Billy Buck
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 08:06:13
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ORIGINAL: alvie
Anyone as try Songsmith from Microsoft research ?
It is based on the BIAB engine.
Yes, PG Music actually developed the program for microsoft. They even sell add-on paks for Songsmith that are virtually identical to their BIAB counterparts. ;) I will also say that I am a longtime BIAB user and the latest 2010 version totally RAWKS! I love the RealTracks & RealDrums functionality. I think of BIAB 2010 as having instant access to my own personal studio session musicians. Just like going into a recording studio and hiring some professional session cats and handing them some lead sheets for that new song that you just composed and then they go to town and laydown that killer track. Same thing with BIAB, you layout your leadsheet (type in the style, Key, time signature, tempo, chord changes, intro, outro, intrumentation, etc......) and have your in the box session cats laydown that next track. If you don't like it, you can go back and make changes. Maybe the style is wrong, the tempo too slow, some chord changes or maybe you want that bass player to play in another style. The options are limitless and you only get out of it what you put in. The more knowledgable & creative you are with the program the better and more realistic the end results will be. I always end up exporting my MIDI & RealTracks individually and importing them into SONAR for further recording and mixing. BIAB & SONAR do make a great combo for creating, mixing & finalizing projects.
post edited by Billy Buck - 2009/03/18 08:28:14
Win 10 Pro x64 | i7 4770k | ASUS Z87 Deluxe/Quad w/ TB 2.0 | 16GB Corsair RAM | Apollo Twin Duo USB | UAD Satellite Octo USB | UAD-2 Quad + UAD-2 Solo PCIe | SONAR Platinum x64 ∞ | REAPER 5 x64| TranzPort
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garrigus
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 08:50:42
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ORIGINAL: Billy Buck
I will also say that I am a longtime BIAB user and the latest 2010 version totally RAWKS! I love the RealTracks & RealDrums functionality. I think of BIAB 2010 as having instant What 2010 version? I have the latest and that's 2009, no? Or are you a beta tester?  Scott -- Scott R. Garrigus - Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series. Get Sonar 8 Power - Today! Go to: http://www.garrigus.com/ - http://www.musictechshop.com/ - http://www.cooltechshop.com/ Publisher of DigiFreq - free music technology newsletter. Win a free SoundTech Vocal Trainer Package, go to: http://www.digifreq.com/digifreq/ Publisher of NewTechReview - free consumer technology newsletter. Win a free i2i Stream Wireless Music Pack, go to: http://www.newtechreview.com/newtechreview/
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tsanders
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 09:43:56
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jazaddict - Thanks - BTW the bass is real - I play both bass and guitar, but the keys and drums are BIAB. Many times I will use EZ Drummer's clips and the keys end up being the only remaining artifact from BIAB. But it is the starting point for just about all of my stuff.
<<TS>>
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Roflcopter
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 10:05:43
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Anyone who wants to criticize PG Music for misleading folks about pushing a button to get great music is free to do so I don't think anyone here did any such thing, but it's always a good thing if people don't expect more than they get, based on assumption. It is a great tool, but not perfect or definitive. That Mysong (not Songcraft) kinda blows it out of the water in some aspects. That does not detract from its value to me in any way. I'd sorely miss it. 
I'm a perfectionist, and perfect is a skinned knee.
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Billy Buck
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 10:26:35
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ORIGINAL: garrigus
What 2010 version? I have the latest and that's 2009, no? Or are you a beta tester?
I meant the 2009 BIAB. Although, I am sure the 2010 version will be here soon enough come November. I got the Ultra (inlcudes all the RealTrack & RealDrum audio files) upgrade that comes already pre-installed on a nifty thin 2.5 USB external HD. It is quite convenient than having to install 10's of GB's worth of data from DVD's and use up valuable space on my internal HD's and it did not cost than much extra either.
Win 10 Pro x64 | i7 4770k | ASUS Z87 Deluxe/Quad w/ TB 2.0 | 16GB Corsair RAM | Apollo Twin Duo USB | UAD Satellite Octo USB | UAD-2 Quad + UAD-2 Solo PCIe | SONAR Platinum x64 ∞ | REAPER 5 x64| TranzPort
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Skyline_UK
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 10:34:37
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Ever since I've been using BIAB (c. ten years) I've seen almost daily criticism on various forums (not least on the Yahoo BIAB Group when a newbie joins) that its output is 'lame', 'cheesy', etc. etc. These comments invariably come from newcomers who don't know the difference between MIDI data and the sounds a MIDI-compatible piece of equipment can make. I output it to a Roland Fantom X6 and BOSS Dr-880, and the sounds are just luvverly and realistic thank you very much, with BIAB's part in the proceedings being just excellent.
