Helpful ReplyLockedCakewalk, Single Sign On and You

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SteveStrummerUK
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/25 17:28:54 (permalink)
 
Will this exciting news mean that, eventually, you'll manage to fix the broken Go To First Unread Post feature?
 

 
I always found this to be extremely useful, but it doesn't work anymore. Not in IE10 anyway

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#31
Splat
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/25 17:32:27 (permalink)
As Cake does not make the forum software probably not.

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#32
bapu
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/25 21:05:25 (permalink)
SteveStrummerUK
 
Will this exciting news mean that, eventually, you'll manage to fix the broken Go To First Unread Post feature?
 

 
I always found this to be extremely useful, but it doesn't work anymore. Not in IE10 anyway


I may be wrong but it seems to work in Chrome. Or, at least the the way I expect it to.
#33
The Maillard Reaction
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/25 21:33:07 (permalink)
Hi Willy,
 Thanks for the heads up.
 
 I just went to my account page and did a "save as web page" to get a comprehensive record of my serial numbers, reg numbers and order history.
 
 


#34
craigb
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/25 21:52:02 (permalink)
bapu
SteveStrummerUK
 
Will this exciting news mean that, eventually, you'll manage to fix the broken Go To First Unread Post feature?
 

 
I always found this to be extremely useful, but it doesn't work anymore. Not in IE10 anyway


I may be wrong but it seems to work in Chrome. Or, at least the the way I expect it to.




I use Chrome and it seems to work most of the time, but I do get some threads (usually those created by Steve with lots of images in them) where it puts me into the middle of the posts I've already seen.

 
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
#35
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 03:09:26 (permalink)
bapu
SteveStrummerUK
 
Will this exciting news mean that, eventually, you'll manage to fix the broken Go To First Unread Post feature?
 

 
I always found this to be extremely useful, but it doesn't work anymore. Not in IE10 anyway


I may be wrong but it seems to work in Chrome. Or, at least the the way I expect it to.




Yep, works in Chrome - but you can also click the time link too ("14 minutes ago" etc)

James
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#36
Beepster
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 08:44:36 (permalink)
Hello, all.
 
Dear, Willie and or any Bakers monitoring this thread... Just so I understand this correctly this is an Opt In type scenario? Because this is most definitely NOT something I want happening with my account. Let me explain.
 
I consider my Cake store account to be a secure account that needs to be protected just like any of my other accounts that require monetary transactions such as banking institutions, paypal, etc. I certainly trust that you guys keep our personal info and product codes secure however I believe online security is two way street and the brunt of the responsibility lies on the user/customer because really... we tend to be the largest security gap for various reasons.
 
So to keep unwanted eyes away from my sensitive data I try to do everything possible to keep those accounts isolated from my more general online activities (such as forum posting). When I log into my store account I do it on a specific computer that ONLY goes on the internet for necessary transactions and downloads. That computer is locked down as much as possible and only gets connected with a hard wire (no wireless adapter installed). I don't surf on it, do any research, log into forums or anything else. I always use private windows with elaborate security settings and stay connected for as little time as possible to accomplish what I need to. Needless to say I use lengthy and complex passwords for any sensitive accounts and NEVER store them ANYWHERE digitally.
 
Then I use my beater laptop for everything else and use different emails, usernames, passwords, etc for any public sites I participate in (like the forum). That way if someone somehow manages to hack their way into one account or my network it should, in theory, be next to impossible to access the stuff that really matters.
 
I am also about to make some even more elaborate changes to how I have all this set up but I won't go into that.
 
Am I paranoid? Perhaps but I have been hacked before back when I was young and foolish about my intertubing. Nothing drastic happened but it was still an unpleasant experience and I decided to take all precautions I could to avoid it in the future especially considering I do more stuff online now.
 
"Merging" my forum account to my store account would completely defeat all this extreme separation of Beepster the affable n00blie you all know and love from the guy who actually pays for all this stuff. I simply don't have the time, energy and/or money to wrangle with a hacking situation.
 
So I don't mean to rain on your parade or anything and do look forward to some improvements to the store accounts (because it is a little wonky at times) but I have absolutely no need or want for the "convenience" of having my forum account tied to my store account especially if they are going to use the same password.
 
