I once saw a program on BBC television about Queen Elizabeth 1st, before she was queen.
 
She wrote entire books and poems without a single mistake
 
Maybe, she was our greatest monarch ever

 
Can't even begin to imagine the code behind X3... does so much! Alex, you make my head hurt!
 
Well, I for one feel the revs we've gotten for free have continued to enhance and improve X3 in many subtle but worthwhile ways, along with bug fixes so really we are getting the best of both worlds... improvements/enhancements plus bugs be gone...
 
quite a deal and makes me giddy all over!
 
I would suggest Cake actually delay a bit, getting "e" out to a few of the forum's power users who've been so generous and knowledgeable over time and let them take a wack at it. Then, take another month and refine things before putting it out.
 
Baker... you know who's done a great job articulating and surfacing bugs... give these folks an early go and ruminate a bit on the results.  
 
 
 
 
 
 

Not only that the puzzle is in 3D.

 
I saw that one - but they said to "Let the Wookie win"...
 

CakeAlexS
Not in my view, you need to get it to as many users as possible. A few people just won't be able to test all the functionality (or have the hardware combinations). That's why beta testing never really works that well unless you have a massive beta program like Microsoft does. Cake QA would probably do a better job then most "power users", I would assume and/or hope they have automated testing... Just my opinion.
 
Thanks :)

Ok, makes sense... geeeeze, Alex... you almost always make sense! are you really in England?

Anderton
I'm looking into my crystal ball...I see...I see a clock...there it is!
 
Sonar X3e will appear at 11:50:30 AM.
 
What? You want the date too? Jeez. You people are never satisfied.
 

Golly Craig,  Why all the mystery in delaying the release for one hour from 10:50:30?  Tell us the real reasons please.

Hopefully they dont start working like IK. You would have to empty the SEPTIC TANK (V3) every week.

chuckebaby
 
 
they're free man

Yes!,
eE expanded X1 was an e,but I'll have free e's anytime[that is,when I'm NOT using a computer!]
MaBob

Thanks rontarrant & silktone & everyone.
 
I love Sonar and this forum.
 
I have learned so much from all of you and I thank you.
 
I hope to be able to help someone in the future as you have all helped me.

aspenleaf,
 
If, as you say, you been involved with Cakewalk like forever then it should be easy to see that:
 
a) X2a was under Roland control
b) X3 has had 4 patches so far (and another on the way) since Roland has departed
 
Many like you are bitter over X2a. It's somewhat understandable, especially on limited budgets. But IMO Cake is back to being on the forums and delivering patches that fix bugs. That alone tells me that I'm sticking with them as my main DAW (and yes I do own three other DAWs).
 
Your "not functioning properly" comment is extremely vague to me. Does SONAR simply not boot? Can you not record audio? Can you not record MIDI? Does MIDI not drive your VSTi? Can you not insert VSTs in FX-Chain or FX-Bin? Can you not export a song? What exactly is not functioning properly?
 
Now if you said that SONAR has limitations to YOUR workflow I can understand that. Not everyone uses SOANR the same way. I don't comp. I record a track. If something is wrong I punch it in or record the track over. Maybe that is my carryover from my tape & ADAT days but it works properly for me. I can move audio and MIDI clips where I want them. I do experience an occasional crash but with aAuto-save on I've almost never lost much (if any) work.
 
I have properly recorded and completed projects in X1, X2 and now X3d, pretty much like I did in 8.x, 7 and 6 etc.
 
Bear in mind I'm a hobbyist, not a for hire studio and so any inconvenience I experience is never in front of a client.
 

Well, ba pu, I didn't want to get into personal attacks, but since you're opening the door.... I go way back to the analog days, too.  I'm in my 50s and used to work in a great, well equipped studio when I was younger, after my days of touring and playing live.  I really appreciate the convenience of digital recording, and the great program that Sonar has developed into.  I don't do much comping either, mostly just straight up recording with pretty clean production and minimal effects.  I do use midi keyboards, mostly to trigger some of the great acoustic piano samples that are available today.  I'm not bashing Sonar, but they did abandon X2a.  I know there was a change in ownership and it looks like that change will be for the better.
 
My problems with X2a have mostly been from crashes.  And it is very disconcerting when you have a client that you are working with and the program freezes during a take.  I also have issues with very slow opening and closing of larger projects, although none have been any larger than projects I did in X1 without the same issues.  I have been checking the forum regularly to see if others had similar problems and what worked for them, and I have tried those fixes with varying degrees of success.
 