As a guitarist I use BIAB to help with mainly keyboard, strings and brass parts which I then import into Sonar for amending as the mood/song suits. Also, auditioning its different styles is a real boon in composing as it very often suggests new avenues that I wouldn't have thought of on my own. It's a must-have product in my view, despite its bias towards country and jazz.
My stuff Intel Sandy Bridge i7 2600 @ 3.4GHz, 4 cores, 8 threads, 16GB RAM.OS & Programs drive: 240GB SSD
Data drives: 1 x 1TB drive RAID mirrored, plus extra 1TB data drive
Windows 10 Home 64 bit
Cakewalk by BandLab 64 bit, Studio One 3, Band In A Box 2016, Ozone 8+ too many other pluginsBandLab page
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riojazz
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 11:32:55
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I think Scott was kidding about Billy Buck's '2010 version' of BIAB. Anyway, if PG Music follows its recent pattern, there may be a 2009.5 release this summer, and then the 2010 release in December 2009. Beta testing takes place in November.
Software: Cakewalk by Bandlab; Adobe Audition; Band-in-A-Box audiophile; Izotope Ozone; Encore; Melodyne; Win 10 Pro, 64-bit. Hardware: Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 2nd; Roland Integra-7; TCE Finalizer; Presonus Central Station, Behringer X-Touch. Home built i7 with 16 GB RAM, SSDs.
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Roflcopter
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 11:42:07
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I output it to a Roland Fantom X6 and BOSS Dr-880, and the sounds are just luvverly and realistic thank you very much, with BIAB's part in the proceedings being just excellent. I output it to just about every synth I own. Getting a great sound should not be an issue for the average Sonar user. But the sound quality was not my reason for nitpicking: it was the quality of chords chosen in progressions. Mike Mc_Cue has one of those Flash gadgets on his site that lets you pick 'nice' chords in a progression, and I was doing some research on automating that, and give it a memory and a database of nice ones etc. when I came across that Mysong. I just think that specific part of BiaB could see some improvement, 's all. The first real programmable toolbox with a bit more abstraction than C, that lets me do the same as what I use BiaB for, but through code, and I'm probably instantly hooked, never to look back, because that would suit me even better. Currently investigating a Java toolbox that's supposed to be getting close to that ideal.
I'm a perfectionist, and perfect is a skinned knee.
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garrigus
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 11:44:03
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ORIGINAL: Billy Buck
I got the Ultra (inlcudes all the RealTrack & RealDrum audio files) upgrade that comes already pre-installed on a nifty thin 2.5 USB external HD. It is quite convenient than having to install 10's of GB's worth of data from DVD's and use up valuable space on my internal HD's and it did not cost than much extra either.
Yep, same here, except I got the Ultra Audiophile edition. I too really love that it comes on a separate drive and doesn't require full installation. I think PG Music is doing a great job with its products. BIAB is a must-have in my opinion because its not just an accompaniment program. It can be used for song ideas, music education, quick background music for video work, etc. It has so many different features, I don't know how they keep coming up with new stuff each year. The only thing that I think could use some updating is the interface... Scott -- Scott R. Garrigus - Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series. Get Sonar 8 Power - Today! Go to: http://www.garrigus.com/ - http://www.musictechshop.com/ - http://www.cooltechshop.com/ Publisher of DigiFreq - free music technology newsletter. Win a free SoundTech Vocal Trainer Package, go to: http://www.digifreq.com/digifreq/ Publisher of NewTechReview - free consumer technology newsletter. Win a free i2i Stream Wireless Music Pack, go to: http://www.newtechreview.com/newtechreview/
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stratcat33511
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 12:26:55
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Mike Kohlgraf
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/03/18 12:47:30
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Tau Zero
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Jammer Pro [was RE: Band-in-a-Box users]
2009/03/22 00:58:13
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ORIGINAL: mudgel
Then there's Jammer Pro which now has a version that works as a VST plugin within SONAR.
