JohanSebatianGremlin
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BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
I know there's a pinned thread and I've tried to weed through it to get caught up but didn't find much in the way of real answers. So I'm hopping someone in the know can summarize and bring me up to speed. What do we know about BandLab and their plans as far as Sonar goes?
Do they plan to have Sonar continue to exist as it is with a new name or do they intend to reinvent it into something else? Have they said anywhere? From what I'm reading, they've been pretty skimpy on details so far.
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change. -microapp i7, 32gb RAM, Win10 64bit, RME UFX
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abacab
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 14:38:33
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All we know is in post #1 in the pinned thread. Meng has chimed in a few other places to attempt to clarify, but he has stayed on point with his announcements. If you want to see them, just search his posts. Otherwise we are all waiting for the next announcement. All else is pure speculation. 
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Karyn
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 14:41:51
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All the answers we've been given are in post #1 of the sticky Hello thread. We've not been told anymore.
To summarise... Sonar will continue under an as yet undisclosed name, working title "The Daw Formerly Known As Sonar". All current owners of Sonar will be able to continue with the new version from BandLab as if nothing changed.
I'm fairly sure that the first release will not be much more of a re-branding exercise, both in name and look, but also to switch backend systems (authorisation, user accounts, etc.,) but you never know, there could be some surprises thrown in which would be nice.
Mekashi Futo. Get 10% off all Waves plugins.Current DAW. i7-950, Gigabyte EX58-UD5, 12Gb RAM, 1Tb SSD, 2x2Tb HDD, nVidia GTX 260, Antec 1000W psu, Win7 64bit, Studio 192, Digimax FS, KRK RP8G2, Sonar Platinum
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Kamikaze
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 14:45:46
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Meng said 4-6 weeks 3 weeks ago, He also said in his last announcement that things were mving faster than expected. So maybe will find ut after 4 weeks, which is this weekend.
As for as I am aware there has been on indication of hover boards and coffee mugs, but an interest in supporting Roland's Vs Studio, so I think they are keeping the Hoverbard news under their hats
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JohanSebatianGremlin
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 14:49:28
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Actually surprises are what I'm afraid of. They're a web company trying to grow their musician/social media website. If Sonar continues to exist, but oh by the way you can only save your project to their website and oh by the way we retain full use rights to everything you upload... 
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change. -microapp i7, 32gb RAM, Win10 64bit, RME UFX
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abacab
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 15:14:42
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JohanSebatianGremlin
Actually surprises are what I'm afraid of. They're a web company trying to grow their musician/social media website. If Sonar continues to exist, but oh by the way you can only save your project to their website and oh by the way we retain full use rights to everything you upload...
Please read the sticky again. It has been clearly stated that the social media thing is optional, as well as this: in case you've missed my posts around the place, it will absolutely be a desktop application so please don't worry about it becoming (cloud/web)-only 
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abacab
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 15:18:34
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JohanSebatianGremlin
oh by the way we retain full use rights to everything you upload...
Not gonna happen. This: Also, we had some questions in earlier forum threads about BandLab’s Terms of Use, particularly around ownership, licensing and copyright.
For avoidance of doubt: Nothing you share on BandLab belongs to us - we take no ownership of your creation. Our T&Cs regarding BandLab getting a license to use content purely allow BandLab as a service to actually function - i.e. we need a license for BandLab as a service to play back your own song to you, or anyone else you share it with. Based on feedback in this forum we have clarified these points in layman's terms in our Terms of Use - so thanks to those who took the time to read our terms and give us feedback - we are always open to your comments and finding ways that we can do better.
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JohanSebatianGremlin
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 15:44:10
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abacab
JohanSebatianGremlin
Actually surprises are what I'm afraid of. They're a web company trying to grow their musician/social media website. If Sonar continues to exist, but oh by the way you can only save your project to their website and oh by the way we retain full use rights to everything you upload...
Please read the sticky again. It has been clearly stated that the social media thing is optional, as well as this:
in case you've missed my posts around the place, it will absolutely be a desktop application so please don't worry about it becoming (cloud/web)-only Yep, read all that. Two things though. 1. Words are cheap. Writing it on a forum doesn't mean its going to happen. Lifetime updates anyone? 2. I read the post you quoted above. But I also read this: Noel BorthwickWith BandLab's deeply integrated social platform and vision there could be some truly exciting possibilities that I look forward to exploring in the near future.
