Dancing With Debbie - Rough Mix

I like the overall concept. I might be inclined to lose the portamento synth at the intro. It seems to set us up for a completely different song.
Bass line has a nice drive to it. Guitar tone is cool, but there were some places where I was expecting you to let it rip.
The piano has some unrealized potential to kick it up some, too.
You might want to play with some compressors. This would sound really good with a bit more punch and drama.
This would be a good road song. It's a little on the long side, but that could be ok if you take advantage of the cues where it wants to ramp up.
Keep working it, and increase the voltage. This has plenty of potential.

 + + + 1   great playing - - - cool synth sound

Thank you all for listening and commenting.

  RobertB, I hear what you're saying about the portamento bit in the beginning but, conceptually, I'd have a hard time taking that out. The song is a metaphor for love and how it starts, changes, evolves, grows. How the people in love change and grow together. So what that beginning represents is the initial attraction that quickly evolves into something very different. Musically, you may be right on the money about how it doesn't fit but it says something I need it to say. No doubt I could have done it better.

 The only compression I added was while bouncing the project to a track. I put the Sonitus Multiband Compressor in the Master Bus using one of the presets. Then I bounced it again using a different preset. Then I mixed the two together. That's what I posted. It was a spur of the moment thing and resulted in some sounds being more buried and some more upfront, like the bass. I like the way it made the tune punchier but next time I'm going to spend a lot more time tweaking the different bands before I'm finished. Like many things I do, I did it just to see what happened when I did it.

 I know it's long. I left room at the end to put a guitar solo outro on it but never was able to add something I liked. Sadly for me, my playing just isn't what it used to be. Almost 20 years ago I had a work related accident and just about chopped my left hand in half. I didn't even touch a guitar for several years after that and I never did get back to where I was happy with my playing.

I put two synth solos at the end because each represents a person in that relationship. How they are growing together but still remaining individuals.


 lhansen, I have some crunchy guitar stuff in there but they are so buried in the mix you can't hear them. I will certainly try to change that the next time I work on that project. I need to take some time off from it... maybe write a song about my cat or something. All my synth stuff is heavily influenced by ELP. I'm a lucky man indeed that some of that came across in my work. I'm not really capable of searing leads anymore so I try to come up with something melodic or textural. The first little guitar solo in the song is doubled by three synths. I played the solo then went back and transcribed it in the PRV, then layered the synths under it. It's a subtle thing but that's what I was aiming at.

 BIABDude, I'm very glad you liked it. The synth sounds were mostly Pentagon 1, Dimension LE and Dreamstation layered together. It's been so long since I put those parts together I can't remember much more about them.  I certainly enjoy writing synth parts the more I do it.

 Radio, I agree with everything you posted. I hear SO many things in it I want to change, adjust, redo, etc. I have a LOT of percussion going on and most of it is buried. I need to spend a lot more time playing with envelopes before it will sound the way I want it to sound.

Hey,

This is a really cool song with lots of great stuff scattered throughout the entire eight minutes!

I really like the choices that you made with the different synths and textures, and also the piano parts and cool bass lines.  It's definitely got a bit of an ELP/Ambrosia vibe going on.

The scratch vocals sound good, and I think they'll really shine with a few harmony parts added in a couple of places.  I do agree that maybe the drums could come up a little bit in the dense mix, but that may just be my personal taste.

Nice work, can't wait to hear it when it's finished. Have a good one!
Bob

bapu, I'm glad you liked it. yes, it is a long song but that is how I hear it. If I wanted to make it more marketable I would consider making several changes, including making the song shorter. But since it is 100% a vanity project I don't think I'll be cutting it down. There's a lot I want to do with the guitar tracks yet. For sure they are going to be louder. I have many guitar tracks layered (I think there's about 20 guitars playing the harmonies) and I think they were turned down so I could focus on other issues. Drums will be coming up. Bass will be dropping down a bit.

