mettelus
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/23 12:05:55
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Beepster
... it's actually not all that great to flip through the emus all willy nilly as the track plays. That indeed just messes up your ears and isn't all that useful ...
Yep, that is about the size of what I was doing. In order to mix well it requires familiarity with the environment and how that translates. That part is still not familiar, so flipping around was just adding to the effect. I definitely agree it is a useful medium, so please don't get me wrong (for folks just catching this stuff). It is really no different than getting accustomed to monitors in one's environment.
ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero (Wi-Fi AC), i7-8700k, 16GB RAM, GTX-1070Ti, Win 10 Pro, Saffire PRO 24 DSP, A-300 PRO, plus numerous gadgets and gizmos that make or manipulate sound in some way.
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Beepster
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/23 12:17:25
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mettelus
Beepster
... it's actually not all that great to flip through the emus all willy nilly as the track plays. That indeed just messes up your ears and isn't all that useful ...
Yep, that is about the size of what I was doing. In order to mix well it requires familiarity with the environment and how that translates. That part is still not familiar, so flipping around was just adding to the effect. I definitely agree it is a useful medium, so please don't get me wrong (for folks just catching this stuff). It is really no different than getting accustomed to monitors in one's environment.
Totally. Just another tool. It's like why for years people have used the tried and true "check it in your car" method (even big studio producers). I don't think that's because there is anything magical about car stereo systems or the environment. It's just people who are into music and spend a lot of time in their cars are just soooo used to hearing "finished" music in that environment their ears are tuned to it. Then there is the psychological/behavioral aspects. For one just getting out of the studio and away from the DAW provides a massive amount of separation from "mix" mode to "listening" mode. Another thing is how many of us are gonna sit still in front of our DAW just listening to OTHER people's music endlessly like one does in a car. Me? I've never owned a car nor had a license (made no sense all the years I lived in the city). I still think there is something pretty awesome about listeining to music in the car but I sure as frack ain't buying, insuring and parking one just for an extra listeing environment. lulz... I would REALLY like Focusrite to update the VRM software though to include more emus... like a "car" emu.
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Lynn
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/23 13:10:09
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mettelus
Beepster
... it's actually not all that great to flip through the emus all willy nilly as the track plays. That indeed just messes up your ears and isn't all that useful ...
Yep, that is about the size of what I was doing. In order to mix well it requires familiarity with the environment and how that translates. That part is still not familiar, so flipping around was just adding to the effect. I definitely agree it is a useful medium, so please don't get me wrong (for folks just catching this stuff). It is really no different than getting accustomed to monitors in one's environment.
I believe the key to using the VRM is playing a recording that you are very familiar with to tune your ears to each of the speaker emulations. I chose Steely Dan, but you can use whatever you like. Perhaps then, you will find value in this box. I agree with Beepster that it's time to upgrade this software to include more emulations and mixing environments.
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Beepster
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/23 13:46:55
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Lynn
I agree with Beepster that it's time to upgrade this software to include more emulations and mixing environments.
I'd actually really like some other "consumer" emus too like "smartphone" (for ringtones), iPod docks, Bose compact systems and even headphone emus like iPod earbuds, Beats headphones and other crap people are listening to music on these days. They also should really lift the samplerate restrictions a bit (would likely require a new hardware unti release though) and maybe release a model with a single multi input (Instrument/Mic/Line) which would make it great as a travelling interface. Again that wouldn't help me because I'm not buying another one but if the made any new software comapatible with the current units... golden. I think Focusrite haven't expanded the VRM stuff because of the exact reasons mettelus was mentioning. It's just really hard/weird to get a good workflow going with the info currently available. Essentially they just say the bare minimum about how to use it and people get turned off before really giving it a proper go. The only reason I've made it useful is because I have no ther real options for multiple soundsources and I am gatdagned hellbent on making sure a hundred dollar peice of equipment is gonna get some use. Those who are more setup are more likely to dismiss it right off the bat without really giving it a chance.
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sharke
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/23 20:28:40
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Lynn
fireberd
I have a VRM box. It currently "collects dust". I seemed to be a gimmick more than a useful tool, for me.
