An interesting post about piracy...

Quite a great sum up from someone who is directly affected. I was amazed when tonight  I googled Fruity Loops(it's not even called that any more) I had to stop at 8 pages, it was nothing but crack and warez sites.

Imageline's take on that would be interesting indeed.

It's a bit like candy selllers. 
 
They like the idea that putting everything out there in front of the children tempts them to buy and then complain when the kids then remorselessly help themselves to everything in sight.
 
Put it in a box and personally mail it out watermarked if piracy is your problem, then at least you'll know who circulated it.
 
It isn't piracy that's the problem, it's wanting your cake and being able to eat it that's the problem.
 
I'm bored of hearing about it.  Make something that can't be pirated if you don't want it pirated because if it can be it will be, I think even a bit of plankton would have worked out that much by now.
 
I'd rather hear about people making a success of trading on-line and how they do it, trouble is we never get to hear about those because success doesn't need to whine incessantly.  Get a proper job that does pay if you can't make it pay, don't blame the ills of the world for your own stupidity.
 
The whole thing really has got old for me.  People have been saying development of good stuff will cease if piracy continues and I've still got enough good stuff I've bought to enjoy what I have rather than worry about what I don't, that must be 30 years after I heard piracy was going to abduct my children and force me to live in poverty.
 
Insanity is defined by some as keeping on doing the same things and expecting a different result, poor guy if it ain't working out for him then he ought do something else like the rest of us have to if our meal ticket doesn't work out as we perhaps might prefer.
 
Doing sample libraries is prone to being undermined by piracy would be my simple message to the guy.
I should be able to leave my bicycle outside the shop without fear of having it stolen, but I'd rather use my loaf and put a lock on it.  You'd be right enough to call me an idiot if I didn't!

[CENCORED DUE TO SEMANTICS] I've had a couple albums pirated, 6 months of work next to our day jobs not including the song writing, thousands of dollars for studio rental/equipment and mix and master services, time and money spent on promotion, getting labels involved, getting agents involved, loads of paper work, less time with friends and family, less time spent catching up on much needed rest and leisure time and so forth...

The sales stoped over night,litterarly, when they hit the pirate sites. We still owe money on one of the records and we can see on a couple of sites that it has been downloaded several thousands of times.

Whatever hippie free the world destroy the capitalistic industry nonsense these bastards argue with, it doesn't take away the feeling of having your gut ripped out. Sure, it is to be expected that your stuff gets pirated and thankfully we get paid to play live so we don't face bankruptcy from doing this... Live shows and day jobs, that keeps us going. I have more than once asked my self if I can handle this kind of stuff though. At one point I quit playing music and started composing it for the money.

The worst part is when telling stories like tese to a proud pirate, they always counter when they're out of arguments: The people who downloaded your music probably wouldn't pay for it anyway so your music can't be that good.

Well, pirates are narrow minded bastards and I want to shoot them where it hurts! But what can be done?

The lack of respect amazes me!

And how shortsighted and selfish!


I could go on for hours about this. Sorry for the rant

craigb


Interesting article.

So does anyone have a link to the free samples?  (JUST KIDDING!!!! )

Yep, good one.
 
He may just have pulled off the smartest marketing move in ages.
 
Guilt trip at least 10,000 into $50 a pop.
 
What does that work out at?

Man, that stings my heart to read.

 
Get a grip, the man is hiring halls and lining up a parade of oriental drums to play with.
 
Listen to some of the stories some of your buddies share on this forum if you want real life heartache.
 
I'm not some hippie condoning piracy, I don't condone piracy anymore than I'd condone someone stealing my bike from outside a shop, but I put a lock on it because I know it's likely to get stolen if I don't. I also learned early if something you get something with out working for it it worthless, that is true in my experience.  I've even bought some library off that guy some time back, he ain't thanking me for that he's moaning about theives.
 
They're out there we all know it.
 
You can't expect a return on something you do just because you do it, if you've overlooked the idea that a sample library is prone to be pirated then you are either completely mad or stupid.  That's how it IS and you'd be mad to operate a business without looking at the hazards to your margin realistically.
 
It isn't a moral issue it's a business decision he's making and if he had a half decent accountant on hand he would also tell him not to bother.
 
I'll tell you what, if anyone thinks this is a heart-wrenching story then all I can say is that you must lead very sheltered lives.

Jonbouy

craigb


Interesting article.

So does anyone have a link to the free samples?  (JUST KIDDING!!!! )

Yep, good one.
 
He may just have pulled off the smartest marketing move in ages.
 
Guilt trip at least 10,000 into $50 a pop.
 
What does that work out at?

Before or after your cut?

Do people actually pirate sample libraries?
 
