yep
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/28 22:58:22
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ORIGINAL: Nate
ORIGINAL: yep
Talking about this as though the circumstances and intent are still unproven just illustrates how uninformed you are.
What is it that you do for a living? Is it in music, trademark, servicemark, copywrite or any such practices?
I have a few different sources of income. I guess the answer is a little bit of yes to all of the above. Cheers. edit: For brevity.
post edited by yep - 2007/08/29 11:31:46
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bitflipper
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/29 14:09:10
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I have a few different sources of income. Well, that clears THAT up. Sounds like the kind of answer Tony Soprano gives when asked how he makes a living.
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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yep
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/29 14:25:00
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ORIGINAL: bitflipper
I have a few different sources of income.
Well, that clears THAT up. Sounds like the kind of answer Tony Soprano gives when asked how he makes a living.
Most days of the week I work designing and supporting building automation and industrial controls and monitoring systems (a more lucrative outgrowth of my audio interests in signal circuits). I have some real-estate investments and private equity interests that also turn positive cash flow. I enjoy doing freelance audio engineering as time allows. I was once a "recording artist" of no significance and a trickle of royalty income inexplicably persists from that. I have been known to perform various consulting services. Nothing illegal or immoral. Cheers.
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ohhey
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/29 14:38:50
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Google = "Don't be evil" Monster = "Be as evil as possible" 
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ArrowHead
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/29 16:22:31
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There are legal precidents against filing malicious lawsuits. And while I do agree the Monster Co. is quite adept at keeping there lawsuit filings under the radar, if they are hitting up people just to attack them as you suggest, then that will come to light in the process.
It IS coming to light in the process. You jumped into a thread right smack in the middle of all that process, and coming, and light and stuff. You're just too busy trying to talk about the "bidniss" And anyone that refers to an industry as "Bidness" has no knowledge or concept of law and legality beyond type d possession charges, weapons, or possibly statutory rape law. Lazy tards can't even think up some original slang, let alone music. "Yo G, we need a slang term for CAR" ... "hmm, how about CIZZar?" "Yeah, word up yo." M to the Izzo, Onster to the ozay, I'm done buying their cables. Vote with yer feet, I always say.
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bitflipper
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/29 22:15:54
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Gee, I didn't understand a thing you said.
But you're wid' us on the boycott, so that's cool.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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lazarous
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/30 11:33:42
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ORIGINAL: bitflipper
Gee, I didn't understand a thing you said.
But yo wid' us on duh boycott, so dat's kewl.
bitflipper: I've corrected your post. No charge! Corey
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bitflipper
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/30 12:10:33
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Thanks, man. I suffer from having been educated in the 50's and 60's, when those academic egghead know-it-alls actually expected us kids to read, write and spell.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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lazarous
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/30 13:17:52
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ORIGINAL: bitflipper
Thanks, man. I suffer from having been educated in the 50's and 60's, when those academic egghead know-it-alls actually expected us kids to read, write and spell.
Glad to help! I was educated in the 70's and 80's, just as your teachers were about to finally retire. I think I lived through the very last vestiges of the Golden Era of teaching. Corey
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jacktheexcynic
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/30 20:00:37
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i was educated in the 80's and 90's, and while i choose not to capitalize for the most part, i can read, write and spell as well. but maybe i'm just "gifted" 
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yep
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/30 20:48:22
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Heh heh. Since time immemorial grownups have been wondering what the world is coming to with the way young people dress, speak and act these days, whatever the days were. If you read contemporary literature from any point in history you will find that when the authors were young, young people were respectful and appreciative and listened to their elders (the fact that their elders disagreed at the time is irrelevant). 30 years from now some middle-aged middle manager will be driving his kids around saying, "You kids don't even know what good rap-metal IS! You should have heard some of the great rap-metal artists when I was young... You know what I call that stuff you listen to? CRAP metal!" And when he gets home he'll sigh and sit in his easy chair with a glass of iced Chablis and watch a black-tie gala Limp Bizkit reunion on PBS. Oftener than not, it's not that young people *can't* speak in a way that grownups can understand, but rather, why would they want to? Cheers.
