fresh101
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Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
Here is a segment from the article at createdigitalmusic.com. "Digital Performer, and Performer before it, has been a Mac-only program for almost as long as you’ve been able to buy a computer called “Macintosh.” The first Performer release was available in 1985. (Professional Composer, before that, was out in ’84.) Performer, accordingly, has had a big impact on the history of the sequencer, and later the audio and MIDI arrangement hybrid that came to be known as Digital Audio Workstation, throughout the history of the genre. But it’s never run on any Microsoft platform – until now. In an announcement I doubt anyone saw coming, MOTU has announced they’re shipping Digital Performer 8 for both Mac and Windows, in both 32-bit and 64-bit modes. That means, of the major conventional DAWs, nearly all run on both platforms: Pro Tools, Cubase/Nuendo, and now DP, to say nothing of tools like Ableton Live or Reason. All that’s left are Cakewalk’s SONAR, and Apple’s Logic – and Logic is the one made by Apple. Of course, being cross-platform isn’t always good for business – just ask the ghost of Opcode Studio Vision Pro – but recent changes in how software is developed have made cross-platform compatibility and testing more straightforward than they once were. For Windows users, you get VST plug-in support and ReWire compatibility. Other new DP8 features for both Mac and Windows:......." Even Reaper and Fl Studio are Dual OS now. Whole article here http://createdigitalmusic.com/2012/01/digital-performer-runs-on-windows-hell-freezes-over-sonar-left-in-the-cold/#more-22423
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JSkeen
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/23 20:34:22
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Samplitude is another other windows only DAW. I really have no plans to jump ship from Sonar though.
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Rain
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/23 21:57:10
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I'd see it the other way around.
DP has a loyal but relatively small following compared to some others. Their software isn't necessarily the type of application that appeal to people looking for less traditional sequencers, like Live or the upcoming BitWig, so this already leaves them in a niche market.
W/ the recent price drop of Logic, which now sells for less than half the price of Digital Performer, has a bigger following, basically all the same features and is the most obvious "upgrade" for the anyone who starts out on a Mac using GarageBand, I think MOTU felt the heat.
Between such standards as Logic and the de facto Pro Tools, you'd have to offer something fairly different to make a place for yourself on Mac. I'm not sure Steinberg is all too excited about the Logic price drop either.
I don't really see any advantage for Cakewalk in porting Sonar to OSX - the development costs would probably exceed any potential profit. But that's just me.
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Fog
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/24 00:35:22
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pretty much what rain said.. remember to use logic you normally have to by a rather expensive dongle... a mac :) so their model isn't the same as the other rivals... also apple can change CPU when they want and obviously emagic has warning FAR in advance. it's i7 etc now , so a bit easier porting wise... it would be fair to say MOTU is a far more mac-centric company.. as someone pointed out on the article. I ALMOST bought logic just before apple took over emagic.. I'd have been "annoyed" at apple / emagic for pulling the rug on me. Thankfully someone gave me the nod about it in time. so whats to say other things won't pack up dev and be stopped on pc a lot ER with caution now due to past experiences. Most will only buy something thats a bit more mature as a product.. 2 or 3 versions later I guess. they do that, they don't get my business as quick again.. the only thing they understand is lack of sales.
post edited by Fog - 2012/01/24 00:50:46
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Fog
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/24 00:45:13
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elsongs
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/24 02:25:47
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This is interesting...
I'm cross-platform now. My studio DAW is PC-based, running Sonar (7 Producer)...as soon as I'm done with my album, I'm upgrading the machine and getting into this whole X1 business.
My mobile rig is Mac-based, a recent Mac Book Pro. I have Reason 6 on it (as on my PC DAW), but I've been playing the field for a part-time DAW on my Mac. I can certainly use Reason since it's a full-fledged DAW now. I installed a demo of Ableton Live and I also just installed a copy of PreSonus' Studio One that I won in a contest at the NAMM show over the weekend.
Ideally I'd like to run ProTools as a part-time Mac DAW (even though I hate ProTools personally, all but for the sake of compatibility with others). But if Sonar ever went cross-platform, I certainly would have it on my machine. Am I clamoring for Sonar for Mac? Not really, I personally don't care if it happens or not. But if it does happen, I'll definitely use it.
