Roger that cake. Zoom needs to be repaired on take and automation lanes. +1 for this feature.

I use both automation and take lanes. Automation lanes, I find, are a bit easier to work with then having to move the move back and forth between where I'm in the track and the edit filter. I wish take lanes would work better though. Especially with midi, I like having the ability to work with multiple variations of a phrase, without having to duplicate my track's set up. Though take lanes are quite buggy.

Beepster


Hiya, Keni. Hope you've been well. 

The main thing I like about the lanes is they aren't a jumbled mess like layers were and they more or less stay where they are supposed to and that they don't get smaller and smaller as the takes stack up. With layers once there were too many the tools stopped working because the waveforms got too tiny and you'd have to double click to explode them and that completely defeated the purpose of having layers at that point IMO. For someone like me who is doing a million takes as I work out solos that made layers unusable after a certain point. Also I like the defined Mute button because the old layers mute/solo buttons were far too tiny especially with many takes on the screen (the record button is glitchy like I said and needs to be fixed but if it worked properly I'd use it but it's not a huge deal).

When I started typing this I remembered another major improvement I'd like to see but I forgot because I'm a scatterbrain right now but if I remember I'll post it. We should get a list together for the Bakers so maybe they can tweak it for the patches or the next version. It's be better if they did it with the patches though because I'm pretty happy with X2 in general and don't want to pay again... especially considering I technically paid $200 extra for it compared to some... but I won't gripe about that again. Cheers.

Hi Beepster...

I agree about the issues you mention regarding Layers... those were definitely a pain... I too record many things in large numbers of loops and experienced these issues too...

But they were easier to deal with than the current ones... I used layers all the time even with it's problems, but here it is the second week with Lanes and I've already given up using them (for the most part)...

I do have faith that The Bakers will address these issues in some form... at some time, but I don't think I can hack waiting for a major release... I may be forced back to X1 for the time being... and honestly, outside of a few fixes and the PC plugins, I was far happier with 8.5.3..... I only had bug complaints then as opposed to major feature issues...

I hope that Cakewalk isn't following the PT path as it too has suffered since the sale to Avid.... this is not a good scenario where two of the major players in the DAW market have been subverted by need and desire into the Big Corp world...

I hold the Cakewalk team in the highest regard.... But I don't appreciate some of these recent (X Gen) decisions. I'm all for new features and options but not at the cost of the old features I like and use so regularly... For me this issue (Lanes) should have been handled differently... It's almost a completely different feature and should have been added as such instead of trying to replace such a major tool...

As to paying for it? I've paid for many releases and honestly don't mind as it keeps the programmers working... I'll gladly pay again for the next release if they can (as before) adjust enuf things "now" so that I can work with it until the paid release is ready... I'm far closer to impoverished than I am to well off (not even close to rich), but money comes and goes and I've often paid for my tools instead of my bills.... I've got a bad case of Peter Panitis and refuse to grow up! ;-)

Thanks - I hope you've got PC2A running now... You're gonna love it!

Keni

dke


I like the track lanes but agree they need some work.  For one I'd like a new take first option and I do hate seeing that big empty wasted space above the lanes, but I don't what you would/could put there. :)

Dan 

Hi Dan...

Yeah, the wasted space! they should be the layers as an option! ;-)

Keni

I agree with Beepster's suggestions in this thread. The concept of lanes is great, but they do seem a little buggy at times. I would like to be able to adjust the volume of a lane. Another thing that happened to me recently was splitting and moving parts or clips of lanes did not always work correctly. A couple of saves and restarts had it working again. But for a while, I felt stuck without a solution.

Just adding my two bits to say that I'm actually very appreciative in the new lanes approach in X2. It has made working in what was layers much less confusing. It looks good, it works and the automation lanes are a joy. I was excited about the X2 announcement mostly for the lanes features. They've confirmed my belief the Cakewalk development team is continuing to help us get the music done in an increasingly efficient way. As it turns out, even though I like the lanes features a lot, one of my favorite improvements overall has been the auto track sizing and smart grid. Sounds like a mini improvement, but it's turned into a huge help.

Beepster


Should old derpy Beeps start making a list of feature requests?

I are smrt enough now?

It's about time! I was wondering when you would!

Keni

FastBikerBoy

Beepster


Should old derpy Beeps start making a list of feature requests?

I are smrt enough now?

It has been said on here by someone from CW a while ago (Willy IIRC) that the feature requests and bug report numbers weight where the FR or bug sits in the "importance" list back at the bakery.
 
In the past I've started campaigns on a "MCU for prochannel control" and for "someway of inserting the FX bin into  the PC" feature requests to try and up the numbers. We got FX chains in the PC which is effectively the same thing but how much that FR campaign helped who knows.
 
The best way to get support is to post the feature request wording in a thread here so others can cut and paste it and then link to the FR page. People are inherently lazy (or I am anyway ) and if you do most of the leg work they are more likely to put in the FR as well.

Thanks Karl...

That's a good idea... I guess I have to decide a method or a few methods that might work for me and word it cleanly so that others can use it.... It's been a long time since I had to do any "public" writing other than my songs! ;-)

I'll mull it over for a bit and (hopefully) post something today...

I believe that when a topic stays in controversy publicly, The Bakers realize that it's of significance and do their' best to work that issue.

Over the years many of my "campaigns" have found fruition whether due to my efforts, or not... So I continue my banter in my way which leaves me as much time as possible for my music while doing what I can to help The Bakers understand our needs...