I have a state of the art computer and everything is updated.  I'm glad everything has worked well for you and your projects, but that doesn't mean that it has worked well for everyone else.  I never said the program didn't work at all.  I said they left it unfinished, then offered a "finished" version for an additional $150.  I already have Addictive Drums and Melodyne Editor, so even though those may make the deal better, they don't necessarily for me, although I am aware that I can get 2 ADpaks instead of Addictive Drums, and I am considering the value of that when deciding on upgrading. 
 
I am a loyal user of this software, but maybe not the fanboy that you appear to be.  I'm just being frank about your chances of Cakewalk fixing all of the issues for free before moving on to another paid upgrade.

Understood, ba pu.  I didn't mean to offend you.  I think we're in agreement that the program is quite good.  I just hope the new ownership follows through in supporting the users.

aspenleaf
My problems with X2a have mostly been from crashes...I have a state of the art computer and everything is updated.

 
Unfortunately, as I have found out through hard experience, a state of the art computer isn't always the answer. In particular, I've found graphics cards and drivers to be huge sources of problems both in terms of reliability and crashes. This has affected Sonar but also some (but not all) other programs (I won't name names, don't want to look like I'm dissing competitors). Finding the right graphics card solved the problems with all affected programs.
 
On the Mac, I had a series of incredibly vexing, random crashes but only with certain programs and on certain files. Eventually I re-installed the operating system and it seemed okay for a while, but the random crashes continued. I tried checking RAM and it was fine. But then I checked RAM with MemTest, which runs from the Mac's CLI and loads from a custom disk so it doesn't use the Mac's RAM...it located a bad memory stick. Once I fixed that, the problems were solved.
 
I, and many other people, have used X2 without major problems but just the occasional "I don't know what happened but I restarted it and it seems to be working now"-type stuff. The problems you're describing sound major and (I would assume) caused by some interaction between X2 and your system. Granted, it would be nice if Cakewalk could make a program so bulletproof system interactions wouldn't influence it, but we all know that's not possible...one can only hope it's as bulletproof as possible with as many systems as possible.
 
The easiest way to find out if the X2 problems you've experienced with your system carry over to X3 is to set a system restore point, download and install the X3 demo, then barrage it with the things you do that cause crashes. Then uninstall and depending on the results of your tests, keep it uninstalled, or upgrade.
 

I'm just being frank about your chances of Cakewalk fixing all of the issues for free before moving on to another paid upgrade.

I can guarantee that Cakewalk will NEVER fix all of the issues because fixing issues can often cause other issues. The workaround for the POD Farm and UA plug-ins are prime examples, but there are more subtle ones.
 
The analogy I use is releasing records. You can mix a record for decades and find increasingly fine points you want to tweak. But past a certain point, you just have to say "This record is done" and start work on the next one. Well, unless you're Tom Scholz, of course

Sorry to disappoint you Paulo - I'm all out of vitriol today.
 
Anderton - I know what you mean, and I'm sure it's impossible for the programmers to anticipate all of the combinations of hardware and software users might employ.  I probably will download the X3 demo and try it out.  I'm hearing mostly positive comments about it.  I just haven't gotten over the X2a abandonment, although I realize it's probably because based on past releases and updates, I was expecting a few more updates to X2 before they moved on to X3.

Hmm Tom Scholz[I loved the Hammond "riffed song"poss. best recorded LP/SPLead "singing tone",but about a certain "Bliss" named bands 1st MEGA hit single's Riff being like Boston's"More than a feeling"???? Umm?
 
I don't think so nearly as much..............as you obviously all agree on!,but That "TEEN SPIREET" riff sounds more like a riiff,from some ole buds o mine["Yiz Garn Off"?],here in oz called "The Celibate Rifles"[sex pstola opposita] from a song called "Electrovision Mantra"[obviously the 4 chord part later in "TV song"umm........I mean "Electro V Mantra",I'll be spanked on for this[poss?],but a decent bunch of Seattle Originals,really dug Aussie independent bands[pre 89] like the Rifles-1980ish - still gigging occasionally,and toured Europe..Roskilde,US CBGB's["Kiss Bang Bang-Live Album ],and Lot's of others-Cosmic Psycho's-"I wanna be like David Lee Roth so da da da da can all su** m* of*"-chorus of very classic Psychos song,plus too many to mention all of the others-"Lime Spiders",etc etc etc Tex Perkins-Mick Jagger of tough as "Gut's n Gru-R n R"...nuff sed.
 
Don't believe?.....ask em,though their sworn to sec. and 2b nice "bout it all".
 
Yeah,I was very miffed after buying into the big overseas postage[boxed dvd rom] for the now "idle",and unsellable X1 studio X1 Producer,but especially X2[loving X3 ATM-when "tis not weird"-do not really need or want/afford mac/X4   yet],though I"should'ave known better",even if I'm a VERY late starter in digital,and I"got hit,"And We e e Dy Youn ".
MaBob