post edited by yep - 2007/08/30 21:04:39
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jacktheexcynic
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/30 22:07:54
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my boss listens to zepplin and floyd at work (a multi-billion dollar health-care company) and i listen to audioslave and soundgarden. we both wear suits every day and act like normal corporate employees, just like people did back in the 70's and 80's and probably the 50's too (i don't think anyone was normal in the 60's). every generation is different but the basic formula never changes. my kids will probably listen to pink noise and call it music and i'll tell them it's crap... while i believe the general quality of modern music peaked in the 90's (there's a shocker for ya ) i do agree that education is going downhill.
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bitflipper
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/31 00:04:19
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Really drifting off topic, but this talk of generational entropy has reminded me of a funny movie you may not have seen called Idiocracy. Check it out.
The original concept for the film was stolen, I think, from an old science-fiction short story called "Marching Morons" by C.M. Cornbluth (if memory serves). That's worth seeking out, too.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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jacktheexcynic
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/08/31 12:38:00
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i'll have to check those out. also, back on topic, boycott monster cable.
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ArrowHead
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/01 02:11:50
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ORIGINAL: jacktheexcynic
my boss listens to zepplin and floyd at work (a multi-billion dollar health-care company) and i listen to audioslave and soundgarden. we both wear suits every day and act like normal corporate employees, just like people did back in the 70's and 80's and probably the 50's too (i don't think anyone was normal in the 60's). every generation is different but the basic formula never changes. my kids will probably listen to pink noise and call it music and i'll tell them it's crap...
while i believe the general quality of modern music peaked in the 90's (there's a shocker for ya ) i do agree that education is going downhill.
I listen to grindcore, deathmetal, and other stuff most would frown upon. I work as a manager. Most people are suprised to find out what I'm into. I've had kids that work for me see me at a show, and be amazed at the horrible vulgarity coming out of me. The point is though, when I'm at work you'd never know it. If I went to a job interview, you'd never know it. Yeah. Kids of every generation change, and deviate away from and most often AGAINST the generation before them. When I was 16, I swore, used a lot of slang, and said "like", "dude", "rad", etc.. more often than real words in my sentences. But if you sent me to a job interview, I could turn it off and present myself. It was a trend, not a basic education. Kids nowadays are no longer learning the real skills. I conducted three interviews last monday. I immediately had to disqualify TWO of the applicants because they SWORE during the interview. Some say "kids will be kids", but personally I believe we have an entire generation of ****s on our hands.
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Jessie Sammler
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/01 09:01:03
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Welcome to post-literate America. The anti-brains have become so mainstream that they've pushed what used to be average intelligence almost completely underground. If you look at advertising and television, rock-stupid is the new normal. Sometimes I'm surprised that Jeopardy! is still on the air; it certainly couldn't survive on any of the other major networks.
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mwd
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/01 11:15:37
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Is there a possibility that the nail has been hit on the head rather than straying off topic?
The something for nothing theory. "Old school" would have suggested you put out a good product, word of mouth spreads the news, you work hard and you earn a good living.
You get what you deserve.
Suing people is not part of your business plan and people don't inherently owe you squat.
Seems as each generation takes the wheel there is an advance in technology and a decline in common business sense.
Book smart and reality stupid smack dab into a culture that is so dependant on the electronic cash register... we can no longer count change.
A ray of hope?
Still think you get what you deserve... wouldn't want to be Monster.
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bitflipper
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/02 16:16:48
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Widespread functional illiteracy could explain a lot. Britney Spears, Back Street Boys, Spice Girls, Chicken McNuggets, Are You Smarter than a Fifth Grader, Wal-Mart, Guitar Center, America's Next Top Model, Hummers, caps worn backward, sweaters worn backward, five-dollar coffee, cars that parallel park for you, belief in angels but not trolls, designating the job of President as an entry-level position.