Man, I swear every 6 months I have to de-clutter my drives from all the "The Metallic Cheese Graters of Rumania", "Bangaz from da Hood", "Electro Brain Malfunction" type of crud that seems to accumulate without me even trying.
 
Mind you I'm still trying to locate "Chilled sounds of the putting green" if anyone has a spare they want to sell, preferably in either sfz or sxt format.
 
Cheers.

Jonbouy


"The Metallic Cheese Graters of Rumania", .

You got a link for that one?

I do not think Justin, who started Reaper is a bad guy..  He is certainly not a Kim dot com, and Justin is nowhere near as evil as, "google corp, or FaceData Mine erm book, or Walmart...

Justin wrote Winamp, many, many, many moons ago, and was bought out..  This may have been in 1999?   Look, in 1999, when somebody buys your baby technology company for $400 million..  Good for you!!   I'm from old School America, I don't think we have to fear, or discredit somebody else's fair and honest success, even if its a mega success...

What saddens me is that, "Paris Hilton can snap her fingers, and she is one of the most famous dj's in the world.  She's had several major label albums, she is not even a musician."  

IMHO, Piracy has not killed music, any more than the stupidity of the vast majority of mankind.  It is such a, "jersey shore, msnbc existence," out there...

Strange..  Daze

"A large collection of taiko drums does not travel. I had to go to them."




I wonder how the folks that actually made the drums feel about having the sounds stolen and sold all over the web by a "samples" company?

Jonbouy

Man, that stings my heart to read.

 
Get a grip, the man is hiring halls and lining up a parade of oriental drums to play with.
 
Listen to some of the stories some of your buddies share on this forum if you want real life heartache.
 
I'm not some hippie condoning piracy, I don't condone piracy anymore than I'd condone someone stealing my bike from outside a shop, but I put a lock on it because I know it's likely to get stolen if I don't. I also learned early if something you get something with out working for it it worthless, that is true in my experience.  I've even bought some library off that guy some time back, he ain't thanking me for that he's moaning about theives.
 
They're out there we all know it.
 
You can't expect a return on something you do just because you do it, if you've overlooked the idea that a sample library is prone to be pirated then you are either completely mad or stupid.  That's how it IS and you'd be mad to operate a business without looking at the hazards to your margin realistically.
 
It isn't a moral issue it's a business decision he's making and if he had a half decent accountant on hand he would also tell him not to bother.
 
I'll tell you what, if anyone thinks this is a heart-wrenching story then all I can say is that you must lead very sheltered lives.

So you're implying that I don't care about the real life stories that people share here on the forum - because they never had their software/music/movies/whatever pirated in the digital domain?????? Man, Jon, I thought you knew me a little better than that! That was out of line.
 
But you're not geting my point at all! And let me just say this; comparing software piracy with theft of physical items is not at possible - internet piracy is internet piracy, a totally different issue all together. The major difference being:
 
1: I didn't spend weeks creating that one bike and putting my heart and soul into perfecting it
 
2: The company that did make it made plenty of bikes at the same time and now they will sell a new bike and it will be paid for by the insurance company - probably. Either way, they'll have revenue to create and perfect the next new bike.
 
3: I nor the bike manufacturer, lost any personal value by having it stolen. I loose a couple hours sending in a police report and insurance report, and I'd have to walk home. Guess what, come pay day and nothing will be changed. My house maintain its value, the time I spend at work maintain its value, the work I actually do maintain its value. Of course, it sucks if you're a bike messenger...
 
 
In digital piracy it's often argued that the owner of the product doesn't loose anything - and that's true. The files will still be there and it can still be sold lisences but the value of the product is significantly decreased and more or less removed. Like the article said, why would people buy it when it's freely available on the net? In the end, when you buy a software product, all you really pay for is the support.
 
Now here's the thing; you pour your heart and soul into something, you perfect it to your standards, like a master chef does to his dishes, like a painter does to his paintings, like a carpenter does to the stair case he put up in your house but because it's digital you aren't alowed to protect it?
 
So here's the deal, I make something, many people like it and want to be able to use it/listen to it/watch it. I spend countless hours and dollars making this available to everyone. I'm hoping to at least get something back for the effort so I can afford to set aside the time to set more of my ideas into life and pass it on to them. Sure, anyone can create a turkey and experience that what they made didn't at all gel with the masses - and that's fine, it happens. There's the first calculated risk. The second being that yes, it will probably land on a pirate site - but that doesn't mean it doesn't hurt whoever was behind creating it in the first place. Which, by the way, was my entire point.
 
