Cakewalk, Is The Bug With Sonar Stealing Keystrokes From U-he Synths Going To Get Resolved

Coming from Sonar 8.5 to X2, one of my biggest pet peeves is a new issue that was introduced. If I try to save a preset in a U-he synth in Sonar X2 (or X1), I can't type in the full preset name because the "Give All Keystrokes To Plugin" setting doesn't work with U-he synths. Note this used to work in Sonar 8.5.


I've reported this to Cakewalk via the Problem Reporter and never heard back.

I've sent Cakewalk a tech support email, and never heard back.

I contacted U-he tech support, and they responded the next day to say the issue is exclusive to newer versions of Sonar and is on Cakewalk to fix. They can't update their plugin for something that happens in a single DAW, which I don't blame them, especially since this is something that worked fine prior to X1.
So I'm curious, will this get fixed or will it be one of those bugs that carries on from version to version of Sonar?

Just to be thorough...

To Reproduce:

1. Load a U-he synth like DIVA
2. Open the GUI, move some knobs until you have a preset you're happy with
3. In the plugin menu, click the "Give All Keystrokes To Plugin" icon to turn that on
4. Try to save the preset using the internal preset browser - give it a name like "Pad - Big Cheesey Pad"

Result: The "Give All Keystrokes To Plugin" feature has no effect. The second you get to the "a" in the word "pad" the AudioSnap palette opens.

CWBRN-11527

I type the text into notepad then copy and paste it to Zebra2.

I have similar issues with East West plugins, there are doubtless other synths that 'give all keystrokes' does not work on either.

Seems to work with CamlAudio's Alchemy just fine though.

 
Has there been any improvement with this key-binding situation?  Any trick to let a user have a decent workflow using U-He (and other) plugins and X3???
 
I just bought U-He Zebra2 and I'm crestfallen that Sonar X3 does not work well with it!  I'm fairly new to X3 also, and finding the transition from v6 to be a good deal more annoying than I had imagined, but this inability to turn all key-binding off AND X3 not working correctly with U-He plugins to be a real deal-breaker for me!  Never had these issues (or even the need to hit the 'give keystrokes to plugin' button) with past versions of Sonar, even using the Zebra2 demo and other U-he plugins!
 
Upon finding the keystroke to plugin issue, I immediately contacted U-He for some insight and Rob explained this is a long-running and well documented (and bug submitted) issue with the Sonar X series.  And I gather this is true as I see users of plugins from other developers having these same issues as well.
 
A quick Google of "sonar x3 give all keystrokes to plugin" shows dozens of complaints of these issues spanning many years, mostly from the CW forums.  Surely these 2 issues have been addressed somewhere along the line of the past 3-4 years!?
 
And for those keeper score at home, the 2 issues are (if either worked, we could get there from here!):
 
1) Selecting the 'Give All Keystrokes to Plugin" button on the plugin doesn't work correctly, so you can't type in the plugin info windows, like when adding performance notes to patch or even renaming the patch. When you do try to type in the plugin, you simply activate the underlying Sonar key-binding.
 
2) There is no way to disable the Sonar key-binding.  There's a place that says it will, but it doesn't - not even if you set all keys to "Do Nothing". I understand the CMD combo bindings will remain, but at least let us adjust the simple upper and lower case letters (and numbers) at our will!
 
Any and all help or insight would be greatly appreciated!  Thanks!
 

This should be in the problem reports forum

it worked pre-x-series, and steps to reproduce are included above :-)

Well, there are 2 clear issues, both all too easily reproducible, as I explained above.
 
The main problem for me is the "Give All Keystrokes To Plugin" button function doesn't work correctly with at least U-He Zebra2, but I see many other plugins listed in other queries on the general subject.  In the 11 years or so I've been using Sonar 6, I never had to touch the "Give All Keystrokes To Plugin" button even using various U-He offerings including Z2 demo, and in fact I was not even aware this button existed until this issue in X3E.  And I would LOVE to experience the same workflow with X3E, and beyond, as I had with v6!  I've just purchased Z2 and there must be 10k soundsets for it, and as an avid patch modifier/creator/explorer, the inability to rename and add performance info notes to patches is extremely frustrating, and a real workflow killer! (yes, I realize I can work-around using Notepad or Sonar text entry areas - but what a pointless pain!!!)
 