You've always done well... thanks always for your efforts! You do far more than "your share"!

Keni

VariousArtist

Keni


I'm sure there must be some... I am not one of them...

So far Lanes have been anything but useful. they continue to plague my work over an over...

Button disappearing when track is small... How many clicks must I do to see them? when I finally do get the button exposed, I must resize the tracks as the Lanes are off screen...

Zoom is an impossibility on Lanes and changing to only track often leaves edges obscured due to overlaps... Hence, limited editing. I find myself Moving all my lanes to individual tracks, editing, then re-compositing them back to a single track...

Wasted screen real estate... Nice that the track continues to display the envelopes while Lanes are exposed, but mostly a waste of real estate for me. I'm guessing that the multitude of issues in maintaining both Track and Lane attributes is difficult to deal with....

I was much happier with layers... Even with it's issues I could work well... Now? I'm hampered at every turn...

Maybe there's a way to make a user choice between Lanes and Layers? I have been mostly pleased with X2, but the lanes are a big snaffu right in the heeart of things...

Here's hoping The Bakers have some fixes/changes coming that will address these issues as right now this is turning a pleasant experience into a painful one....

Sorry... I had to vent.... I've been fighting with it for hours now...

Keni

I miss layers for audio too...


Lanes for envelopes has been a useful and welcome upgrade, especially as we can still work still do it the "old X1way".  I wish we had that choice for layers too.  Maybe we can petition to have it back ?

I posted another thread with an easy to copy/paste message you can use on Cakewalk's Feature Request page... It includes the link to do so. the more people posting "proper" requests, the more it is likely to be considered a priority task and moved to the top of the list! ;-)

Here's the link to my post:

http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=2697757

Spread the word!

Keni

jm24


Adding all the suggestions, just listed in this thread, LANES will soon be just like TRACKS.

The point of lanes was to have clips of the same type processed in the same way. (Too bad the bugs/issues were never fixed.)

The move to multi-filter-smart-tools led to this. (I still do not like the need to change edit-filters (more menus), to do what was way easier in 8.5 with the not-so-smart-tool.)

Currently lanes are another menu (with a semi-hidden slightly-blue expansion-button), use more screen space, which requires more mouse movement for editing, requires track expansion to know how many clips exist in the track (at least should have a "layers" view), etc.,...

And these comments do not reflect the various bugs, some of which will be fixed. (Some of which will never rise high enough up the list.)

(The De-cluttering mental illness marches on, creating more menus, and wasting more space.)

I'm with you on that!

I wanted Layers fixed, not replaced... All I see from it is a different set of problems and the old system (Layers) was far closer to a solution for me...

So I post my Feature Requests and pray that they get the idea! ;-)

Keni


Keni

Adding all the suggestions, just listed in this thread, LANES will soon be just like TRACKS.

 
That's what I DON'T want to see happen. However, that's exactly what I do...create tracks as I have more control over them than using "takes" with all that goes with them. I really don't use takes/multiple track takes often...I'm a "get it right on the source track" guy and just punch-in until I get it right. It's old school, but it works and I can ctrl+z and then press R at least 30-40 times per minute to re-punch my parts. LOL!
 
-Danny

Danny Danzi

Adding all the suggestions, just listed in this thread, LANES will soon be just like TRACKS.

 
That's what I DON'T want to see happen. However, that's exactly what I do...create tracks as I have more control over them than using "takes" with all that goes with them. I really don't use takes/multiple track takes often...I'm a "get it right on the source track" guy and just punch-in until I get it right. It's old school, but it works and I can ctrl+z and then press R at least 30-40 times per minute to re-punch my parts. LOL!
 
-Danny

Hi Danny...

I understand tho I don't work that way anymore... I guess this is all a moot point for you as it sounds as if you don't use them at all...

When working "focused" at my workstation, I usually do one take at a time I do many undo/record processes until I get what I want...

But when I'm working on my vocals and I'm away from that location, I use it looping as I hone in on my target...

One of the issues which leads me to use layers/lanes is the redundancy of plugins if I use multiple tracks in these operations. I can get around it somewhat if I use a bus and do my processing there hence no plugins needed in the track... But it's not always a satisfactory solution and I must do the estra work of re-organizing after recording is finished...

Luckily, this is now far less of an issue for me as my new DAW has so much headroom in every way that I simply need to drop some old habits I've formed because of my need for workarounds with my older/low powered DAW...

Here's to getting the desired track! No matter how it's achieved! ;-)

Keni

After a few more days of working in X2 I've come to the conclusion that I prefer layers for recording and lanes for working with automation/envelopes.
If they fixed the zoom level of the lanes, then I'd be perfectly happy with them.  Why not have both?

1) No control of which layer remained on top when Layers were closed down. [A widget to choose which lane's clips are visible when collapsed would be ideal IMHO] 2. Rebuild function was clumsy [An option to consolidate clips from select lanes, assuming empty space exists, would be great]

 
Not fair comparisons. These are examples of what needed to be fixed. Not attributes of layers. These issues should have been fixed years ago.
 
Lanes provide some help with these historic bits. But now we have a bunch of new non-helpful functions. EG: track minimized piles clips, not easy to discern number, requires extra attention to see vertical lines,....
 

yo panup

To me, most of your listed items are bugs.  And then some are by-de-clutter-design. And a couple are ommissions.

Most of these will be fixed.

Even so, layers, with the bugs fixed, would still be easier to use, and more in keeping with the real purpose: lots of clips on one track using the same FX and routing.