Please let me know that if I choose to leave things EXACTLY as they are that all I have to do is nothing and I'll scuttle back off into my busy corner to continue my various other scheming and plotting. If that is not the case then I will probably have to call you guys to get this sorted out and explain further why this is important and to hopefully come to some sort of arrangement.
 
Thank you and good luck with the upgrades.
 
To everyone else, sorry I have not been around but I've got lots of good things cooking at the moment that I'm sure many will find quite interesting if I can see it all through. Cheers and take care.
#37
SteveStrummerUK
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 08:54:35 (permalink)
 
Those are all perfectly valid points you make Beep.
 
But I wonder if this is being done in response to the many requests for the forums only to be accessible to registered customers?
 
In which case, you couldn't even open a new user account just to post in the forums (not that you should have to), which I was going to suggest you might want to consider.

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#38
Beepster
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 09:10:56 (permalink)
Hi, Steve. How ya, been? I'm actually mulling over asking the Bakers whether I could open a new forum account (for completely unrelated purposes... part of my master plan) but even still the old account with all the old posts would remain. So technically someone with enough brains might be able to use my old posts/profile as an entry point to get at the store account. Maybe not but I'm simply not educated enough in blackhat wizardry to know for sure. Also things that are impossible today seem to find ways of becoming possible as time marches on.
 
The way I read the OP though it looks like we have to actually go out of our way to merge the accounts. I just wanted to make sure before the deadline because if that's not the case I'm gonna have to make a call to see what can be done... which is a bit of a distraction from all the other stuff I have going on right now.
 
Anyway, I'm sure one way or the other it'll work out. The Bakers are pretty responsive to this type of thing. Cheers.
#39
js516
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 09:13:31 (permalink)
Willy Jones
 
Can I login with steam/facebook/twitter/google/friendster ?
At this time no - but we are listening to your feedback and exploring all of these other options (well not friendster).



Google is OK.
 
But I won't hold me breath on the others. I'm still waiting on the You Tube/Twitter/Facebook merged super site:
 
YouTwitFace
 
 

Joe Sera
 
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#40
Beepster
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 09:24:53 (permalink)
lol...
 
I'd also like to offer my opinion on the twitter, G+, FB syncing. Please keep that crap WELL separated from the main account. Like none of those buttons and spying scripts and whatnot. I've had serious issues with worlds colliding when some of those sites started helpfully scouring my email contacts and online activities then sending friend/add on requests/suggestions and ads to separate groups and communities that I kept separate for a reason. Any time I see ANY of those stupid buttons I block them and Facebook has gotten so horrendous now I only log into it on a separate partition and with ALL other windows/tabs closed and a completely cleared history.
 
Seriously, my mom doesn't need to be getting friend suggestions from some of the crazy groupies and various lunatics I've met over the course of my bar gig days. Nor do you guys.
#41
paulo
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 09:30:43 (permalink)
Here's hoping that in the process, the hamster will finally get my account to recognise that Sonar 8 wasn't in fact  the last version I registered.
 
FWIW I'm not sure I like the idea of my forum sign-in opening up my account details either.
#42
Splat
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 09:36:38 (permalink)
It's just as safe as usual Paulo. Maybe even more safe as I'm sure Cake would have locked down security even harder for this. Think of it the other way around, the store is opening up forum features. As you know this sort of thing is pretty common nowadays. Give yourself a good password though (recommended with all sites really). Cheers.

P.S. hopefully this will stop people registering multiple accounts. I'd like to see something like 'cakewalk customer' next to forums posts, one better would be the forums would display all the products people have bought (optionally). That would probably be a long way away though.

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#43
Beepster
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 10:01:07 (permalink)
Hi, Alex.
 
The security risk isn't necessarily on Cakewalk's end. It's on the the user end. Consider how much time you spend logged into the forum and how often compared to how much time you spend in your account. If you happen to get a virus, someone physically installs a keylogger or your computer gets stolen it would be far easier for them to get into your forum account for various reasons (because you logged in enough time for the hacker to obtain you password or you happened to be logged in when your computer was stolen or you have the password saved because it's easier, etc) which sucks but isn't that big of a deal. Because you are unlikely you are going to be logged into your STORE account or you only visit it every once in a while giving less chances for a virus or keylogger to gain the password before you notice it/your av definitions catch it (I can go for months without logging in) then the store account is going to be much more secure simply due to the numbers/chance game.
 