I think you can all be confident that not only will SONAR live on but that it will evolve in ways we didn't imagine. Evolving in ways we didn't imagine can mean a lot of things. Not all of them are good.
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change. -microapp i7, 32gb RAM, Win10 64bit, RME UFX
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John
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:06:31
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☄ Helpfulby abacab 2018/03/26 16:20:36
It really is very aggravating to have questions asked then well answered and yet disbelief is the result. One can speculate till the cows come home. What you have to realize is we are far better off now then we were a few months ago. Its important to understand the enormous work Bandlab has ahead of them. The Cakewalk Company is no more Bandlad is starting from scratch to issue a new Sonar. I do not envy them one bit. What we can do is wish them luck and as smooth a transition as they can have. Our support can expedite this by not asking repeatedly the same questions over and over again.
A little faith and patience will go a long way.
Also its preposterous that a title stating "for those that are out of the loop" is posted. No one is out of the loop. All you have to do is read what is embarrassingly obvious in the first post in the sticky above. If anyone is out of the loop its because they choose to be.
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scook
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:09:54
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☄ Helpfulby abacab 2018/03/26 16:20:38
JohanSebatianGremlin
Yep, read all that. Two things though.
1. Words are cheap. Writing it on a forum doesn't mean its going to happen. Lifetime updates anyone?
2. I read the post you quoted above.
...
Evolving in ways we didn't imagine can mean a lot of things. Not all of them are good.
If you choose not to believe what they say and assume a future you do not like, what is the point of this thread?
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pwalpwal
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:10:22
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☄ Helpfulby abacab 2018/03/26 16:21:01
how about not just turning this into another rant/speculation thread
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scook
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:13:04
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Yes, it has been hijacked by the OP. It is not a "What do we know" thread. It is really a "surprises are what I'm afraid of" thread. Nothing can be done about that, the future is not ours to see.
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pwalpwal
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:15:44
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yeah, our posts crossed i think, but at least there are plenty of other speculation/rant threads to join in on already
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abacab
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:23:13
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☄ Helpfulby John 2018/03/26 16:24:00
I suppose that even if Meng started to give away $100 bills, there would still be complaints...
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JohanSebatianGremlin
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:38:31
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John
A little faith and patience will go a long way.
Yeah, I don't do faith. Never have. As for the bit about my post being preposterous, well I disagree. When I said I'm out of the loop meant just that. I've been trying to learn a new DAW and I've not been on the forum for months. I get an email about assets being sold and I came back to get the scoop. I read the pinned thread which is 1% information 99% for he's a jolly good fellow. And some of that 1% of info is vague and open ended. And then I see lots of other threads here on the subject which are similar, very little info, lots of assumptions and lots of hip hip hooray we're saved happy days are here again. So I simply asked, what is known rather than assumed. And it seems that's now been answered. Not much at all is known. Someone bought the IP assets. That's it. That's all we know. They say they intend to keep them as desktop platform. Nice if that turns out to be true. They say they'll offer support. Also nice if true. There is talk of taking the product in new directions but no details on that so could be good, could be bad. Thanks to all for helping to clear that up. My apologies if you found this annoying (although no one said you had to respond).
