LOUD NOISES!

Yeah, the genie is out of the bottle. Ain't no going back now and the current legislation is useless and heavy handed. I liked the Platinum Samples approach to anti piracy. They apparently embed something into the code that is traceable to the original purchaser so if there is blatant abuse it can be traced back to the source. I had never seen or heard of that before. I can still see a lot of problems that could arise from that but if music/movies had some kind of reg code I'd be okay with that.

There ya go Mr Stump has a point, I didn't realise how pissed off the subject gets me and he's quite right I shouldn't be ramming my views down my forum buddies throats.
 
So I put my money where my mouth is and just fired off a note to our freshly appointed police comissioner giving her a link to this thread and the link in the OP to the NVA post.
 
So apologies to anyone that thinks I've been ranting at them and I'm going to be ramming it down her throat from now on.

Pirates are out to kill the artist, not music. We as artists can't do enough to protect our property. Mr. Stump has a point, but what is it? Jonbouy has several points. The point is, you can't pick up the phone and get action on piracy from your local law enforcement. It takes federal-international intervention and finding the bass turds is not easy. I'm for publicly posting their address's and giving them one last chance to pay up. Internet pirates are theives, nothing more. Every fraudulent downloader needs to be arrested and fined.
I could go on.

Kalle Rantaaho

djwayne


oh boo hoo hoo, record excutives aren't making enough money and the public is ripping them off....boo hoo hoo, did you know one of the top record producers David Geffen has a net worth of 5.6 billion dollars.  I'm really sick of these rich record companies belly aching about "lost 'revenues....

In your opinion, what is the maximum income level that justifies defending your property? How poor do you have to be, to be allowed to say: That's my work, you're not allowed to steal it?
?

At the moment a lot of people use a "Robin Hood" romanticising of "steal from the rich and give to the poor"
In article linked in the original post (which it would seem djwayne did not read) there was no big corporation involved, just a guy trying to make a modest living by delivering a good product at a fair price. To me the crux of the matter is people need to be educated that this not a victimless crime as so may seem to think.
 
I know someone who won't pay for software or music. He also very good an not paying his debts too, using the same logic. "they have enough money, they don't need me to pay them back."

Let me ask this question, if current popular cd's were priced at $4.99 instead of $12.99 wouldn't you buy more cd's ?? I know I would be buying them by the boatload, but at $12.99 forget it, I'll just listen to the radio.

Like I said "Who's robbing who ?? " I choose not to buy over priced cd's or concert tickets, and the big boys scream. Too bad, I'm not gonna feel sorry for a record producer who is worth 5.6 BILLION dollars !!

Umm... $12.99 for a full length CD is reasonable. I paid over $20 for most of the stuff in my collection and some of it was used.

Now there's an interesting side topic. What about used CDs being sold on Ebay or a used record store? Isn't that kind of like cheating the artist and record companies?

Beepster, you asked that I not respond to any of your posts so please don't bother responding to any of mine.

Beepster


Umm... $12.99 for a full length CD is reasonable. I paid over $20 for most of the stuff in my collection and some of it was used. 

I remember in the 70's when, in the UK, albums were 3-4 pounds. These days they are around 3 times that. Compare to a pint of beer 15p then 3 pounds now. In real terms, music is cheaper that it has ever been. Specialist stuff with a very small target audience aside if you wait for 6 months you can still pick up albums at 1970's prices.
 
So from my perspective I don't think albums are overpriced.

djwayne


STOP RIGHT THERE !!! I DID NOT SAY "I'LL STEAL IT AND THAT"S OKAY" I DID NOT SAY "I"LL SNEAK INTO THE CONCERT"....

LOL!! 


For crying out loud man get a grip of yourself. Of course he was talking in general = to give an example only.  

Btw I completely agree with what he (Spacey) has said on this thread.  I too HATE conniving selfish gutter trash thieves and when you use excuses such as; billionaire label executives whilst omitting any consideration to; who it hurts the most = the majority of poor battling writers/musicians for which; a lot of them are in debt (owing money), some claim bankruptcy and have lost everything in the process including their car and rental-home. 


Also; your argument about CD's being too expensive; when in fact if you bothered to shop around you'll find millions of CD's selling for less than you claim $12 in fact I've seen CD (Albums) sell for as little as $4 and if your lucky you might even win free T-Shirts and concert tickets (give-a-ways) fact is; I've seen artists give-a-way really nice signature guitar. Awesome generosity from artists whilst they battle on to keep their heads above water... no easy feat... all whilst conniving selfish narrow-minded gutter trash thieves continue to use asinine excuses to justify their criminal activities. 

