SonicExplorer
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Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
Hi, I'm about done with a DAW rebuild but since the hardware changed (removed an M-Audio, an SBLive and added also new Synth) the I/O channel assignments are all futzed up when opening previous projects. I assume it is possible, in theory, to get projects to open cleanly if I could somehow control the order in which Sonar sees/maps the I/O assignments. Just as one simple example, previously the SBLive MIDI Input entry was last in the Inputs list, now the FF400 MIDI Input entry is first in the list. So everything else down the I/O assignment list is all thrown off. If I could "place" the FF400 MIDI entry at the end of the list where the SBLive used to reside then projects would probably open up cleanly. Is there some method to address this quandary?? Sonic
post edited by SonicExplorer - 2017/10/18 15:22:30
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/19 02:33:16
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Uh...anyone? Or maybe some suggested terminology to search on?
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frankjcc
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/19 05:45:42
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I believe the only solution is to un-install the drivers and re-install them in the order you want them to appear, now whether the 1st shall be last and the last shall be 1st I don't know, hopefully you remember how they were before you get too far along.
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/19 07:05:18
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I'm not certain (because I can't easily revert back at this point) but it seems like maybe the I/O assignment options are simply alphabetized.
?
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/21 11:30:35
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Guys, any other thoughts? I suspect there HAS to be some way to address this problem. Surely Sonar users can't be expected to manually alter the I/O assignments of every track, bus, etc. within all past projects just because the DAW config changed..... Am I missing or overlooking something.....???
post edited by SonicExplorer - 2017/10/21 12:01:11
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frankjcc
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/21 14:47:33
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If you can provide more details:
Are you speaking only of midi Inputs and Outputs?
Are you trying to recall midi I/O assignments for a Hardware synth/s and Sonar is assigning them incorrectly?
Do you have Vsti tracks that are not playing correctly?
Are your Control Surface midi I/O working out for you?
What works and what does not work?
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Base 57
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/21 15:40:28
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MIDI outputs can be reordered with the "move checked devices to top" button in Preferences. I am not aware of an easy way to reorder the inputs. Perhaps the TTSSeq.ini file can be edited.
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/21 17:28:47
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frankjcc
If you can provide more details:
Are you speaking only of midi Inputs and Outputs?
Are you trying to recall midi I/O assignments for a Hardware synth/s and Sonar is assigning them incorrectly?
Do you have Vsti tracks that are not playing correctly?
Are your Control Surface midi I/O working out for you?
What works and what does not work?
It's not just MIDI. Since I'm not really clear on all the proper terminology probably best to just attempt to describe with more detail, so here goes... Original System: Synths: DFH Superior Cards: RME FF400 (MIDI I/O not active in Sonar), M-Audio Delta66 SBLive (only MIDI "active" in Sonar) New System: Synths: DFH Superior Superior2 Drummer Cards: RME FF400 (MIDI "active" in Sonar), Realtek on-board audio (not "active" in Sonar) All other software and plugins are identical between systems. As you can see there is a considerable difference in the hardware "profiles" between the systems. So picture what happens when I go to open an existing project on the new system. All the track inputs and outputs are all screwed up. For many years I relied mostly on the FF400, which is the sole remaining common factor between the old and new system - so ideally I'd like to be able to open those past projects involving the FF400 and not have to mess with anything. Sonic
post edited by SonicExplorer - 2017/10/21 21:56:33
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/22 00:51:47
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Any way to at least change the device names? That way maybe Sonar would alphabetize them such that the devices could be positioned in a desirable order? Aud.ini file??
Sonic
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frankjcc
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/22 01:43:06
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I'm sorry I can not understand from your post what is happening with the projects that are screwed up despite the added info. DFH, Superior, and any playable instrument that is software we call "soft synths" which differentiates them from hardware synths which requires midi and audio(or just audio but...), if this were the case I can see the problem with things not playing correctly, anyway the soft synths are also call vsti as we of coarse use the vst protocol in windows and sonar, the i is for instrument to also differentiate them from regular vst fx like reverbs, compressors etc. no matter what hardware you change, or what order it's listed in, this certainly should not change the assignment of an "instrument track" or even the output of a midi track that is pointing to a soft synth, are you using instrument tracks?
when you're on a midi track or an instrument track and you select the input, at the bottom it has manage presets, have you been in there and made sure there were no midi devices checked that you are not using to play instruments? for me my mcu pro used to show up as inputs to some soft synths until I unchecked them in this location.
also have you tried to uninstal re-install the one you want at the top? mine are not alphabetized so this is still worth trying.
what i don't see you mention is if you have a dedicated midi controller or a keyboard with built in sounds that you are using, along with DFH, does the soft synths play correctly in the projects? I know you say the I/O's are all messed up, and you mostly want the FF400 assignments to play correctly, but what's not clear is your configuration that describes what the I/O has to do with the sounds that are already in the project.