Elson Trinidad Los Angeles, CA, USA Web: www.elsongs.com Twitter: twitter.com/elsongs DAWs: Cakewalk by Bandlab, Cakewalk Sonar Platinum x64, Propellerhead Reason 9, Presonus Studio One v3 OS: Windows 10 Professional CPU: Intel i7 3820 3.6MHz MB: ASRock X79 Xtreme4 RAM: Corsair Vengeance 16GB DDR3 Audio: Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 2nd Generation MIDI: MOTU Microlite & Novation Impulse 61
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BlixYZ
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 10:31:41
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I think that SONAR would do EXTREMELY well in the MAC world. An important thing to remember is that most large studios run MAC (my small studio runs both, with the Sonar rig doing the lion's share of the work).
If Sonar ran on MAC, it would be another option for those BIG studios where all the BIG artists and projects are going on.
As a ProTools 10 and Sonar X1 user, I think Sonar measures up VERY WELL.
I think the development costs would be well worth it- a whole world of producers, engineers and musicians will be opened up to this great product. The more I think about it, it's a no-brainer.
I don't know that I would choose to run it on a MAC- i still prefer my Windows machines at the moment.
I say: GO FOR IT
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John T
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 10:43:14
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Thing is, there are fewer and fewer of those big studios all the time. It's entirely possible - likely even - that that simply isn't where the market is any more. I think it's quite telling that the Mac-only products have gone cross platform, and that ProTools now lets you use non-properietary hardware. The logical assumption, I think, is that it was becoming dangerous to their businesses to not do so.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 10:54:34
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Exactly John.
I think what we're seeing is not really more products becoming cross platform per se, but more a shift away from Apple based hardware.
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GIM Productions
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 11:04:15
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Hi all,i'm little bit tired of those thread......i'm a pro and i use pcs in main studio and i work with mac based studios.I never had a single crash on my system and in many mac record sessions logic crash.Once and for all we mean that Apple is no longer reliable than PC and we should not say the opposite to be fashionable.Sorry,my thought.All my best.
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John T
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 11:10:04
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The other thing is that Apple are in a very powerful position with Logic. As always, Apple don't need their software to generate as much revenue per unit as competitors do, as they make out like bandit on their hardware. So they've got logic at the pro end and GarageBand at the consumer end, at prices that are very very hard to compete with. I can't imagine what he business case for a Mac-only DAW would look like these days.
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eikelbijter
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 14:48:10
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Except that they've 'tasted blood' if you will, making more money than they ever have, and are thus not putting as much effort into Logic as they should. For now it's still a great deal, it comes with lots of goodies, but just wait and you'll see they will neglect it to the point where they're gonna start losing users.... R
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John T
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 14:51:58
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I'm not aware of any evidence of less effort being put into Logic.
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stevec
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 14:52:15
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I can't imagine what he business case for a Mac-only DAW would look like these days. Yup... See recent DP announcement.  One thing I always found interesting about Logic, is that it's created by Apple. Which means one company makes the DAW, the OS on which the DAW runs, and specs out the hardware on which the OS installed. It seems that this combination should result in the most stable DAW *ever*. Hmmm...
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e.Blue
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 15:13:48
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I agree with elSongs and BlixYZ. I also have a PC-based main DAW and a Mac-based mobile rig. I would estimate that greater than 90% of pro musicians and DJs use Macs.Thanks to the strength of the iOS platform, the entire Mac platform is expanding fast. I think that SONAR would do amazingly well on the Mac platform.
For music software companies to be taken seriously in the music industry you pretty much have to be running on the Mac platform. I have never seen a person willing to switch from their Mac to a PC to run SONAR. However, I have seen several switch from PCs to Macs to run Logic or GarageBand.
Although SONAR is probably one of the industries best-kept secrets, I don't think it will ever get the respect that it truly deserve until it's cross platform.