Then the second issue that kills a decent work-around is Sonar X3E's inability to unbind all Sonar key-bindings, as explained in my original post.  And I've fought and researched this situation for hours and hours!  BUT, I wouldn't be surprised if I found out I was doing something wrong somewhere, as both X3 and Z2 are new to me, and a little confusing in their complexity and options, so that brings me here...    :)
 
The two issues together are just a nightmare!
 
Thanks for any and all help!
 

I agree with your basic POV, Alex, and that's the first thought that came to my mind.  But by the same token one might say; all U-He plugins worked perfectly before the X series, and now don't, and the U-He plugins haven't changed - the Sonar app has. 
 
But whomever is to blame for these situations (there's no way to blame U-He for the Sonar key-binding being unbindable!), I would think Cakewalk would want to contact and resolve this U-He issue ASAP, as I consider them a fairly major developer.  And from what I hear no replies have been received by anyone reporting such problems and/or submitting said bugs, since the X series began.
 
And to be honest, my thrill of Zebra2 far exceeds my dedication to Sonar, at this point (I mean most quality DAWs seem quite similar these days)!  It's a definite deal-breaker for me, I'm sorry to say.
 
Maybe a call to Customer Support is in order, but a trip to a backwoods dentist sounds less painful!  
 
 

I have just checked that with TyrellN6 and X2 32bit (under Linux). My observations (with "Give All Keystrokes To Plugin" activated):

• when I am simply focusing Tyrell, all keys I have tried produce no effect for SONAR ( 'P', 'W', 'Space')
• if I open "Save preset" dialog, 'Space' and 'W' has no effect, but 'P' has (opens SONAR property)

If "Give All Keystrokes To Plugin" is deactivated, all keys are processed by SONAR (as expected).
 
I can think about possible reason in case either all keys are blocked or all keys are not blocked. But I have no idea why the blocking can be "selective".

swamptooth
FWIW this also happens with cakewalk synths that have popup windows.  For example: insert rapture, bring up the rapture ui, enable give all keystrokes to plugin, open rapture's modulation matrix window, double-click on depth field, type 5.  Sonar switches to screenset 5.

 
Good catch! But as far as I can tell that happens only in the mod matrix window. On the main page, if you double-click on a field, you can type in a parameter value regardless of whether "give all keystrokes to plug-in" is enabled or disabled. I never noticed  because I always use the scroll wheel.

swamptooth
thanks, craig.  having a load of fun with electronic guitars, btw.  nice work!

 
Thanks! I use it all the time myself. BTW I'm working on additional guitar-oriented expansion packs...being at Gibson gives me access to the World's Ultimate Lending Library for Guitars.

I have a feeling we are going to be seeing a lot more posts like this soon... Exciting times..

Mitch_I
Good news. I think this is fixed.

I hope you're right, Mitch! 
 
I'd love to hear from a few more users saying this issue is fixed before I spend more money on this software!  In truth, I really don't feel like I should need to buy another version (in less than a year) simply to get a bug fix!!!  I REALLY think Cakewalk should apply this fix to the X Series!  I guess the Sonar X Series is going to be "Cakewalk's Vista"!
 
But, I have too many ongoing projects in Sonar to simply Walk Away (James Gang), so if this is ONLY going to be fixed in the NEW series, I'll probably sink more money into the beast, because it sure is a major workflow killer as it is now!  And unfortunately, I've lost my trust in the once mighty Sonar and Cakewalk over this long-standing issue (since X1 ferchristsake!) and its lack of attention, and already exploring new... (I almost said Vistas - but I have THAT!)  DAW software.
 
Any others seeing this issue (actually 2 issues!) fixed in the NEW Sonar versions?  Thanks!
 
 
And a big THANKS to Craig Anderton for a lifetime of fun and inspiration (back to the PAIA days)!  Following your project schematics was instrumental in my developing love of electro-modifying and general hardware mayhem!

Thanks for the confirmation, scook!
 
Now, if Cakewalk would please provide a patch for the X3 line, so I don't have to spend more money to experience a well-known bug fix in their past product line(s)! 
 
 

SFAM
Thanks for the confirmation, scook!
 
Now, if Cakewalk would please provide a patch for the X3 line, so I don't have to spend more money to experience a well-known bug fix in their past product line(s)! 
 
 

Cakewalk don't patch older versions. Once a new version is released that's it.