You might be on to something, Mike.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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Jessie Sammler
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/02 22:24:15
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Yeah, Guitar Center. Check your brain at the door with that little turnstile. You want a high-end Jackson? No way -- just the ****ty ones that kids can afford. Same with Ibanez. Want to play through an amp loud enough to hear yourself? No chance -- they're blasting some lame nu metal band through the house system, so loud that you can't hear the 2x12 in your face. Want to talk to a salesman who has any clue what the hell he's talking about? Forget it. I've had my fun with those ass-clowns; bought some stuff that my favorite indy store didn't carry, scooped up an RG520 in mint condition for $199, but my god are they worthy of whatever contempt I can muster. You're better off going to Sam Ash. Plus, Sam has some alternatives to the Monster Kable.
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aaronk
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/05 20:33:49
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I haven't scrolled through this entire thread, but there is some definite confusion of concepts going on in a lot of the posts.
A trademark, like "Monster Cable", designates the origin of goods or services. In order to win a trademark suit, the trademark owner has to prove either (1) possibility of confusion, or (2) dilution (more or less the same thing as denigration of the mark by association with things unsavory).
"Monster" would seem to be only a semi-strong mark: in connection with audio cables, it is arbitrary, but it is also an ordinary English word. I haven't researched Monster Cable's record of success, but I strongly doubt they could actually win a lawsuit against any company using "Monster" to designate non-audio goods or services. A quick check of the USPTO website shows that many, many other companies have successfully registered trademarks with the word "Monster" in the name.
Copyright, by contrast, is the right to prevent the copying of a work of authorship. A song, movie, book, or poem can be copyrighted. A name of a business cannot be.
In the world of patents, there is a doctrine called "patent misuse." The basic idea is that if the owner of a patent misuses the monopoly power the patent legally affords, the patent can be declared unenforceable. There is a movement afoot, started by Prof. Lessing of Stanford, to extend this doctrine to copyright, so that, e.g., a recording company that took too aggressive a view to its right to royalties could find its copyright unenforceable in any circumstances. I imagine a similar defense could be tried against companies trying nuisance-suit shakedowns in trademark cases.
It's certainly true that paying a nuisance settlement may make more economic sense than fighting a legal battle. But our system actually has good protections in place. E.g., when a lawsuit really is frivolous, there is a basic rule ("Rule 11") that allows both the frivolous party, and its lawyers, to be financially penalized -- courts definitely do impose these penalties, and they are often huge.
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yep
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/05 21:21:31
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ORIGINAL: aaronk
...I haven't researched Monster Cable's record of success, but I strongly doubt they could actually win a lawsuit against any company using "Monster" to designate non-audio goods or services...
...It's certainly true that paying a nuisance settlement may make more economic sense than fighting a legal battle. But our system actually has good protections in place. E.g., when a lawsuit really is frivolous, there is a basic rule ("Rule 11") that allows both the frivolous party, and its lawyers, to be financially penalized -- courts definitely do impose these penalties, and they are often huge.
Monster's record of success in the courts in essentially non-existant because they have been very adept at keeping these cases *out* of court. It seems their MO is basically to delay court proceedings as long as possible by filing for extensions (of their own complaints) and then ultimately paying off defendants who refuse to settle-- in other words, Monster sues, does their best to keep it out of court, delay proceedings, and to try to extract a settlement, typically involving an ongoing portion of revenues, then ultimately offers to drop the suit, and failing that, to their own defendent a cash payout if they insist on going to court. I can't think of a better example of pure shakedown lawsuits. Cheers.
post edited by yep - 2007/09/05 21:38:27
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aaronk
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/06 12:39:33
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It seems their MO is basically to delay court proceedings as long as possible by filing for extensions (of their own complaints) and then ultimately paying off defendants who refuse to settle-- in other words, Monster sues, does their best to keep it out of court, delay proceedings, and to try to extract a settlement, typically involving an ongoing portion of revenues, then ultimately offers to drop the suit, and failing that, to their own defendent a cash payout if they insist on going to court.
