Are Users Really Enjoying Lanes?

I like the lanes feature, but the button positioning is a massive niggle. Makes no sense whatsoever to me, that.

I like them way better than having them all on the same track ie..in X1!
But you can choose between layers and lanes for yourself and that is great about X2.

FastBikerBoy


I don't use automation lanes much, I never expected to though I always liked the edit filter in track method, thankfully still there.

There are some odd quirks here and there with take lanes especially when adding clips to tracks and clip order when collpased but certainly no worse than the layers "rebuild" fiasco.

The mute/solo is now far better as is re-ordering and generally I find them an improvement but I'd be lying if I said I though they were perfect. I expect they'll improve in time in the same way that the smart tool, PRV and clips etc have.

All IMHO of course and undoubtedly others mileage will vary

Hi Karl...
 
I find myself not using lanes the more I work... I'm now thinking to switch my system to the old format of New Track For Each Take (I hope that's till there) as I must manually do this in order to edit now...
 
I was never pleased with the Edit Filter, but I prefer it to the Lanes approach... I didn't like Lanes before we got them and I like them less now!
 
Yes, I hope they have some things coming to make them more useful, but as they stand right now they are worse than useless... I get absolutely no advantage over the Layers we had... bugs and all.
 
The Bakers chose not to add an "All" feature to Edit Filter Selections (thereby making it more as it was before with this option chosen. Chosing which lane to edit is still a grab bag with the near-black color still given them when not selected. I need to know their' name BEFORE I chose them... not after! Where's the popup so many of us asked for? ...Or better visible colors for them when un-selected...
 
But enuf about the envelopes and their issues as for me that hasn't changed (avoiding the Lanes)... But the Track Lanes are causing me a great deal of work arounds, redundant actions, and overall lack of fluidity in my work...
 
I hated them before and I hate them more now! (I don't like to use the word hate, but I feel that strongly)...
 
Tho I know this is not something that all will agree with, but this issue is another way that it appears Sonar is trying to be "like all the others".... If everyone wanted it like the others, they would simply buy the others instead... It's the differences that give us reasonable choice...
 
There have been so many issues for me since X1, that I would have been much happier with 8.5.3 and the PC plugins made available as VST's... <sigh>....
 
Sorry for burning up space but I'm really annoyed right now after re-working so much because of Lanes.....
 
Keni
 

LANEY


I like them way better than having them all on the same track ie..in X1!
But you can choose between layers and lanes for yourself and that is great about X2.

Huh? How can I switch back to Layers? that would go a long way to helping me!
 
Keni
 

backwoods


Use the old way if you are unsatisfied- case closed.

I'd love to! Someone please tell me how to change back to Layers. I would be perfectly satisfied...
 
Keni
 

Yep, my error Keni, I'm sorry

I use the new lanes. I believe the old way is accessible still but I have moved on now. 

Can anyone do a short video showing an editing process for multi-tracked drums (something with 3+ mics) with crossfades, clip splitting, etc?

I just noticed in Preference>Project>Record> that you can turn off the create new lanes on overlap while loop recording, but still record loops on separate tracks as an option.  Wouldn't this work for you, Keni?

Keni

backwoods


layers button reveals the various layers from where one may edit as one  sees fit

I like them personally.

I think we have a misunderstanding here...
 
The button displayes Lanes, not Layers... and they are almost useless to me in their' present incarnation...
 
Layers were fully zoomable, and were constrained within the track's height regardless of how large/small the track was made... and the button to toggle this function was always visible in the track header...
 
Keni
 

FastBikerBoy

 Chosing which lane to edit is still a grab bag with the near-black color still given them when not selected. I need to know their' name BEFORE I chose them... not after! Where's the popup so many of us asked for? ...Or better visible colors for them when un-selected...

Hi Keni, if you remember I banged on & on (& on & on & on) about a pop up for ghosted envelopes and......... (drum roll) we got it. You just need to hold the shift key down.
 
I believe the modifier is needed to stop a storm of pop-ups when there are multiple envelopes present so makes sense to me.
 
Anyway that one feature has made envelope editing just about perfect for my workflow. YMMV of course. 

Hi Karl...

Thanks for another good tip...
Yes I remember you and others requesting this as well as I did and I'm glad to see that they made an attempt to resolve this...

But for me it's not much different than the need to shift-click on an envelope to find out what it is. Both require two hands and one more click than I had to in the (Older) method before X1. Not a good trade off... But I am grateful it's avaialbe as the Lanes are far worse to me... I know that when I'm editing envelopes, I normally have both hands available, but it still means extra work when you think in terms of arm lift, hand use, etc. It was so easy earlier when simply seeing the color of the envelope was clear enuf for me... I wouldn't need to see the name if I could see the color! I don't understnad why they seem to be reluctant to adjusting the color of the un-selected envelopes. On my screen, these latter appear to be thinner than the active envelopes... Maybe has something to do with that... But there has to be a better solution here too...

I am concerned by the envelope issue but it's far easier for me to deal with than the current Track Lanes... If I was bothered by the Edit Filter in X1, I'm even more bothered by the Lanes in X2...

I'm getting a picture of all my tools being slowly rubbed out with each release... How many more things can they come up with to make worse (for me) before I die? <sigh>...