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change. -microapp i7, 32gb RAM, Win10 64bit, RME UFX
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35mm
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:39:25
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☄ Helpfulby Zargg 2018/03/27 11:43:48
You ask for a summary and then when you get one you go all conspiracy theory on us The BL terms & conditions are standard for this kind of service - they are only getting your permission in a legally watertight way to stream your music or distribute it according to your wishes. You still have full control of it. Regarding only being able to save projects to BL - that would be crazy. Bandlab.com doesn't seem to have a revenue stream. The new DAW and associated software is a sellable product that can generate a lot of revenue. Having it only be able to work with the Bandlab web service would make the DAW far less sellable. There will undoubtedly be close integration with Bandlab services for those who want them, but I am sure it will remain a standalone product in order to maximise sales and Bandlab.com will be a great place for them to generate sales as well. Another reason why I am sure it will remain standalone is that BL have purchased it all at a very cut down price (I suspect) and if they can build it back into a great product with a big customer base again, it's value will go up massively as an asset and they could sell it on to another company for a huge profit if one day they decide too. Of course, all we can do at the moment is speculate and that always leads to worry and suspicion. But, the great news is that Cakewalk software has been saved by what appears to be a good company owned by a very motivated, visionary guy who genuinely seems to have a personal interest in this software, seems to be one of us and listens to his customer's wishes! On top of that the main players from the Cakewalk team are back in the driving seat, but this time they haven't got their arms tied behind their backs by Gibson. That's a big improvement on where we were last November and in a week or two, we will know a lot more about where it's heading and I think the only way to feel about that is with hope and excitement. I don't think we should get too excited about the first release of the new DAW formally known as Sonar though. It will be Sonar but rebranded, have BL integration added and LANDR (and maybe Soundcloud) integration removed. I suspect it will have the last update applied (the one we never got). It is possible we may lose some 3rd party plugins if there are licensing issues which can't be overcome before release and there may even be some new plugins to give a bit of wow factor to keep us all aboard. But given the timeframe, I don't think we can expect too much and I think some people seem to be expecting a massive redevelopment to come out any day which is just unrealistic. To be completely honest, I don't yet know if I will be coming back to Sonar as I moved over to another DAW that's working out great for me. But I am very pleased Sonar has been rescued and I am excited to see what comes of it. If it looks like it's heading in the right direction as time goes on I'm sure I will be back.
Splat, Win 10 64bit and all sorts of musical odds and sods collected over the years, but still missing a lot of my old analogue stuff I sold off years ago.
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belltunes
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:50:14
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☄ Helpfulby tlw 2018/03/26 22:00:13
Too much speculation and paranoia! Let's wait for more info. Some of these 'what if' 'Oh no' 'but, but' threads are pointless...
It will be what it will be and if some of you find that don't like it just move on.
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JohanSebatianGremlin
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 16:59:53
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35mm
There will undoubtedly be close integration with Bandlab services for those who want them, but I am sure it will remain a standalone product in order to maximise sales and Bandlab.com will be a great place for them to generate sales as well. So everyone's complaining about me starting this thread, but this is exactly what I'm talking about. The quote above is stated as though its fact but its nothing more than speculation. Another reason why I am sure it will remain standalone is that BL have purchased it all at a very cut down price (I suspect) You suspect. The tread title asked for what we know, and you offer what you suspect. On top of that the main players from the Cakewalk team are back in the driving seat, but this time they haven't got their arms tied behind their backs by Gibson. And you know this how? It will be Sonar but rebranded, have BL integration added and LANDR (and maybe Soundcloud) integration removed. I suspect it will have the last update applied (the one we never got). It is possible we may lose some 3rd party plugins if there are licensing issues which can't be overcome before release and there may even be some new plugins to give a bit of wow factor to keep us all aboard. Thanks for all those facts. Oh wait...
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change. -microapp i7, 32gb RAM, Win10 64bit, RME UFX
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Skyline_UK
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 17:19:23
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My stuff Intel Sandy Bridge i7 2600 @ 3.4GHz, 4 cores, 8 threads, 16GB RAM.OS & Programs drive: 240GB SSD
Data drives: 1 x 1TB drive RAID mirrored, plus extra 1TB data drive
Windows 10 Home 64 bit
Cakewalk by BandLab 64 bit, Studio One 3, Band In A Box 2016, Ozone 8+ too many other pluginsBandLab page
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JohanSebatianGremlin
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 17:26:50
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Skyline_UK
Another idiot blocked.
Oh the shame. How will I find the strength to go on living?
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change. -microapp i7, 32gb RAM, Win10 64bit, RME UFX
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Meng
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 17:28:15
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☼ Best Answerby robert_e_bone 2018/03/27 13:38:27
Hey Johan, if you read the posts I've contributed on this forum, there are a lot of questions that have been answered in context that would normally be considered factual.
But I agree, words are cheap, and I am fully aware you don't have any reason to trust me yet. I'm a firm believer that trust is earned, not given - I suggest you wait a little bit more and you'll see what we put into action and then you can make a decision whether we've stood by our word or not. 😊
Many of the points in the previous post by 35mm have been addressed by me in posts on this forum, it's not pure speculation.
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JohanSebatianGremlin
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 17:40:29
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Thank you Meng, you hit the nail on the head. I've no reason to trust your word yet and I don't. But that can change once words turn into actions.