I used to wonder whether I made a good investment with the VRM. Every mix I made, I played through the "media speakers " in the bedroom environment and nothing sounded good. I began to doubt that anything could sound good through them, until I played Steely Dan. Yes, they sounded good with SD and a light bulb went off in my head. Now I'm not done with a mix until it sounds OK through all the bedroom speaker emulations, and, lo and behold, that made my mixes translate better across more systems. Plus, I use the ARC 2 system on my speakers which rounds out my mixing environment. The VRM would be useful on an airplane with a laptop and headphones if you travel much.
I had exactly the same experience when I first got a VRM box. I thought the simulations were just bad quality until I played some Steely Dan through them and it sounded great. Big wake up call!
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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sharke
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/23 20:32:35
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JonD
Beepster
Since I got my VRM Box it has helped me isolate a lot of "sh*t" in my mixes.
Same here. In fact, I just bought the Sonarworks headphone Ref plugin, which, theoretically, should flatten my headphone response and give better results through the VRM. (This assumes Focusrite used flat-ish headphones in their models. If they used, say, Dr Dre Beats, I've just flushed $60 down the commode).
I'm not sure of the validity of routing through the Sonarworks plugin before the audio hits the VRM box. Maybe if you could put the Sonarworks in between the VRM box and your cans...but how would you do that?
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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joden
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 11:52:12
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Lynn
Joden, the original Alesis Monitor One was used in the VRM models, as was Auratones. I own both speakers and the VRM does a credible emulation of both. I also own a pair of KRK rokit's and the VRM captures them quite well, too.
Lynn I now have the VRM and installed the software, but I can see no Alesis anything in the monitor list???
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Beepster
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 12:30:31
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joden
Lynn
Joden, the original Alesis Monitor One was used in the VRM models, as was Auratones. I own both speakers and the VRM does a credible emulation of both. I also own a pair of KRK rokit's and the VRM captures them quite well, too.
Lynn I now have the VRM and installed the software, but I can see no Alesis anything in the monitor list???
I don't have any Alesis models either in my version. Perhaps Lynn was referring to the Rockit models OR there are different models in the on board VRM emus than the ones that come with the standalone box. But yeah... no Alesis emus here. Not sure how useful they'd be anyway because I'd imagine, Alesis being the company they are, were just emulating the Rockits with their hardware version. My hardware monitors are Mackie MKII's so I have nothing currently available to truly test similarities with. The desktop computer speakers sure do sound like the Logitech ones I own though.
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Lynn
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 12:42:09
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The Alesis emu is the American passive speaker in the studio environment. A full list of modeled speakers can be found at the focusrite website.
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Beepster
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 12:45:18
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Lynn
The Alesis emu is the American passive speaker in the studio environment. A full list of modeled speakers can be found at the focusrite website.
Cool. From the graphic I figured it was just some fancy old school studio speaker... which perhaps that Alesis model is. And now I'll be hunting down that emu list... because I like having real world model names to match up to my emus/sims. I did it for all my guitar sims... lol. Thanks.
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joden
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 13:03:38
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Thanks Lyn (and Beep :) )
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Lynn
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 14:25:21
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John
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 14:55:26
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Beepster
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 15:04:01
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Lynn
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 16:45:20
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John
I found this one. I have not tried it yet but it does come in 32 and 64 bit versions. http://europe.beyerdynamic.com/virtual-studio.html
Edit; I like it. It is rather remarkable and it is free.
John, thanks for this gift. I just downloaded it and gave it a try. It has something to add to my mix arsenal, and I look forward to using it.
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John
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 16:55:13
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Lynn you are very welcome.
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jb101
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 18:14:31
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John
I found this one. I have not tried it yet but it does come in 32 and 64 bit versions. http://europe.beyerdynamic.com/virtual-studio.html
Edit; I like it. It is rather remarkable and it is free.
Yes, thanks, John, this look/sounds interesting. I will have o have a play-around over the week end.
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joden
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Re: Alternative to the new "headphone mix" plugin?
2015/11/27 20:35:17
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and don't forget the one I linked in my OP thread starter 
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