Bob Oister, I am very pleased that my efforts to scatter a lot of stuff around in the song were noticed. Sadly, I can't do much with the piano part because that Midi track is long gone and I'm left to deal with the bounced tracks. I'm still having a hard time getting the bass sound I want. I want it to be a driving force in the song without being overpowering. I struggle to find a balance. Unless I dig out my old Korg ih harmonizer I'm stuck with my solo vocal. I just can't hit the high notes anymore. I think we all agree that the drums need to come up. That will be my final edit, I think. I write, and automate, the percussion around everything else. And there's sooo much percussion going on. 4 snare tracks, 4 tom tom tracks, a Surdo track, 2 tympani tracks, an altered pitch woodblock, and more. I may be in over my head on this one. I'm working on another song now and I plan on keeping it a lot simpler. If I can. Sometime the power of the DAW overcomes me and I just can't stop adding stuff. There isn't anyone looking over my shoulder saying "WTF are you doing??" so off I go.

darylcrowley, Oh, for sure I plan on doing a better vocal. That's just something I threw down to write the other parts around. I don't try to be self-deprecating, just honest. A man should know his limitations. I can't sing as well as I used to and can't play guitar nearly as good as I used to. That's not humility, that's a fact. And it's very frustrating. I do take pride in lots of things I do, I just don't brag about them. I proved anything I needed to prove a long time ago.

Great song!  I like the synth in the intro too, and see why you want to keep it.  Perhaps if you'd work it in during the rest of the song (or at least the first verse), it wouldn't seem so disjointed from the rest of the song.  I love the bass part.  And the guitars are great.

You didn't really delete the midi piano part, did you?  If you're ever tempted to do that again, remember that takes hardly any space on your HD.  :)  Just leave it, then you can edit to your heart's content. :) 

Nice work!

Like many here, I like the Motif going on in this.  Very cool vibe. Just clean up the mix, this will work! 

Great composition, arrangement and playing. Nice transition to the rock and roll parts which are illustrative. Perhaps a bit more volume on the vocal and less quantification on the piano.  

pssst.....don't delete the midi piano track. It hardly takes up any space.  And you can edit it until the last second.  If it's still there, that is.  :) 

darylcrowley


A gem in the rough.  Some great potential here.  I little omph on the vocals would be my first change and some great suggestions above.

Don't be self-depreciating -  it just gets in the way.  You have some good strenghts here, just develop them and always think "I kick ass", be humble but confident.

You're off to a really good start.

Daryl

I totally agree with Daryl... Just do it...
 

I understand.  :)  I guess I'm just the self-appointed 'don't delete midi tracks' police around here.  You're not the first one I've said that to. 

Anyway, if you have that much fun creating it, then think what fun is ahead.  :)  Carry on!  :)

I might be late getting here, but I can't hear anything wrong with this production. I like every aspect of it. I guess it's a matter of taste and I think your production is very tasteful. I wish I could sound even half as good.

Wow... Huge piece.  I really like how you keep hammering home the 'Dancing with Debbie' motif, both the sung and the instrumental versions.

When you start off with 30 seconds of that arpegiated synth (which I like), the listener probably expects it to be more integrated into the subsequent stuff.  That's my take on the synth.

Cool tune.  And it sounds good.

Peace,

Ian

Alegria, 


markno999, I'm glad you liked it. I used to play this song in my last band years ago and it was a pretty straightforward rhythm guitar driven song. Since I've gotten more into software composition/recording thing I have added parts that I thought would enhance the concept of the song. The "dancing" in the song being a metaphor for two people meeting, learning about each other, falling in love, growing old together. Pushing/pulling, yin-yang. The pieces of a jigsaw puzzle falling into place. That sort of thing. And the beginning part represents the initial attraction that evolves into something new.

Ian Ferrin, Thanks for your positive comments. I didn't really write this song so much as it was born. I sat down with my acoustic guitar with the intention of writing a song with Debbie in the title. Long story. Anyway, in probably less than 15 minutes I had the song finished. It's a simple song but a deeply personal one. The repeated use of "dancing with Debbie" gives me a mental image not unlike the video of Peter Gabriel and Kate Bush holding each other and swaying to the music in the Don't Give Up video.

thepogue, That's just a scratch vocal and I sent it to a reverb bus just so it wouldn't sound so dry while I worked on the song. Hopefully, the finished version will a more cohesive sound to it. There's a LOT of piano stuff I used a volume envelope on so that it comes and goes in the mix. I have so much repetition already I didn't want the keys to add to that. I will take a close look at the piano part you mentioned, and others, when I start working on the song again. The song is far from done and I have many envelopes to tweak before I lay it to rest.

I'm glad you like the guitar work. There are a couple of things in that make me cringe when i hear them but I let them slide because I like other things in that part. Some of the guitar parts are doubled with synths, too. After I recorded the guitar part I would come back and transcribe it in the PRV and layer the synths on it. This is most noticeable at 2:50. The guitar part you hear there is 3 layered guitars and 3 different synths. It seemed like a good idea at the time.