Off Topic, I have a lot of old projects that does not play correctly due to plugins not being recognized because the plugin id is different even though they are installed and playable. I've upgraded many times and built brand new systems and I've have settled on not ever using on-board keyboard sounds, unless I turn them into audio tracks, things have gotten screwed up for me and I strongly advise a dedicated way of working that is as future proof as possible to avoid these types of problems.
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/22 02:48:17
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Ok, I'll try again, thanks for not giving up on me guys, this is the last obstacle I foresee but it's a very problematic one...
Consider that a channel has inputs and outputs (lists). Those lists are different between the old and new system. And Sonar is not relying on the name aspect in order to make the correct associations on the new system. Rather Sonar is selecting things based on ordinal (best I can tell). So if the 1st item in an input list was selected on the old system the same will be true on the new system - even though the 1st item might be a different device than before (with the desired device now residing in the 2nd location). So when I open a project I now have to go down every channel's input & output list and correct things to point Sonar at the proper entry. It doesn't matter whether it is an physical device or synth, MIDI or Audio, the same paradigm applies.
BTW, I have no problem with plug-ins, everything is identical between old and new system as far as that goes, so no issues there. It's just the channel I/O device/synth lists that are all futzed up.
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frankjcc
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/22 04:09:22
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Okay I understand now, I will 1st caution you just in case it had not occurred to you before you get moving along is if you start changing things to make them work, these new projects will not work once you get things back to normal(assuming we can).
As I stated mine are not alphabetized so strongly urge you to see if you can delete something from the middle of the alphabet and reinstall it to see where it lies in the list.
I know we would like to think Sonar is smart enough to save the name of an I/O just in case things have to get moved around, but I suspect as you stated Sonar only uses the order of the devices to determine position. This should be a ubiquitous topic if it posed the problem that you are describing every time someone changes hardware.
I'll wait to see about the uninstall reinstall to change order of list to see if this solves the problem.
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/22 05:21:46
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I spent easily 100 hours building this DAW and everything is working well, so I'm not keen on uninstalling things for a test. Every time that sort of thing transpires something almost always gets borked up in the system..... residue left in the registry, other unknown consequences, etc.
This I/O re-mapping dilemma has got to be a well-known problem, I just don't know what terms to search on....
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frankjcc
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/22 05:58:26
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/22 16:11:57
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Thanks for that info. But nope, no USB in the picture. The interfaces (both audio and MIDI) at the moment are are using PCI/PCIe Firewire. But similar results as to what that thread stated...things getting all out of whack, but in my case the new layout is static. Which is why I was inquiring as to how to force a change of order (other than possibly re-installing). Surely this issue must have surfaced many times in the past.....I'm really perplexed I can't find anything about it so far..... Here's a more specific example: Assume an RME FF400 interface on both old and new system being used only for audio. And, on the old system the MIDI I/O was handled by an SBLive card (no audio). Whereas the SBLive card is now gone on the new system in place of enabling the MIDI I/O on the RME FF400. So basically there is a common audio interface between old and new system, but the MIDI aspects have changed. This is now causing an ordering issue on the channel I/O selection. Also, if I'm not mistaken, the fact I added a 2nd drum synth instrument to the new system seems to have further caused issues in the channel I/O selection lists.
post edited by SonicExplorer - 2017/10/22 18:08:10
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/22 18:27:55
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☄ Helpfulby seriousfun 2017/10/22 18:52:33
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SonicExplorer
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Re: Any Way to Change I/O Assignment/Order When DAW Config Changes ??
2017/10/23 18:20:28
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Ok, I'm going start another thread about a very specific aspect of this matter as this thread's topic is rather broad and getting a bit convoluted (mostly my own fault). Right now it seems the main obstacle I face is the MIDI output list. I'm going from previously having a MIDI out (the SBLive) to no MIDI out. This throws the channel output list on the new system all out of whack and totally hoses up the ability of opening previous projects with a lot of manually tweaking every track. I either need to select (add) a new MIDI input or find some way to stub a MIDI input at the top of the list so everything else previously below that in the list stays in proper order. New thread on this more specific issue: http://forum.cakewalk.com...-m3673504.aspx#3673504
post edited by SonicExplorer - 2017/10/23 20:59:53
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