Once you use the same login/password for both you just raised the chances of your store account getting accessed to exactly the same chance as your login. Perhaps more so because now the neer do wells will know that if they can crack the forum account they can get at something useful.
 
Now take my complete separation method where I don't even use the same computer to access one or the other. That immediately becomes impossible. Not good.
 
Anyway, I really feel bad for pointing this stuff out because I'm sure the bakers have worked hard on this and were looking forward to rolling it all out but they did ask for opinions and this seems to be a pretty important aspect that so far seems to have been overlooked in this thread.
 
Most people won't care and the chances are low that anything bad will happen but I'm ultra cautious about this type of thing. In reality Cakewalk itself has the most to lose with these types of attacks because... well I have receipts and invoices to prove I am the legitimate owner of my stuff so I just have to show that whereas they end at possible risk of pirates and whatnot figuring out fancy ways to manipulate the reg codes/sn's. There are also a plethora of ways to protect payment information on the users end too so anyone who takes those precautions should not suffer identity theft if they did it right.
 
So yeah... just hoping these things have and/or will be taken into consideration. Also the Store site seems to be far more stable/secure than this cookie cutter forum which seems to get attacked with some frequency by spammers and phishing freaks. I'm sure the hackers are hammering away in the background as well. Such is life on the intertubes.
#44
bapu
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 11:40:20 (permalink)
mike_mccue
Hi Willy,
 Thanks for the heads up.
 
 I just went to my account page and did a "save as web page" to get a comprehensive record of my serial numbers, reg numbers and order history.
 
 


Cut-n-paste into an excel spreadsheet works too.
#45
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/26 12:58:46 (permalink)
@Beep yup all true, the advice you give covers all websites. No security is perfect and prevention/regular maintenance (inc windows update, java, acrobat,flash, antivirus etc) is definately important. If I had a tenner every time I heard somebody say 'well it worked fine before' or 'I've never had an issue' just after being infected I'd be rich.

I maintain servers with lots of users on them myself. I'm patching against SQL injection attacks (for instance) regularly.

Prevention happens at both ends, the weakest link is the most insecure.

Security with Cakewalk will be no different than the store and probably better. As I say everybody does it now and have been for some time. I never allow websites to store my credit card details BTW except PayPal and amazon. People who log into websites themselves need to be responsible for their own security BTW, if they don't feel that way they will soon learn the hard way.

People alway think forums are always inherily insecure, the reality is that the authentication will probably be taken away from the forums and done elsewhere via a provider which will make it MORE secure (better code and infrastructure ). Cake I'm sure are well aware of security implications and will make it as tight as possible.

BTW the login transaction only happens once. Staying logged into a site for long periods really doesn't not decrease you security unless somebody has remote control of your machine. Vast majority of hacks are not done that way as it's very inefficient.
post edited by CakeAlexS - 2014/07/26 13:35:19

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#46
Willy Jones [Cakewalk]
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 08:29:14 (permalink)
SteveStrummerUK
 
Will this exciting news mean that, eventually, you'll manage to fix the broken Go To First Unread Post feature?
 
I always found this to be extremely useful, but it doesn't work anymore. Not in IE10 anyway



Sorry unfortunately there is nothing we can do about this one - but we have notified the ASP Playground people.

Willy Jones 
Cakewalk
#47
Willy Jones [Cakewalk]
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 09:02:34 (permalink)
Beepster
 
Dear, Willie and or any Bakers monitoring this thread... Just so I understand this correctly this is an Opt In type scenario? Because this is most definitely NOT something I want happening with my account. 

 
I understand how you feel and that's perfectly valid. Unfortunately - it is not an opt-in scenario. We will be migrating all of our services to Cakewalk Accounts.
 
However - if you would prefer to keep two separate accounts for your store and forum you could by doing the following:
  1. Next week when you log back into the forum click on 'Migrate Forum Account' this will allow you to continue using your 'Beepster' account
  2. Create a second Cakewalk account that you'll use just for the store with a different email address than your forum account
 So - in a nutshell if you use unique email addresses you can have a Cakewalk Account that is just for the forum or just for the store.
 
RE: Data privacy and security. We don't store any credit card data and we don't plan on starting to. Worst case scenario if Cakewalk was hacked you might get some spam. In Massachusetts we have a stricter set of data privacy laws than most states (this was a result of TJ Maxx losing all that credit card data a few years back) that we adhere to stringently.
 
