Anderton
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Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
So...as forumites know, I am not above embarrassing myself publicly if I think I can help others not make the same kind of stupid mistake  I installed X3c and recorded a hex guitar part. There were little dropouts and annoying crackles on both record and playback and I had never experienced this before. I figured there was some X3c problem so I rolled back to X3b. To make a long story short and prevent more embarrassment, I realized that the record and playback buffer I/O sizes had somehow reverted to 256. When I increased them back to their usual values, X3c worked fine. Based on advice in this forum I left 64-bit engine unchecked, and haven't encountered any problems.
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bobbyswamp
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/04 22:18:13
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LOL! Been there! Thanks for posting...
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Thatsastrat
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/04 23:12:05
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Anderton
So...as forumites know, I am not above embarrassing myself publicly if I think I can help others not make the same kind of stupid mistake
I installed X3c and recorded a hex guitar part. There were little dropouts and annoying crackles on both record and playback and I had never experienced this before. I figured there was some X3c problem so I rolled back to X3b.
To make a long story short and prevent more embarrassment, I realized that the record and playback buffer I/O sizes had somehow reverted to 256. When I increased them back to their usual values, X3c worked fine.
Based on advice in this forum I left 64-bit engine unchecked, and haven't encountered any problems.
Ok I'll bite. What are the usual values that you have set. I think I have left those set to the the default of 256 thru Sonar 7, 8 ,8.5, X1 and X2. I am having cpu spikes and pops and crackles in X2, maybe I should look into raising my values.
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tecknot
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 00:34:45
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Your humility is only equaled by your generosity.
Kind regards,
tecknot
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Danny Danzi
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 01:56:09
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☄ Helpfulby DesertHermit 2013/11/05 21:23:10
Anderton
So...as forumites know, I am not above embarrassing myself publicly if I think I can help others not make the same kind of stupid mistake
I installed X3c and recorded a hex guitar part. There were little dropouts and annoying crackles on both record and playback and I had never experienced this before. I figured there was some X3c problem so I rolled back to X3b.
To make a long story short and prevent more embarrassment, I realized that the record and playback buffer I/O sizes had somehow reverted to 256. When I increased them back to their usual values, X3c worked fine.
Based on advice in this forum I left 64-bit engine unchecked, and haven't encountered any problems.
Hey Craig, I wonder if that playback/record I/O really was the problem and not just the 64-bit engine check box? I've always gotten pops and crackles having the 64-bit engine box checked. The reason I say that, I've never experienced any crackles or pops from the record/playback I/O settings. I can run 128 and 256 for just about anything. But I use 512 for my large projects. If you set it to 1024, you would just get a 1/2 to 1 second lag before sound kicked in after pressing space bar. Lower than 128 might bring on pops and clicks, but I've never been lower than 128. Most of the time I'm at 512 and my hard drives barely show any activity even with large projects. You said you increased from 256, so I take it you're a 512 man also. I've never in the history of using Cake or Sonar had a drop out from my hard drive using 512 in both playback and recording I/O. 128 and 256 are snappier of course and work perfectly for me....but leaving it at 512 just handled everything without the need to ever make a change. I'd be willing to bet it was that 64 check box. ;) -Danny
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FastBikerBoy
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 02:57:42
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Thatsastrat
Anderton
So...as forumites know, I am not above embarrassing myself publicly if I think I can help others not make the same kind of stupid mistake
I installed X3c and recorded a hex guitar part. There were little dropouts and annoying crackles on both record and playback and I had never experienced this before. I figured there was some X3c problem so I rolled back to X3b.
To make a long story short and prevent more embarrassment, I realized that the record and playback buffer I/O sizes had somehow reverted to 256. When I increased them back to their usual values, X3c worked fine.
Based on advice in this forum I left 64-bit engine unchecked, and haven't encountered any problems.
Ok I'll bite. What are the usual values that you have set. I think I have left those set to the the default of 256 thru Sonar 7, 8 ,8.5, X1 and X2. I am having cpu spikes and pops and crackles in X2, maybe I should look into raising my values.