I can't think of a better example of pure shakedown lawsuits. Well said. One hopes word gets around well enough so that small business defendants can figure this out. This is an example where paying a reasonably competent lawyer a few hundred dollars would probably net a decent savings for the targeted company in the long run. At my company, when we are targeted by frivolous lawsuits, I get an aggressive defense lawyer who will set the case for trial ASAP. We've never paid a single cent in tribute or settlement, and the biggest claim against us resulted in the plaintiff paying us, not vice versa.
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harmony gardens
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/06 16:57:33
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I will join your boycott bit. Partly on it's merits, and partly to support keeping the gear forum vital.
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rumleymusic
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/06 19:25:12
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What do you know...it works.
(Making Cables I mean, check earlier in the topic).
I bought some bulk Canare Star Quad at $.40 a foot, a pair of XX series Neutrik XLR connectors, and some good solder...and presto!
The Neutrik solder stop connectors make assembly a no brainer, and the finished product performs wonderfully. It cost all of $9.00 in material for a 20' cable. I doubt I will ever buy a pre made cable again.
Thanks for the tips....and Boycott Monster Cable.
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bitflipper
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/07 00:24:37
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But did you oxygenate your wire first? Or was that DE-oxygenate, I forget which ridiculous claim justifies Monster's pricing. We'll be looking for the RumleyMusic brand cables at our local GC!
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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bitflipper
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/07 00:38:19
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I will join your boycott bit.
Partly on it's merits, and partly to support keeping the gear forum vital. You're on the side of truth and justice, Dale! I just googled "boycott monster cable" and got 401,000 results. Power to the people! (Jeez, one of those links was some white-supremist neo-Nazi wingnut site that wants to boycott Monster Cable because they believe the company is owned by Jews. I can understand their confusion, Lee is such a common Jewish name, up there with Chan and Huang. Oh well, power to all the OTHER people who AREN'T whackjobs.)
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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Jessie Sammler
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/07 05:09:05
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ORIGINAL: bitflipper
But did you oxygenate your wire first? Or was that DE-oxygenate, I forget which ridiculous claim justifies Monster's pricing. We'll be looking for the RumleyMusic brand cables at our local GC!
Everyone realizes, don't they, that Monster Cable is to audiophile cables what Taco Bell is to Mexican food? Cheap, ubiquitous, and profoundly not very good. Anyway, it's pretty easy for me not to buy Monster Cable. I love cables and power conditioners, but I've spent the last few years learning to like MIT and TrippLite. Sure, I've got the odd power strip or mic cable, but if the entire Monster empire suddenly vanished into thin air, no tears would be shed by this ChiTown girl.
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Catphish
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/07 10:35:27
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Monster Cable CEO Noel Lee defended these actions by saying "We have an obligation to protect our trademark; otherwise we'd lose it"
He is correct. And whether they win or loose doesn't matter. It's not about winning, it's about protecting their trademark, and it's basically required of them by trademark law.
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yep
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/07 10:56:07
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ORIGINAL: Catphish
Monster Cable CEO Noel Lee defended these actions by saying "We have an obligation to protect our trademark; otherwise we'd lose it"
He is correct. And whether they win or loose doesn't matter. It's not about winning, it's about protecting their trademark, and it's basically required of them by trademark law. Please read what we are talking about before posting rubbish like this. Monster is not protecting their trademark. They are filing extortionate shakedown lawsuits. Suing Cookie Monster is not required of them by law. Really, truly-- this is not some hippy-crunchy anti-corporate thing or loony left conspiracy theory. This is not people over-reacting to a legal campaign that accidentally crossed the line or overshot the mark in a few isolated cases. This is a deliberate and orchestrated effort to extort money from legitimate businesses, large and small, who have done nothing wrong and who have never threatened nor infringed upon Monster's trademarks. Follow the links to the trademark office website. Take a look at the actual documents. The offense is egregious. Cheers.
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losguy
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RE: Boycott Monster Cable
2007/09/07 12:06:15
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