-e.B
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GIM Productions
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 15:44:07
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e.Blue: I have never seen a person willing to switch from their Mac to a PC to run SONAR. However, I have seen several switch from PCs to Macs to run Logic or GarageBand. No,i haven't this sensation,never.Many Mac pros have OS crash with 3d part plugins.Last...Garageband is a Mac children toy.Best
Intel i7 3600,Asus Z170P,16 GIG Corsair ram,Focusrite Saffire Pro 26 i\o,Nektar Impact LX 49,Focusrite Liquid Mix,Monitors ADAM-K&H,Sonar Platinum Windows 10 SP1 Producer....more stuff in SStudio, Rome ,Italy.
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e.Blue
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 16:02:18
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GIM Productions
No,i haven't this sensation,never.Many Mac pros have OS crash with 3d part plugins.Last...Garageband is a Mac children toy.Best
Like I mentioned, I run both Macs and PC. Neither one seems any less stable than the other. Either platform is equally susceptible to poorly-written 3rd-party software. Personally, I can't use the latest version of Melodyne without it crashing SONAR within minutes of trying to use it. Have you actually used Garageband lately? It's actually a pretty powerful DAW now. It may not be suitable for full studio-grade mixing/editing. However, it's easy to use, supports plugins, sounds good and most importantly...it's projects can be opened directly into Logic. There's also even a Garageband version for the iPad. -e.B
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DonM
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 18:47:44
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Most know I am a very long time Sonar user. Since the DOS days. Over the past three years I have been 'forced' to move to a 90% Mac world for compatibility with the clients and stations where I work.
I do run Win7 and 8.5.3 on all of my Macs and blend my location work between PT and Sonar.
I'd say for the first time since the '80's that I agree that an OSX offering may be strategic for the Cake Products. At the university where I teach, 14 years ago Windows outsold Mac's 2:1 in the student space. Today it is about 11:1 Mac over Windows - tough to argue with. - especially as I type on one of my two MacBook Pros.
I will always be a Sonar user, but I can no longer work without a dual 100% Win/OSX environment
-D
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Zo
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 19:42:59
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this is what i call a non event ....i doubt people were waiting for it , just a way for them to try to sell more that nowdayz poor market shares they got ....
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southpaw3473
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 20:09:26
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Bristol_Jonesey
Exactly John.
I think what we're seeing is not really more products becoming cross platform per se, but more a shift away from Apple based hardware.
I agree with that whole-heartedly! Something like 92% (if memory serves) of all computers on this planet run Windows. Apple's revenue stream is really based now on devices-iThis and iThat.
We'll not risk another frontal assault-that rabbit's dynamite!!!
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e.Blue
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 20:25:19
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southpaw3473
Bristol_Jonesey
Exactly John.
I think what we're seeing is not really more products becoming cross platform per se, but more a shift away from Apple based hardware.
I agree with that whole-heartedly! Something like 92% (if memory serves) of all computers on this planet run Windows. Apple's revenue stream is really based now on devices-iThis and iThat.
That 92% number is actually reversed when only pro audio recording is taken into account. Those iDevices also serve as nice lil gateway devices into the Mac ecosystem for Apple. Mac personal computer market share also has been increasing steadily for the past several years. -e.B
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John T
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/26 21:32:55
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southpaw3473
Bristol_Jonesey
Exactly John.
I think what we're seeing is not really more products becoming cross platform per se, but more a shift away from Apple based hardware.
I agree with that whole-heartedly! Something like 92% (if memory serves) of all computers on this planet run Windows. Apple's revenue stream is really based now on devices-iThis and iThat.
Well, that's not what I was driving at. On simple numbers, the Mac OS machines are more numerous than they ever have been. The Mac itself is not going away any time soon. I was more talking about the old market model of (roughly speaking) PCs for consumers, Macs for graphic design, video and audio pros. That is not the shape of the market any more. But as for numbers using Mac OS, that's still on the steady rise its been on for about a decade now.