I've always found the I/O buffers to be system specific rather than a "one size suits all" thing. Every time I change my set up I go through the procedure of balancing the recording & playback I/O buffers against the sample buffer I prefer to run on my interface. Basically those I/O buffers are used for reading and writing to disk. Too large can be as bad as too small as they then take too long to fill and that's dependent on how efficient your hard drive is. Trial and error is the method I use but it is only a one time thing unless something changes on your system. That's all in my experience btw rather than based on any scientific fact. HTH
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Houndawg
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 09:10:15
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Craig mentioned a "hex" guitar part in his original post. To me, a hex pickup is a divided pickup often used with guitar-midi interfaces, so I read his mention of playback and recording buffers to mean the MIDI buffer settings, not the audio interface buffers. I may be wrong, hopefully Craig will clarify.
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Sir Les
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 09:27:04
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Well I have not checked the 64 bit engine issue...But I have changed buffers up and down and still get drop outs and recorded anomalies in x2a, and then in X3b...With that engine checked as specified to do....So I will uncheck this feature....and try try again.
Funny thing is in X3b...when changing Buffer sizes with in the preference pane , the sonar x3b software shuts down...
So for me it isn't about buffer sizes, it is about something else...again I have not turned off the 64 bit engine, and will try that next.
But the features mentioned in this post...are suppose to work within the confines of the code....if they do not work as coded...then it is a bug....I say.
More input is necessary before making rash statements about cause and effect....Dani D has it right I believe.
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Beepster
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 10:02:44
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Just had to do this in X2 to prevent Audio Engine stops in a track heavy project.
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FastBikerBoy
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 11:29:47
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Houndawg
Craig mentioned a "hex" guitar part in his original post. To me, a hex pickup is a divided pickup often used with guitar-midi interfaces, so I read his mention of playback and recording buffers to mean the MIDI buffer settings, not the audio interface buffers. I may be wrong, hopefully Craig will clarify.
I'm sure Craig will clarify but he does specifically mention the I/O playback & record buffers as opposed to the MIDI buffer. The I/O buffers relate to read and write operations to the hard drive. Too small and there isn't enough data available when needed. Too big and they take too long to fill, either can cause problems.
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Beepster
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 11:36:47
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If I'm reading his OP correctly:
Craig has a fancy electric guitar (not MIDI) with hex pickups that record the audio of each string thus giving six different outputs* that all need their own tracks. By having that many tracks recording/playing at once it sounds like it exceed his HDD capabilities so he upped the buffer.
*He used it in his Advanced Workshop series to show how to turn a six string guitar into a twelve string with the use of pitch shifting and delay which is how I know this... I'm not stalking him I swear! ;-)
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Danny Danzi
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 15:31:25
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Beepster
I'm not stalking him I swear! ;-) Pff, I'm stalking him! I'm hoping he gives me a job doing something. LOL!!!
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konradh
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 15:42:40
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Craig, When you refer 64-bit engine, do you mean on audio export, or is there some other place?
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garrigus
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 15:53:34
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garrigus
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 15:55:57
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☄ Helpfulby DesertHermit 2013/11/05 21:22:38
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wizard71
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 16:06:54
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I have to go 1024 or the audio engine stops when I am listening to a 2 bar loop for instance.
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Beepster
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 16:14:32
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Danny Danzi
Beepster
I'm not stalking him I swear! ;-)
Pff, I'm stalking him!
Perhaps we can compare notes... Oh crap, I've said too much!
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EricDeluxe
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 18:00:17
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Anderton
So...as forumites know, I am not above embarrassing myself publicly if I think I can help others not make the same kind of stupid mistake I installed X3c and recorded a hex guitar part. There were little dropouts and annoying crackles on both record and playback and I had never experienced this before. I figured there was some X3c problem so I rolled back to X3b. To make a long story short and prevent more embarrassment, I realized that the record and playback buffer I/O sizes had somehow reverted to 256. When I increased them back to their usual values, X3c worked fine. Based on advice in this forum I left 64-bit engine unchecked, and haven't encountered any problems.
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EricDeluxe
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 18:05:35
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Hello Craig You gave me a new idea to check... I have noise as stated in this thread: http://forum.cakewalk.com...spx?m=2925568&fp=4What are your Normal settings of I/O? Should you uncheck 64 engine even on 64 bit systems? I run Windows 8.1 64 bit W Sonar X3c Thanks
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jb101
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 18:55:01
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☄ Helpfulby DesertHermit 2013/11/05 21:22:28
ErikDeluxe
Hello Craig
You gave me a new idea to check... I have noise as stated in this thread: http://forum.cakewalk.com...spx?m=2925568&fp=4
What are your Normal settings of I/O?
