Console Emulator

  Ok,I have been in the search for the intended use of the console emulator to no end. The help site says it should be installed first in the chain: "You will typically want to insert the Console Emulator module as the first module, and make sure ProChannel has Post FX Bin disabled. However, you can also experiment with placing the Console Emulator module at the end and enable Post FX Bin, so all your effects and processed sound are affected." Apparently the typical (intended?) application is first in the chain then why do all the pro channel presets have it last in the module order? The two guys in the cake video have it that way too. Was there a third party that makes that module I could ask for the proper positioning to get results closest to real console emulation? Their intended use? I asked cake and it stumped tech support. Since it has a trim control wouldn't first in the chain be closest to the real thing? I mean you wouldn't put a input trim control after the effects,compressor etc. right? (unless they were outboard guitar pedals etc.) On the other hand, effects and everything do run in a real console also and aren't separated from it. Seems to me real console emulation would have to have a trim control first in line and affect everything in the channel to the output.

I need to experiment more with this. I use it last with good results, but I will try it first in the chain to see if I like it that way better. 

Good Topic

Let me first say that after multiple listening tests, including other people's shootouts who posted (such as on gearslutz) I stand by my first impressions that I posted here a few weeks ago. I see the X2 console emu more like a digital saturator than an analog console. Please check out my other posts for my explanation. Having said all that, I have also stated that I think they can still be useful as effects rather than as a necessary workflow element to convening the mix or acting as a subtle enhancing glue like a console. But still, to use it as such here's a "real-world" working scenario:

engage the console channel for each track FIRST. Then from there use your EQ's, compressors just like you would on a console emulating insert points. As per the signal flow, these track signals will then be hitting buses. At the buses, insert console bus as FIRST in the chain. Then again, do any bus EQ'ing or compression or whatever. As this is routed to a main bus, you can once again have a console bus open there FIRST in the chain if you like. 

The important thing to remember, which is most often ignored or overlooked, is the gain staging. These meters indicate a dBFS scale which means our "0" will be hovering somewhere below the digital 0 indicated on the scale. I believe it is around -18 dbFS. I don't like to VU or RMS or average meters, I think they are not that useful for gain staging. Using a good peak meter you can set your signals with the aim of -18 but the peaks ultimately dictate how much to push it and your ears MOST IMPORTANTLY will tell you if you are set okay.

Again, see I feel these to be more like saturators I didn't find I had good results using them like a console. But I like using these emu's to enhance a signal within an FX chain flow. But try it both ways for yourselves. See what works for you. 

I found putting the console emulator last seems to not register well on the VU Meters ...First inline gets a healthy signal which means the threshhold for emulation is better for the plugin ..... Personaly seems to sound the same either way but the gain structure seems more matched

I'm loving the console emulator (especially the Neve setting)  I use it last on every channel and bus, here are some results

http://soundcloud.com/p-theory/p-theory-ko-featuring-koaste

I'm still undecided on the console emulator. There are times when I dismiss it as more gimmick than function. At other times I feel like I hear a subtle difference, especially if I A/B a project with and without it. Even when I do hear a difference, I'm not quite sure if it's for the better. I suppose subtle coloration was the goal and they achieved it.

PTheory


I'm loving the console emulator (especially the Neve setting)  I use it last on every channel and bus, here are some results

http://soundcloud.com/p-theory/p-theory-ko-featuring-koaste

Sounds good...and I can tell the Console Emulation......

It's very "Chili Pepper" esk.....

As the trend of advice is leaning in this thread - I've moved the console emulation to the first position. 

I spent an hour or so trying different spots for the console emulation. I also tried placing 2 of them in a strip to see the effect. More colored and might have a use for that at some time. 
But for normal everyday mixing, I found that moving it to the first position sounded better. At the last position, I heard more of a emphasis on the ssss's for a vocal track along with an overall subtle emphasis on the higher frequencies that in a way that I didn't like. I like this module a lot.

This is an interesting topic.  I believe we should experiment with different alternatives.
 
But, at the risk of repeating myself - Seth and Brandon both use them at the end in the webinars. Noel Borthwick said to use it last on a thread about this subject days ago..  It's last in all the presets.  Doesn't that make people think it might go well at the end? Just a thought..
 
I realise it says otherwise in the manual, but it says a a few odd things in there.

I'll bet Seth and Brandon never gave it a second of thought & just used whatever it pulled up.(trusted it was automatically correctly placed) I have experienced "product engineers" that knew less about their product than I figured out in 15 min. so I don't take things for granted. I have been questioning this placement since the opening of X2 and receiving opposing info from Cakewalk. I have even emailed the company that makes it and will report what they say (if they answer, you know how that goes.) Personally I am not interested in the "use what sounds good" answer even though that is the most important thing, I am trying to find out the placement it was designed for. I realize this is a "virtual console" and not a real one but I'm pretty sure whoever made it probably tried to make it as exactly like one as they could and thus has a particular placement in mind. Thanks for making this interesting guys, We'll get to the answer soon I hope.

xxxsoundxxx


I'll bet Seth and Brandon never gave it a second of thought & just used whatever it pulled up.(trusted it was automatically correctly placed) I have experienced "product engineers" that knew less about their product than I figured out in 15 min. so I don't take things for granted.
 
Okay, so apart from Seth and Brandon not knowing what they're talking about, what about Noel, their C.T.O.?  Does he not either?
 
What conflicting information are you getting?  Apart from the Manual, I've not heard anything from Cake other than to use it at the end.
 
I'll be inteested if you get a reply from Overloud.
 
BTW, I think most people on here think quite highly of Seth, Brandon and Noel.  I know I do.  YMMV

The trouble is it's almost impossible to A/B the overall effect on a project, when you have an instance on every track as well as the master bus. By the time you've turned them all off, you've forgotten what A sounded like. 

You can take them all out by selecting the tracks, hold ctrl then deselect on/off.

jb101

carl


You can take them all out by selecting the tracks, hold ctrl then deselect on/off.

Sadly, though, this doesn't work on the buses, as they found out on the X2 webinar..

For busses I use CV & PC, select busses, hold ctrl, select on/off. It will affect all the console buss emus.

 You can change all the console types this way too.

Here's another method of A/B'ing that also ensures latency free, glitch free listening and for comparison's sake, that is what you want. Just bounce to a stereo mix each rendition. So, dry/unaffected, then Neve version, so on and so forth. Then group/invert solo each one versus the dry, then you can do them against each other as well. 

Ah yes, and check out Dean's shootout!