I bought BIAB 6 *years* ago, but discovered it felt "stiff" to me. Since then, I've been using SoundTrek's Jammer Pro 4 and 5. Haven't made the upgrade to v.6 because I still need to master JP5's non-DOS character interface. I've been hammering out a fight song for the new high school in town using MIDIsoft Recording Session 1.08 from 1993 (embarrassed), JP4, and SONAR 7. (Needless to say, it's been *interesting.*) ;-D Cheers,
post edited by Tau Zero - 2009/03/22 01:05:49
Jay Goemmer "Tau Zero" Twin Falls, Idaho, USA Cakewalk SONAR 7 (Windows XP), Roland TD-6V Drums, Yamaha DJX Keyboard, Hondo "Alien" Bass Guitar, Alesis HR-16 Drum Machine
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DX1451
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RE: Jammer Pro [was RE: Band-in-a-Box users]
2009/03/22 17:32:13
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Just save the file as MIDI and then import into SONAR. Saves a load of "writing" time. You just need to make sure the project option in SONAR matches the BIAB MIDI export of 120 ppq. BIAB imports audio to use in the audio harmonizer. It's slick and can be used for creating loops. :)
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stratman70
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/09/07 17:42:04
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DaveClark
Hi all,
I completely agree with the fans of BIAB and will attempt to correct a *possible* misimpression made by Noel's post. BIAB is also quite good for MIDI, and has been for a long time. Not only can you use existing styles, create hybrid styles, etc. but you can create entirely new styles with all your own playing. Therefore what you do with this valuable tool and how much you get out of it is ultimately up to you, the user.
Blaming BIAB for bad music is like blaming a stove for bad cooking or blaming a saw for bad carpentry. Yes, if you simply push the buttons and accept the VSC DXi output to WAV, then you'll not necessarily get a great work any more than just throwing something in an oven for two minutes at 150 F will get you great meal. There are far, far more possibilities than this simplistic approach. Anyone who wants to criticize PG Music for misleading folks about pushing a button to get great music is free to do so, but not much attention will be paid by those of us who feel we understand what PG Music is really trying to accomplish and what real software can actually hope to accomplish along the lines of compositional assistance.
Mike's claim about BIAB being "unmatched" is absolutely correct. There are some pale imitations out there; I am not aware of any that offer anywhere near the sheer number of capabilities and understanding of both music theory and music heuristics that BIAB does.
Regards,
Dave Clark
+1 Had CWPA9 and BIAB 5 about the same time. Never looked back. Creating your own styles is fabulous and is basically YOU :-)
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Guitarhacker
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/09/08 14:50:20
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It's simply a tool.... how you use it or abuse it is up to you.
My website & music: www.herbhartley.com MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface BMI/NSAI "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer "
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bdickens
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/09/09 12:25:14
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BIAB is a great tool but you need to learn how to use it to its best advantage.. If you expect to just type in a chord progression, pick a style and have it do all the work, you are going to be sorely disappointed.
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Da=man
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/09/10 08:37:03
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I have used BIAB back in the days of the floppy disk. (mid 90's) Can't remember the version number.
I have gotten the most recent version and am amazed at all the add ons. I have always exported the midi file from BIAB and brought into Cakewalk to manipulate.
BIAB is the best program out there for quick backing tracks.
I'm really getting swallowed by the choices at the moment with all this new software. I know it's exciting and inspiring but at the same time I had a set up years ago with only 128 midi sounds and could create a lot of good tunes.
Hmmmmmmm..... The good ol days.
Sonar 8.5.3 PE ( More than a decade of Cakewalk products including Sonar LE, Cakewalk Pro Audio 9 and Home Studio 7) Roland Fantom x8, Yamaha MG82cx Mixer, Edirol MA-15D Speakers, M-Audio 24/96 soundcard, 2.8GHZ Core 2 Duo, 4G Ram, Roland TD-3 VDrums, 09 Band in a Box
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Guitarhacker
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2009/09/14 12:14:57
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Byron, you are correct. Like any tool, you must understand it, and know how to use it properly. I have the RealTracks also. I write in BB, open that in RT and export the tracks I need and like into MC4. Sometimes however, the tracks just don't turn out right or have things about them that I don't like so I have to return to BB and rework some stuff there.
If you simply type in chords and expect outstanding results you WILL most likely be disappointed. The result of that is almost always a very midi sounding track/song. When you understand it and work with it, the results can be outstanding.
My website & music: www.herbhartley.com MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface BMI/NSAI "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer "
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maikii
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2011/12/17 17:36:58
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After reading about it in this thread, I looked up MySong. It seems to have been the research predecessor of the Microsoft app currently called Songsmith.
It is also said in this thread, that Songsmith is developed for Microsft by PG Music, ,makers of Band-In-A-Box.
In one message of this thread, something is written which says that MySong is better in some ways than BIAB. Is that true, if develiped by the same folks at PG Music?
Or was MySong actually something quite different from Songsmith? If so, where could one download MySong?
Thank you.