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Rain
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/27 01:02:35
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eikelbijter
Except that they've 'tasted blood' if you will, making more money than they ever have, and are thus not putting as much effort into Logic as they should. For now it's still a great deal, it comes with lots of goodies, but just wait and you'll see they will neglect it to the point where they're gonna start losing users.... R
That's quite an assumption. Logic 9 came out in July 2009. It's been receiving free updates and patches ever since, the latest one last December. That's quite an unlikely business model for a company which has "tasted blood" isn't it? Of course no one knows what the future holds - but it doesn't seem likely that Apple will be ready to let go of the pro audio market share. Seems like quite the contrary to me.
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Scott Lee
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/27 01:19:02
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John T
Thing is, there are fewer and fewer of those big studios all the time. It's entirely possible - likely even - that that simply isn't where the market is any more. I think it's quite telling that the Mac-only products have gone cross platform, and that ProTools now lets you use non-properietary hardware. The logical assumption, I think, is that it was becoming dangerous to their businesses to not do so.
Not in Los Angeles. Working in the motion picture industry myself, it is very rare we don't see anything but a Mac. This has also been my experience with non-prosumer rigs. Sonar on a Mac would be a very wise move on cakewalks part to stay in this fierce game.
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Rain
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/27 02:32:02
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Scott Lee
John T
Thing is, there are fewer and fewer of those big studios all the time. It's entirely possible - likely even - that that simply isn't where the market is any more. I think it's quite telling that the Mac-only products have gone cross platform, and that ProTools now lets you use non-properietary hardware. The logical assumption, I think, is that it was becoming dangerous to their businesses to not do so.
Not in Los Angeles. Working in the motion picture industry myself, it is very rare we don't see anything but a Mac. This has also been my experience with non-prosumer rigs.
Sonar on a Mac would be a very wise move on cakewalks part to stay in this fierce game.
It's Mac everywhere around me too. I've met one guy recently using DP - the rest is all Logic and Pro Tools. The funny thing though is that when I discuss with those people, we're quite often surprised to find out that many of us started out on a PC, often on Pro Audio/Sonar. I think that what John T means is that the old pro market/big studio isn't expending, while the hobbyist/prosumer market is blossoming. In that sense, it's only normal that Avid and the others start targeting other markets. Still, as I mentioned earlier, my take on it is that I don't think there'd be much of a market for Sonar on the Mac side - beside maybe a few ones who are already using it on Windows and would like to see it on OSX. Typically, those guys I speak with aren't much aware of all the alternatives, at least not the newer ones like Studio One or Reaper. They may know or have heard about Sonar, Nuendo and a few others. But the majority seem to have one thing in common - they're remarkably not interested in a replacement, and usually, they don't obsess over software. They're settled w/ what they have and just focus on music.
post edited by Rain - 2012/01/27 02:33:16
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John T
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/27 11:53:00
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Scott Lee
John T
Thing is, there are fewer and fewer of those big studios all the time. It's entirely possible - likely even - that that simply isn't where the market is any more. I think it's quite telling that the Mac-only products have gone cross platform, and that ProTools now lets you use non-properietary hardware. The logical assumption, I think, is that it was becoming dangerous to their businesses to not do so.
Not in Los Angeles. Working in the motion picture industry myself, it is very rare we don't see anything but a Mac. This has also been my experience with non-prosumer rigs.
Sonar on a Mac would be a very wise move on cakewalks part to stay in this fierce game.
I am sure you're right about Los Angeles. But Los angeles isn't the world, and despite being a big media hub, I wouldn't expect it to be a big enough market on its own to settle the question. To give an opposite example, people working in video game audio are overwhelmingly PC based. I don't think that sways it either.
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southpaw3473
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/27 12:12:56
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John T
Scott Lee
John T
Thing is, there are fewer and fewer of those big studios all the time. It's entirely possible - likely even - that that simply isn't where the market is any more. I think it's quite telling that the Mac-only products have gone cross platform, and that ProTools now lets you use non-properietary hardware. The logical assumption, I think, is that it was becoming dangerous to their businesses to not do so.
Not in Los Angeles. Working in the motion picture industry myself, it is very rare we don't see anything but a Mac. This has also been my experience with non-prosumer rigs.
Sonar on a Mac would be a very wise move on cakewalks part to stay in this fierce game.