Of course I too was speaking in general, no intended offense towards you ;) 

Good riddance...The bottom line is that the OP's so called victim may have to look at other reasons his software isn't selling...it sucks perhaps ?? there's tons of competition that makes better less costly software..?? Possibly bad marketing ?? No promotion ?? Quite frankly I never heard of it before this thread. So now that I know about it I'm supposed to run out and buy it ?? Not in the cards sorry.

A LP used to sell for $10-$12 when I was a teenager. 

I don't buy CD's anymore, I usually prefer buying via iTunes, however when I see the option to buy as a CD, it's usually between $10 and $15. 

But a lot of them are also available for $4 or $5 - something quite unheard of back in my days. 
 
DJWayne - I don't think this has to do w/ software not selling, but w/ people stealing it and redistributing it - because, if you use torrent to download illegal software, you are contributing to the redistribution.

If it sucks, why steal it? That doesn't really hold any water. 

That Russian web site which redistributes my wife's music is a FAN site - which leads me to believe that those folks must be people who actually enjoy the music.

If they thought it sucked, my guess is that they wouldn't have put the site together and go to such lengths to find the music, post photos we didn't even know where out there and hadn't seen in years, translate interviews and have a section dedicated to fan art (there's something a bit odd the first time you see your beloved lady painted as an elf princess by a fan, I have to add. lol)

Yet, they feel they have a right to just grab the music for free. And we're not millionaires, man.    

So, stealing it because it sucks makes no sense. We need to stop trying to find reason. Would you steal a car because it sucks? My bet is you'd buy one you think is good.

You tell me this guy has it hard to the point where your heart stings I maintain you need a sanity check.

 
Jon... your points are valid but I do think that you misunderstood what Marius was trying to say... and maybe he didn't say it well. I know I say a lot of things that are misunderstood myself. That said, I think and am pretty sure actually that Mairus was not referring to the guy in the article with the drum samples when he made the "heart"comment. I am pretty sure he was referring to having his work pirated, early in his carreer, recently really, and for the first time. Even knowing it is going to happen must really hurt when it does, especially to the young artist. I think the story just opened a recent wound in him... and that (his wound from piracy) was what he was referring to). I've done the same thing many times and been misunderstood and probably thought a fool by some. I like both you guys and I think you both have very valid points. He referring to his hurt by seeing his work pirated and you by pointing out that it is to be expected.
 
I have seen the sort of thing that happened on the farm too often but that is how the free market works and sooner or later it will all work itself out in the music/entertainment industry. It will just take time point will hit counterpoint and eventually things will reach some sort of balance where everyone makes money... or it will die... but it wont die because we all know that Rock n Roll can never die... Neil said so.
 
Knowing it will happen wont (I think) diminish the hurt, anger, and even surprise in a younger artist. Give Marius time and he will become as cynical as the rest of us old farts... perhaps even pendantic!
 
Anyway.. a lot of words to say that I think Marius was not referring to the guy with the drum samples at all but rather to his own hurt.
 
I have some (a bunch actually) of loops that are pirated... it always bothered me that they were and I have never used them and I think Iam going to dispose of them. I've never downloaded an illegal copy of a song. I did use Napster when it was going. I used it to see if I liked an artist or a song. If I liked them I would buy their CD... apparrantly I was once again out of step with everyone else... and I know it is nieve but really I have found that it is hard for honest people to realize how many people will steal anything... on the other hand a thief trust no one.. which, in this world, is sadly the best policy.

SteveStrummerUK


 
It's quite easy to understand how this subject gets peoples' hackles up.
 
But I think I detect the slightest tinge of hypocrisy here and there.... Let he who is without sin cast the first stone and all that.
 
Anyone who's watched an (illegally?) uploaded music video or TV show on Youtube is no less guilty than someone who's downloaded a cracked version of a computer program or a pirated DVD. It's simply a matter of degree. Or is it?
 
Or am I missing the point completely?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

You're not.


Obviously, I'm as guilty as the next guy when I watch a video on YouTube or listen to a song on Groooveshark. Though, in all honesty, if the content is available for purchase, that will be my first option in 99% of the cases. 


If the band has a YouTube channel, that will be my preferred option if I want to watch a video. I'll put up w/ the darn publicity.


But I do realize that I'm still stretching the rules to a point which seems acceptable according to MY morality. Just like every one else is.


One other thing I can tell you though is that when people start coming clean, and being a little less careless, it's often a chain reaction.

This all reminds me... One of the dreams I've had the most often since I was a teenagers. I'm in a music store, I see all those records which I really want, all there for the taking. Some people are helping themselves around me - there's no one watching, no salesman. So I hesitatingly start picking up all some records which I really want, and just as I'm about to walk away, I go back and put everything back in its place. 

It's like I didn't have the heart to do it all along, and I feel that even the minute I start picking them up.