Should you uncheck 64 engine even on 64 bit systems? I run Windows 8.1 64 bit W Sonar X3c
Thanks
Yes, un-check the 64 bit Double Precision Engine. It has nothing to do with running a 64 bit machine.
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thepianist65
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 19:37:06
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Recently I've been hearing pops and clicks, also, and stuttering when manipulating plug-ins, etc., which was not happening upon initial upgrade to X3 from X2. However I did notice my I/O Buffers were also set to 256, which I must have done a long time ago for some reason, so I'm going back to 512 to try this out, since this is apparently the default values.
Thanks, Craig and Scott for the info.
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DesertHermit
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 21:22:10
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Thank you, Craig. As you know I had done some other things to stop the crackles, mostly freezing synths, which I've never had to do in the past, but this fix worked. Like EricDeluxe said, I'm running a 64-bit system so I just assumed I should have that box checked to take advantage of running 64-bit. So now I'm running 64-bit unchecked and 512 in the buffers and things seem to be good. I hope more users see this.
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Guitarpima
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/05 21:40:41
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I often wondered about that guitar. When I saw that Gibson made that I thought it was overkill. If you ever do a cover of something with that guitar Craig I would love it if you would post a .bun file just to see what it's all about. I'll never be able to afford one.
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bapu
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/06 00:56:01
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If all I have is audio in a project (no Soft-synths or 3rd party FXs) I can still go down to 64 to record. Once I went to 48 and it seemed ok.
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EricDeluxe
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/06 02:06:55
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Ok thanx. Tried this but can't hear any difference.
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jps
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/06 02:52:44
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From the help file :
●
I/O Buffer Size. This value determines the buffer characteristics for transfers to and from the disk. Changing this value does not affect audio latency, but will affect the disk throughput for audio tracks. The default setting is 128. A higher value causes more audio to be buffered from the disk ahead of the playback cursor. If you are hearing consistent dropouts/clicks in your audio and if your project contains high bit depth (32/64 bit) or high sample rate audio (88.2K or higher), it may be indicative of a too small I/O buffer size. If so, try a higher I/O buffer size like 256 or 512. If audio problems persist, reset to 128 and try a different remedy.
Also, if you are playing a large file, and using maximum latency, a too-small I/O buffer size may cause dropouts or crashes. Try increasing the buffer size by blocks of 128.
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Beepster
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/06 06:21:20
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Guitarpima
I often wondered about that guitar. When I saw that Gibson made that I thought it was overkill. If you ever do a cover of something with that guitar Craig I would love it if you would post a .bun file just to see what it's all about. I'll never be able to afford one.
You could just buy a pickup (and breakout box) from this guy... http://www.ubertar.com/hexaphonic/index.html
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Beepster
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/06 06:29:17
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And I'm not sure but I think that if you are doing a specific search for that type of pickup the term is "hexaphonic" while "hex" seems to apply to MIDI pickups as well... but I'm not sure. I only mention this because when I went looking for that site I was getting a lot of MIDI pickup results. Adding "phonic" narrowed it down to the audio ones (although it seems that guy is one of the only dudes who produces/sells them). I also found a gearslutz thread talking about making your own but heck if I understand what they're on about... http://www.gearslutz.com/...ckup-guitar-synth.html
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Sanderxpander
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/06 07:29:24
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I had a weird issue with my Fast Track Pro. I got terrible results in Sonar X3, lots of crackle and distortion, with a buffer of 512. When normally I kept it at 256. I was in a rush and had to increase it to 1024 to continue tracking. After fiddling with it, I found I could put it down to 128 (its minimum setting). I just had to increase it initially and then bring it back down. No idea what was up there.
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2:43AM
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Re: Dumb & Simple Fix for Crackles with X3c
2013/11/06 07:34:30
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Turning off 64-bit engine? Seems contradictory to the many posts that say to turn it on, or leave it on. After all, it's probably a setting that doesn't even really matter. I believe that for most situations, and possibly for 50% of the Sonar population, nVidia graphics cards are to blame for most, if not all, audio crackles and pops caused by latencies. It would be interesting to set up a poll (is that even possible?). I know that I am biased, and a little negative towards the topic, because I am one of the "50%" that's experiencing problems.
post edited by 2:43AM - 2013/11/06 07:54:08
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