I am sure you're right about Los Angeles. But Los angeles isn't the world, and despite being a big media hub, I wouldn't expect it to be a big enough market on its own to settle the question.
To give an opposite example, people working in video game audio are overwhelmingly PC based. I don't think that sways it either.
A very good point about the gaming industry. My son is in the industry here on the east coast and nobody uses a mac. He's a 3D modeling and asset artist and he says that all of the really high end industry standard programs are all biased to PC. Game companies don't write games for Macs, basically. The industry ain't what it used to be. Most major and mid level studios all around my neck of the woods are gone. Most of those engineers have migrated to home and project studios. I work with several of them.
We'll not risk another frontal assault-that rabbit's dynamite!!!
Tommy Byrnes Sonar Platinum Win 10 Pro x64 AMD FX 8350 Eight-Core 4.00GHz/ ASRock 970 Extreme4/ 16 gigs RAMUA Apollo Firewire/UA 2 Quad Satellite/ Focusrite OctoPre/Makie Onyx1220i Mixer THANK YOU!!!
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Scott Lee
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/27 12:42:40
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John T
Scott Lee
John T
Thing is, there are fewer and fewer of those big studios all the time. It's entirely possible - likely even - that that simply isn't where the market is any more. I think it's quite telling that the Mac-only products have gone cross platform, and that ProTools now lets you use non-properietary hardware. The logical assumption, I think, is that it was becoming dangerous to their businesses to not do so.
Not in Los Angeles. Working in the motion picture industry myself, it is very rare we don't see anything but a Mac. This has also been my experience with non-prosumer rigs.
Sonar on a Mac would be a very wise move on cakewalks part to stay in this fierce game.
I am sure you're right about Los Angeles. But Los angeles isn't the world, and despite being a big media hub, I wouldn't expect it to be a big enough market on its own to settle the question.
To give an opposite example, people working in video game audio are overwhelmingly PC based. I don't think that sways it either.
John, In all fairness, That is not always the case.. I'll be glad to show my record also working for Volition, THQ, Blizzard, Novalogic and other gaming companies since 1990. While I did compose on Sonar in some - not all cases, projects, the music side of even that industry I was the "rare" sound designer. The graphic side of the video game industry likes 3d studio max and maya, which is heavy dominated, audio was Mac preferred. Not sure what part of the world you are reffering too, but coming from a media driven state that I do, and even industry jobs posted, it's not hard to see where the market is.. Volition in illinois was the only company really back in 1997 that was both pc and Mac in the audio dept when I did the soundtrack to the playstation 2 games summoner and free space 2/ red faction on sonar. Me and the other composer Dan wentz while writing in pro audio, used the macs to get the job done.. That was really the only company that pcs in the audio dept were as common as the Mac counterparts when I was working as senior sound designer. Best,
post edited by Scott Lee - 2012/01/27 14:18:51
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bitflipper
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/27 13:06:15
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I, for one, am interested in looking at DP on PC. The install base for DP may be small, but its users are quite enthusiastic in their support for it. The fact that it exists at all when a less-expensive Mac alternative is available suggests that it must have something to offer. I am still shopping for a classic DAW along the lines of pre-X1 SONAR. Studio One is getting there but needs to bake a little longer. Reaper is a great value but clumsy with multi-timbral synths and MIDI editing. Cubase is off the table. I have no intention of growing a goatee and getting a Mac. With so few options, it's encouraging that DP adds one more. My main concern is that the PC version may be slower and buggier than the Mac version, and MOTU support personnel may not have enough Windows expertise to adequately advise Windows users and to diagnose problems. Cakewalk has spent many years tweaking SONAR to extract every last drop of performance out of Windows. You can't replicate that with a compiler switch.
post edited by bitflipper - 2012/01/27 15:08:35
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DW_Mike
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Re:Digital Performer Runs on Windows, X1 only win/D.A.W. left!
2012/01/27 13:33:58
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I've been considering going with a Mac running Bootcamp.
What, if any, would be the benefit of having a Mac version of Sonar as opposed to Bootcamp-ing it?
Is bootcamp unstable and iffy or does that just basically create an overpriced off the shelf Dell type of thing?
Mike
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