To be honest we're a bunch of paranoid weirdo's also, we're not going to ask you for anything more than is necessary or anything we wouldn't ask of ourselves.
 
We realize this might be a one-time annoyance but on our end it also minimizes the surface area for a potential attacker not every user follows good security practices and many folks use the same forum password as their store password. I don't want to get into specifics (I can offer them at a later date), but suffice it to say that this will be an upgrade to the Forum's security.
 
I hope that helps ease the confusion, and like I said above the only requirement for creating two Cakewalk Accounts is unique email and username so if you'd like to keep using two accounts you still can.
 

Willy Jones 
Cakewalk
#48
azslow3
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 10:02:58 (permalink)
I do not care about security. In case someone want to hack YOU (I mean some concrete person or organization)  he will have success at some point. Using some paranoid live Linux CD (with paranoid AppArmor configuration) with disk less computer will keep potential hacker busy for some time, but still he/she will find the way (hack your router for example).
 
But what I always try to understand are consequences. What a hacker gets in case Cakewalk Store account is hacked? Registration codes!
 
With merging of accounts the probability to be hacked is increasing, many users are "hanging" on the forum more or less permanently. So the following question should be answered: what will happened in case throw hacked account my registration numbers become public? Will Cakewalk accuse me for publishing these number, and so make me responsible for illegal distribution of the products?
 
That is why I am not permanently logged into my banking, PayPal, etc. But with account merging, Cakewalk a kind of forcing me to stay logged in.
 

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#49
bapu
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 11:32:46 (permalink)
Willy Jones [Cakewalk]
I hope that helps ease the confusion, and like I said above the only requirement for creating two Cakewalk Accounts is unique email and username so if you'd like to keep using two accounts you still can.

 
Willy,
 
This forum account of mine is email1, my store account is email2. What exactly is going to happen to either accounts email address after I migrate?
 
For the moment, leave out the fact that I do have other "band" forum accounts and that misguided "The Bapu" forum account.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Oh, BTW, my passwords are password1 and password2. That's to make the hackers' job easier.
#50
Willy Jones [Cakewalk]
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 11:34:27 (permalink)
Hi azslow,
 
Great points and valid concerns. I'll try to address each of them - if I miss anything or just totally missed the entire point please let us know.
 

But what I always try to understand are consequences. What a hacker gets in case Cakewalk Store account is hacked? 

 
Yes that is correct - if someone was to gain access to your account or our entire system the only thing they would have access to is serial numbers, registration codes, downloads, your email address and a shipping address if your purchased products through the store. Yeah that is a problem, your email address and shipping address is personal and sensitive data. We encrypt it whenever in transit to prevent man in the middle type of attacks and go to great lengths to keep it secure. When working with third parties for example that require a sample of our customer data to test functionality - we always use fake or dummy data. Most every Cakewalk employee's data is in our system as well, we take it seriously and treat it as if it was our own because well - it is.
 
Registration codes!

Honestly - I'm ok with that. That's a piracy problem for us, not a 'your banking or financial data was compromised' nightmare for you. 
 

what will happened in case throw hacked account my registration numbers become public?

 
Once it was identified (either by the user reporting it to us or through one of our security audits) that an account was compromised we would:
  1. Reset your account password and lock your account until someone from Customer Service spoke with you or you reset your password and re-validated your email address
  2. All of your serial numbers would be added to our 'known pirated blacklist'. This would prevent them from being used for updates, tech support or registering
  3. We would re-issue serial numbers for your products
This is no different than what we do today right now if a similar situation arises with a user's account.
 

Will Cakewalk accuse me for publishing these number, and so make me responsible for illegal distribution of the products?

No of course not. What could we possibly gain by upsetting a user who was the victim of fraud or hacking? That would neither help the victim or help us retain a happy customer.
 

That is why I am not permanently logged into my banking, PayPal, etc. But with account merging, Cakewalk a kind of forcing me to stay logged in.

Alex touched on it earlier but staying perma-logged into an account isn't insecure provided you're doing it from your own computer. Most financial/banking sites will auto-log you out after a certain period of time, that's not because its insecure to be logged in it's because they don't trust that you're using a personal computer and aren't at a library or anything.
 
