocity Plugin. Usually I would set a velocity value or make a percentage change. I then set Randomize to a specific amount and tendency.

    I could do this very quickly and precisely with the old method.

    For me the new method is NOT ease of use. It is a bunch of extra steps and it seems that it is unecessary since the FX Velocity component is still included in the program.

    Is there any way to restore the functionality back to the way it was? Why would Cakewalk change this feature?

    I agree.  Iit's ludicrous the way some things that worked fine in 8.5 have been changed under what I call the 'doctrinaire' design rules of X1.
     
    Although, in the interests of fairness, even in 8.5 you still had to go Menu/Process/MIDI Effects/Velocity to bring up the popup needed and I forwarded a suggestion to CW wayback to make this do-able with a shortcut, but to no avail.   In 8.5 it was also blocked from being made into a custom keyboard shortcut.  I'm sure it's not just me that invokes this MIDI velocity 'FX' tool very regularly and to have it buried like this clearly shows that the CW designers are not mindful of users who work with MIDI a lot - you only have to see the tutorial videos to see that; the predominant discipline seems to be loops mostly.
     
    Thanks brundlfly (post 16 above), for your method "After selecting the notes in the PRV, hover the smart tool over the upper edge of one of them to get the velocity adjustment tool".  It works but I found it so fiddly you almost need the mouse skills of a heart surgeon to do it speedily!
     
    So please Cakewalk, you talk a lot about the fundamental philosophy of ease of use, which I agree is paramount, so let's see a fix that enables me to simply and quickly select a clip, track or group of notes in the PRV and with one click invoke the MIDI process velocity FX popup.   

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    #21
    Skyline_UK
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/20 04:24:43 (permalink)
    brundlefly


    SCorey



    "So how do I select a group of notes I've highlighted in the piano roll and process them to change all their velocities by +4?"

    Use the Event Inspector and enter "+4" in the "Vel" area.

    The Event Inspector is in the Control Bar. If you can't see it, try hiding some of the Control Bar modules.
    I wasn't aware that you could do an offset with Event Inspector by entering a signed value. That's good to know.


    This doesn't work for a highlighted group of notes in the PRV.  If you highlight, say three, upping the velocity this way only works on the first note of the selection.

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    #22
    SCorey
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/20 10:05:44 (permalink)
    This doesn't work for a highlighted group of notes in the PRV. If you highlight, say three, upping the velocity this way only works on the first note of the selection.

    It works for me. I'm running 32-bit Quick-fix build 255 and all the lasso-selected notes got changed when I did the '+4' (or any other operation) in the Event inspector.

    Maybe it's a 64 bit problem, or earlier build problem?

    -Steve Corey
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    MGC59
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    Re:Sonar XI Producer: Process>Apply Effect menu is greyed out?? 2011/07/20 11:58:38 (permalink)
    +1 to putting back the FX Velocity tool ability. The present way of doing things is inadequate.
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