I was enjoying so many things about X2 until I hit this snag.... and I must admit that I was apprehensive about the Lanes as soon as they announced them. I have not had good experience with lanes anywhere...

Sorry for rambling on about this... I guess I'm more annoyed than I realized...

Thanks again for the tip...

Keni


Funny, but it's a big reason I dislike PT as well... Too many lanes make my screen much harder for me to read/understand at a glance.... Layers were a joy for me in this respect...

carl


Track Lanes need tweaking, they could be useful but at the moment they're very clumsy. 

I'd rather have them both available.
Layers for quick & tight audio clip editing, Lanes for node & automation editing.

Hi Carl...

Yeah, I'm all for that! Having them user selectable has always been my thought with each innovation... They don't always work well for everyone....

[edit]
BTW... I did a Feature Request for The Bakers about this... The more that do the more it rises to the top of the list...

Here's the link... they don't hunt you down for asking... ;-)

http://www.cakewalk.com/S.port/FeatureRequest.aspx
[end edit]

Keni

I like lanes WAY better than layers but yes the need some tweaks.

My suggestions:

1) Fully and independently expandable just like a track

2) Collapse-able to the same height as a fully collapsed track (why they are so big when collapsed is beyond me)

3) Fix some of the glitchy behavior with the record buttons 

4) Have new takes ALWAYS record in a new lane even if there is room in another lane or at least have an option to so it will behave in this manner

5) Be able to move the order of the lanes by dragging them just like tracks

6) Be able to combine lanes

7) Be able to clone and copy/drag lanes like tracks

8) Have a volume control

9) Well I'm sure I could think of more stuff.

Essentially I'd like them to behave more like tracks than they do now and it's quite possible they already do some of the stuff I mentioned but I just haven't learned how to yet. 

So yeah... love the lanes but I hope Cake keeps working on them. Cheers.

Keni

carl


Track Lanes need tweaking, they could be useful but at the moment they're very clumsy. 

I'd rather have them both available.
Layers for quick & tight audio clip editing, Lanes for node & automation editing.

Hi Carl...

Yeah, I'm all for that! Having them user selectable has always been my thought with each innovation... They don't always work well for everyone....

[edit]
BTW... I did a Feature Request for The Bakers about this... The more that do the more it rises to the top of the list...

Here's the link... they don't hunt you down for asking... ;-)

http://www.cakewalk.com/S.port/FeatureRequest.aspx
[end edit]

Keni

I put in a request for it last week, I hope others will too.

mleghorn


Copying MIDI from one take lane to another in the same track is very buggy. Notice that if you select some MIDI from one take lane, and ctrl-drag the selection down to another take lane (in the same track), the MIDI in the source take lane disappears.

It's back to X1 for me until Cakewalk fixes this.

Not seeing that here. The only take lane issue I find strange (other than the arrangement when collapsed one)  is dragging in a new clip to the track doesn't create a new lane but puts the clip on lane one. It's not something I do often but something that to me is unexpected.

 

Beepster


I like lanes WAY better than layers but yes the need some tweaks.

My suggestions:

1) Fully and independently expandable just like a track

2) Collapse-able to the same height as a fully collapsed track (why they are so big when collapsed is beyond me)

3) Fix some of the glitchy behavior with the record buttons 

4) Have new takes ALWAYS record in a new lane even if there is room in another lane or at least have an option to so it will behave in this manner

5) Be able to move the order of the lanes by dragging them just like tracks

6) Be able to combine lanes

7) Be able to clone and copy/drag lanes like tracks

8) Have a volume control

9) Well I'm sure I could think of more stuff.

Essentially I'd like them to behave more like tracks than they do now and it's quite possible they already do some of the stuff I mentioned but I just haven't learned how to yet. 

So yeah... love the lanes but I hope Cake keeps working on them. Cheers.

Hi Beepster...

I agree on all these issues... and if they get done in a reasonable time I might not mind lanes.... Right now I'm very uncomfortable because of it...

What is it about the lanes that makes it better for you? I keep hearing talk of the mute and solo, but we had that with Layers as well... The ability to record directly into a selected lane? That's about the only feature I can see that's better tho I can't say I have a lot of need for it. Especially not at the cost!

Here's hoping The Bakers are already on top of this and have a major overhaul of it already included in the next update...

Keni

Hiya, Keni. Hope you've been well. 

The main thing I like about the lanes is they aren't a jumbled mess like layers were and they more or less stay where they are supposed to and that they don't get smaller and smaller as the takes stack up. With layers once there were too many the tools stopped working because the waveforms got too tiny and you'd have to double click to explode them and that completely defeated the purpose of having layers at that point IMO. For someone like me who is doing a million takes as I work out solos that made layers unusable after a certain point. Also I like the defined Mute button because the old layers mute/solo buttons were far too tiny especially with many takes on the screen (the record button is glitchy like I said and needs to be fixed but if it worked properly I'd use it but it's not a huge deal).

When I started typing this I remembered another major improvement I'd like to see but I forgot because I'm a scatterbrain right now but if I remember I'll post it. We should get a list together for the Bakers so maybe they can tweak it for the patches or the next version. It's be better if they did it with the patches though because I'm pretty happy with X2 in general and don't want to pay again... especially considering I technically paid $200 extra for it compared to some... but I won't gripe about that again. Cheers.