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tomixornot
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RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2011/12/17 21:13:53
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I was viewing Songsmith at youtube after reading this thread. MySong seems similar to Songsmith (create song via melody). Auto generated music via melody (Songsmith, MySong?) vs using BIAB : Easier to use Better, will depend if the user is a musician or not. I have a good laugh watching this : <youtube link removed> Edit : I have removed the link, out of respect for the product, as it is meant to help none musician to come up with a full arrangement with just a melody, although it may sound funny..
post edited by tomixornot - 2011/12/19 02:52:19
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myrio
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Re: RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2013/07/12 16:51:14
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nelcatjar
WOW! All these BIAB users chiming in... I had no idea people used it so much, and the same way I am, creating basic MIDI tracks and importing into Cakewalk. All that to say, (as the thread starter) I think my latency issue is not there now. I don't know, it must have fixed itself. I imported another midi file and recorded some audio, and it sounded in sync.
To answer the question before, I have a DELL XPS400 and am using an E-MU 1616m.
But please continue your discussion on BIAB. I love to hear your wonderful and exciting insite.
Ok, I have band in a box 2013 and emu1616m and sonar x1 and yamaha clavinova/ Ok, my midi works fine with X1 but not with band in a box. Can you help me in anyway?
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myrio
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Re: RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2013/07/12 16:51:18
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nelcatjar
WOW! All these BIAB users chiming in... I had no idea people used it so much, and the same way I am, creating basic MIDI tracks and importing into Cakewalk. All that to say, (as the thread starter) I think my latency issue is not there now. I don't know, it must have fixed itself. I imported another midi file and recorded some audio, and it sounded in sync.
To answer the question before, I have a DELL XPS400 and am using an E-MU 1616m.
But please continue your discussion on BIAB. I love to hear your wonderful and exciting insite.
Ok, I have band in a box 2013 and emu1616m and sonar x1 and yamaha clavinova/ Ok, my midi works fine with X1 but not with band in a box. Can you help me in anyway?
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myrio
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Re: RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2013/07/12 16:51:21
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nelcatjar
WOW! All these BIAB users chiming in... I had no idea people used it so much, and the same way I am, creating basic MIDI tracks and importing into Cakewalk. All that to say, (as the thread starter) I think my latency issue is not there now. I don't know, it must have fixed itself. I imported another midi file and recorded some audio, and it sounded in sync.
To answer the question before, I have a DELL XPS400 and am using an E-MU 1616m.
But please continue your discussion on BIAB. I love to hear your wonderful and exciting insite.
Ok, I have band in a box 2013 and emu1616m and sonar x1 and yamaha clavinova/ Ok, my midi works fine with X1 but not with band in a box. Can you help me in anyway?
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myrio
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Re: RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2013/07/12 16:51:22
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nelcatjar
WOW! All these BIAB users chiming in... I had no idea people used it so much, and the same way I am, creating basic MIDI tracks and importing into Cakewalk. All that to say, (as the thread starter) I think my latency issue is not there now. I don't know, it must have fixed itself. I imported another midi file and recorded some audio, and it sounded in sync.
To answer the question before, I have a DELL XPS400 and am using an E-MU 1616m.
But please continue your discussion on BIAB. I love to hear your wonderful and exciting insite.
Ok, I have band in a box 2013 and emu1616m and sonar x1 and yamaha clavinova/ Ok, my midi works fine with X1 but not with band in a box. Can you help me in anyway?
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myrio
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Re: RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2013/07/12 16:51:21
(permalink)
nelcatjar
WOW! All these BIAB users chiming in... I had no idea people used it so much, and the same way I am, creating basic MIDI tracks and importing into Cakewalk. All that to say, (as the thread starter) I think my latency issue is not there now. I don't know, it must have fixed itself. I imported another midi file and recorded some audio, and it sounded in sync.
To answer the question before, I have a DELL XPS400 and am using an E-MU 1616m.
But please continue your discussion on BIAB. I love to hear your wonderful and exciting insite.
Ok, I have band in a box 2013 and emu1616m and sonar x1 and yamaha clavinova/ Ok, my midi works fine with X1 but not with band in a box. Can you help me in anyway?
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myrio
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Re: RE: Band-in-a-Box users
2013/07/12 16:51:21
(permalink)
nelcatjar
WOW! All these BIAB users chiming in... I had no idea people used it so much, and the same way I am, creating basic MIDI tracks and importing into Cakewalk. All that to say, (as the thread starter) I think my latency issue is not there now. I don't know, it must have fixed itself. I imported another midi file and recorded some audio, and it sounded in sync.
To answer the question before, I have a DELL XPS400 and am using an E-MU 1616m.
But please continue your discussion on BIAB. I love to hear your wonderful and exciting insite.
Ok, I have band in a box 2013 and emu1616m and sonar x1 and yamaha clavinova/ Ok, my midi works fine with X1 but not with band in a box. Can you help me in anyway?
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