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change. -microapp i7, 32gb RAM, Win10 64bit, RME UFX
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Brian Walton
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 17:47:13
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JohanSebatianGremlin
Thank you Meng, you hit the nail on the head. I've no reason to trust your word yet and I don't. But that can change once words turn into actions.
He took the action of buying the assets of our beloved company/product, and has posted numerous reassuring pieces about the intent. Those are actions whether you choose to recognize them or not.
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Anderton
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 17:48:41
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35 mm's "speculation" is based on much that has been stated explicitly in this forum. You asked for a summary, you got it. Come back next month, and I think you will find 35 mm's "speculation" will be very close to 100% on target.
I realize some people want to find a cloud in every silver lining, but c'mon. These kind of transitions are not easy, and the legalities are time-consuming. It's been only about a month since the announcement. Of course things can go wrong over time. Commodore computers, anyone? Toys R Us? Guitar Center? Gibson? Fender? But to assume they will go south before the ink is dry on the agreements seems pointless.
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Anderton
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 17:52:12
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☄ Helpfulby simeon 2018/03/26 23:01:27
JohanSebatianGremlin
Thank you Meng, you hit the nail on the head. I've no reason to trust your word yet and I don't. But that can change once words turn into actions.
You obviously have not researched who Meng is, and what he has accomplished so far in addition to BandLab. He is a doer and he has proven that with his actions. He's too modest to go through all that here. The facts speak for themselves for those who bother to look them up.
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sharke
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 18:02:26
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So if the answers aren't given in any of the stickies or countless other threads which talk about the same thing, what makes you think they'll magically appear in this one? Did you think that those who have the "golden answers" have been sitting around waiting for a thread entitled "What do we know?"
It seems like you've already read those answers, given that you said you read the stickies. So the whole purpose in starting this thread is to construct yourself a platform on which to express your skepticism of the statements Bandlab have made thus far.
Sonar will be taken in the direction that its new owners feel is the necessary direction to make it profitable. The Sonar that you know and love - the program as it stands today and everything associated with it - was clearly not profitable enough, and hence a significant change in direction is inevitable. You'll either like the results or not.
One thing's for sure - there are those among Sonar's long term die-hard "I never connect my DAW the internet" crowd who will get themselves all of a flutter at the very thought of any cloud/social media/collaboration element in the new app, and some who will whip themselves into a frenzy of paranoia at the thought of BandLab spying on them, or of nefarious parties getting their hands on their music and somehow claiming ownership of it when they're not looking. Such concerns are likely to be greatly exaggerated and/or completely unfounded, but if you're so concerned about using a DAW that has no connectivity or contact with anyone or anything else then there are plenty to choose from.
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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scook
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 18:19:47
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JohanSebatianGremlin
no one said you had to respond
This is a public forum and people responded accurately to your initial post. You too did not have to respond and in doing so change the subject, insult the people who have communicated about the transition, fabricate a future you do not like and then complain about it. I will keep your admonition in mind, I suggest you do the same.
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jpetersen
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 18:29:31
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Every response bumps this to the top.
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abacab
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 18:35:09
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☄ Helpfulby Zargg 2018/03/27 11:45:13
meng
Hey Johan, if you read the posts I've contributed on this forum, there are a lot of questions that have been answered in context that would normally be considered factual.
But I agree, words are cheap, and I am fully aware you don't have any reason to trust me yet. I'm a firm believer that trust is earned, not given - I suggest you wait a little bit more and you'll see what we put into action and then you can make a decision whether we've stood by our word or not. 😊
Many of the points in the previous post by 35mm have been addressed by me in posts on this forum, it's not pure speculation.
Meng, you are truly a class act, and I admire your patience and tactfulness! 
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JohanSebatianGremlin
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Re: BandLab thread for those out of the loop: What do we know
2018/03/26 18:52:58
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Anderton
JohanSebatianGremlin
Thank you Meng, you hit the nail on the head. I've no reason to trust your word yet and I don't. But that can change once words turn into actions.
You obviously have not researched who Meng is, and what he has accomplished so far in addition to BandLab. He is a doer and he has proven that with his actions.
He's too modest to go through all that here. The facts speak for themselves for those who bother to look them up.
I've read up on him. Still skeptical.
If gear was the determining factor, we would all have a shelf full of Grammies and a pocket full of change. -microapp i7, 32gb RAM, Win10 64bit, RME UFX
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