Specific to Cakewalk Accounts - nothing that we are changing requires you to stay logged into PayPal or your banking services. If you would prefer to not stay perma-logged in to those services then by all means sign out. This change has nothing to do with that.

Willy Jones 
Cakewalk
#51
Willy Jones [Cakewalk]
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 11:42:44 (permalink)
bapu
 
Willy,
 
This forum account of mine is email1, my store account is email2. What exactly is going to happen to either accounts email address after I migrate?
 
For the moment, leave out the fact that I do have other "band" forum accounts and that misguided "The Bapu" forum account. 
 
Oh, BTW, my passwords are password1 and password2. That's to make the hackers' job easier.



Bapu ol' pal - how did your post count get so high? I'll get on that now. 
 
In your situation what you'll want to do when migrating your forum account is simply provide your store email address. Your forum email address will remain unchanged from it's current one. We are intentionally not syncing email addresses between your forum and Cakewalk Account. This will allow folks to use a different email address for forum notifications, subscriptions etc than their primary shopping and contact email address.
 
Great call on the passwords I've been using 'abc123' and '123abc' - I'll update mine immediately to your more secure variants!

Willy Jones 
Cakewalk
#52
bapu
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 11:46:15 (permalink)
Willy Jones [Cakewalk]
Bapu ol' pal - how did your post count get so high?

I was unemployed for about a year.
 
Willy Jones [Cakewalk]
I'll get on that now. 

Oh no, not again.....
 
Good to see you back Willy.
 
Now how can we get Seth and Ryan back?
#53
Willy Jones [Cakewalk]
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 11:48:01 (permalink)
Beepster
 
I'd also like to offer my opinion on the twitter, G+, FB syncing. Please keep that crap WELL separated from the main account. 



Thanks for the feedback and we hear you loud and clear. We're still looking into those other log in providers but we would not use them for any 'sync' features. We would only use it strictly as a login provider to make things easier for folks who use those services - we wouldn't scrape your fb contacts or anything annoying like that.

Willy Jones 
Cakewalk
#54
Beepster
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 13:40:03 (permalink)
Thanks for the reply, Willy. I unfortunately am not grasping the nuances of your answer though (I can be a little slow on the uptake at times). I have sent a PM to avoid causing any extra confusion in the thread but you may be busy dealing with the implementation of all this. If there are any other Bakers monitoring this thread and know Mr. Jones is too preoccupied to answer my specific silliness then perhaps they can help get me sorted out instead. Otherwise I will just keep an eye on my inbox. I would however like to get this figured out before the deadline tomorrow (preferably this afternoon). Sorry to be a pain.
 
Thanks.
#55
Splat
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 14:44:16 (permalink)
The only thing I disagree with is the situation with the coffee house. In my opinion it should be seperate, abolished, cast away onto a lonely island somewhere (Australia?). A massive firewall built inbetween. Regular forums posters will need to agree via terms and conditions never to speak about it again...

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@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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#56
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/27 15:01:35 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby bapu 2014/07/27 16:55:47
It's getting a little late in the day here, guys. Hoping to fix this before tomorrow. I will have to stop logging into either account if the changes happen before I get an answer. Granted ya'll wouldn't have to listen to my incessant blathering here on the forum however it would kind of suxxor for the ol Beep here.
 
:-/
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UbiquitousBubba
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/28 09:05:20 (permalink)
CakeAlexS, 
 
I was thinking Antarctica might be a better choice. I mean, that's a pretty cruel thing to do to Australia. Unleashing that mess on the local population is probably against International Law. I'm not sure how well all of the pretentious elitists who reside upstairs will like the cold, but I'm sure they'll convince themselves that they prefer it that way. I look forward to all of the posts about the acoustic superiority of studios carved out of the ice. The pictures should be amazing.
 
Oh. On second thought, you probably meant that you'd like to banish the Coffee House instead. Right. It's a good thing that we've got all the coffee and becan. 
#58
Splat
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/28 09:13:22 (permalink)
Lol agreed :)

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@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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#59
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Re: Cakewalk, Single Sign On and You 2014/07/28 09:17:03 (permalink)
Don't look now Bubba but you're upstairs right now too.
 
TWO PLACES AT ONCE!! TRANSDIMENSIONAL HAMSTERS!!! THE END IS NIGH!!!
#60
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