I used to think like you Jonbouy and have probably given that pad lock on my bike example at some point. But unless you have actually experienced the impact of having your stuff pirated, especially when you're a beginner in the biz of choice, you won't see it from the other side. That's why I usually stay out of piracy debates because quite honestly, very few people know both sides first hand. And those creating the content are usually outnumbered by the people who defend or marginalize piracy and are more or less "threatened" to silence on the subject. Besides, who wan't to make them selves more unpopular by taking a stand against something so many harvest the benefits of, a world of cool stuff for free, when they actually want as many as possible to have it?
 
I'll be keeping my bike to my self.
 
Do we have to accept piracy? Sure. It's there and I don't think we'll see it go away, even if there are great legal alternatives to pretty much all of it. People won't change.
 
But I don't have to LIKE it!
 
I still feel the sting when I see that pirates "thank me" for the great job by wanting a copy but don't appreciate the work it took to bring it to them. The article explained this from a creators point of view really well. And keep in mind, when someone loose their homes to fire and pour their hearts out here, I find that extremely sad too, most likely even more so, so don't make assumptions about me living a "sheltered" and "non caring" life, dude, just because I think piracy is BS!!
 
 
 
Anyway, I've said what I have to say.

So you're implying that I don't care about the real life stories that people share here on the forum - because they never had their software/music/movies/whatever pirated in the digital domain?????? Man, Jon, I thought you knew me a little better than that! That was out of line.

 
No you said the story made your heart sting.  Your words not mine.
 
Frankly I don't think as a sob story it has any weight whatsoever.  I think if anyone's heart stings over that story they haven't got a foot in the REAL world.
 
Just because you pour your heart and soul into something it's a hard fact of life that it doesn't entitle you to a financial return.
 
There was two old ladies in my family one of them his dead now the other one is in her nineties, they run a dairy farm their entire lives, they had to cull their herd a couple of times due to diseases and ended up finally giving up after the supermarkets fixed the prices they could get for their product. 40 or so acres up to 500 cattle for 60 years and however much devotion that took and they ended up on a state pension where they couldn't even heat their home in the winter.  Life doesn't issue guarantees to anyone.
 
You tell me this guy has it hard to the point where your heart stings I maintain you need a sanity check.
 
I've not once gone into the rights or wrongs of piracy or even bothered to work out who the villains of the piece really are all I'm saying is that this guy needs some basic business training.  You release stuff on the internet it gets pirated, you either live with that fact and make your commercial venture work within the reality that exists whether anyone likes it or not or you do something else.
 
There never seems to be a shortage of people lining up to produce soundware or plug-ins so someone somewhere is full of BS.  Many people would like to have a job where the can sit at home and produce songs or sample libraries rather than go out and do something that pays, most people have to roll up their sleeves and get dirty doing something else instead.
 
If you can make it pay then kudos to you if you can't find something else to do.
 
 

Jonbouy

So you're implying that I don't care about the real life stories that people share here on the forum - because they never had their software/music/movies/whatever pirated in the digital domain?????? Man, Jon, I thought you knew me a little better than that! That was out of line.

 
No you said the story made your heart sting.  Your words not mine.
 
Frankly I don't think as a sob story it has any weight whatsoever.  I think if anyone's heart stings over that story hasn't got a foot in the REAL world.
 
Just because you pour your heart and soul into something it's a hard fact of life that it doesn't entitle you to a financial return.
 
There was two old ladies in my family one of them his dead now the other one is in her nineties, they run a dairy farm their entire lives, they had to cull their herd a couple of times due to diseases and ended up finally giving up after the supermarkets fixed the prices they could get for their product. 40 or so acres up to 500 cattle for 60 years and however much devotion that took and they ended up on a state pension where they couldn't even heat their home in the winter.  Life doesn't issue guarantees to anyone.
 
You tell me this guy has it hard to the point where your heart stings I maintain you need a sanity check.
 
I've not once gone into the rights or wrongs of piracy or even bothered to work out who the villains of the piece really are all I'm saying is that this guy needs some basic business training.  You release stuff on the internet it gets pirated, you either live with that fact and make your commercial venture work within the reality that exists whether anyone likes it or not or you do something else.
 
There never seems to be a shortage of people lining up to produce soundware or plug-ins so someone somewhere is full of BS.  Many people would like to have a job where the can sit at home and produce songs or sample libraries rather than go out and do something that pays, most people have to roll up their sleeves and get dirty doing something else instead.
 
If you can make it pay then kudos to you if you can't find something else to do.
 
 

Man, I feel this gets seriously besides the point here man. Just let it go....
 
Original post edited btw since it seemed to take so much focus out of the message...
 
 
Whatever

oh boo hoo hoo, record excutives aren't making enough money and the public is ripping them off....boo hoo hoo, did you know one of the top record producers David Geffen has a net worth of 5.6 billion dollars.  I'm really sick of these rich record companies belly aching about "lost 'revenues....