greenfrog
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Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
Hi Guys, With the Crystal soft synth I can create track envelopes for all kinds of synth parameters (filters, pulse width, mogrify etc etc), to modify the sound of the synth as the track plays (this is a very common technique in the sort of music I am trying to write, so I'm really keen on it!!). I use Right-Click -> Envelopes -> Create Track Envelope -> Crystal 1 ... and then I get the list of parameters (as check boxes) that I can choose to automate with the envelope. HOWEVER.... there are no such options when I do the equivalent for Cakewalk TTS, or Triangle II (another great free soft synth from Cakewalk). I just get an empty box. These synths have loads of parameters in their consoles (well, Triangle II does), so surely there must be a way to automate them, right? What am I doing wrong please? Thanks! Peter
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RobertB
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 3:24 PM
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Peter, the automation for Triangle is done in the synth audio track. Right click the audio track, and you should see a submenu for all of the parameters. It is a very long list for Triangle. Once you get it set up, you can sit back and watch all the little knobs spin around.
post edited by RobertB - January 29, 09 3:29 PM
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gamblerschoice
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 3:25 PM
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I have never seen any one else mentioning envelopes inside of tts or triangle here. I think it would be a great idea, it would make the soft synth world much more usefull. Maybe you might try the Techniques forum, go to "all forums" at the top of the page here, and then the Techniques forum is listed there. Maybe some one else here can help more, but that would be my only suggestion. Later Albert
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greenfrog
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 3:33 PM
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Robert, I am right-clicking on the audio track (not the midi track), but when Envelopes -> Create Track Envelope -> Triangle II ..., the dialog box contains no entries..... just emptiness. Are we talking about the same synth? You said Triangle, I have Triangle II (or are you also referring to Triangle II?) Thanks, Peter
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RobertB
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 3:40 PM
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Yes, I mean Triangle II. I'll double check when I get home from work this evening. You should see oscillators, filters, all the fun stuff. I'll get back to you.
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greenfrog
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 4:11 PM
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Thanks Robert, I appreciate it
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Beagle
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 4:14 PM
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It depends entirerly upon the softsynth as to which parameters are automatable. I just checked and there are no extra automatable parameters available for TTS-1. I don't have crystal, but I do have PSYN II which is a modelled synth and there are many parameters avaiable to automate on PSYN II such as OSC 1-4 phase, wavelength, transpose, fine tune, LFO, and many, many more. if the creator of the softsynth didn't create automatable parameters for that softsynth, then you can't access them.
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RobertB
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 8:47 PM
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 The screen shot above is a Triangle II track. The audio track shows an envelope created using Create Track Envelope. The MIDI track shows data coming from my controller (radical filter sweeps). What OS are you using? I wonder if Triangle II doesn't completely agree with it. I am getting the full menu here (using XP). Do you have a controller? If so, does Triangle respond to changes from the controller? Any details you can provide may help.
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Guitarhacker
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 9:59 PM
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I think you can automate some of the parameters of TTS...although I have not used this I think this is how you would proceed..... Insert a new midi track and right click in it and select create track envelopes.... then you can select midi (envelope) and you should be able to choose from a list of items..... link them to TTS and see what happens.
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57Gregy
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 10:09 PM
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I think greenfrog is referring to these: I right-clicked in the Triangle II audio track and got what he said he is seeing. RobertB, you're talking about the control panel for T-II, right?
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Beagle
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 10:19 PM
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that's exactly what I was talking about. Triangle II and TTS-1 both have blanks available just like Greg has shown because there are no automatable parameters for those synths. Crystal probably does have automatable parameters and that's what the OP is seeing. PSYN II also has several automatable parameters.
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57Gregy
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 10:51 PM
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There is a section in the Triangle II help file about "MIDI Learn". Not exactly automation, but you can assign any T-II knob to any MIDI controller....or is it the other way around? Anyway, it might be of help to you.
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Tap
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 11:00 PM
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Greg, If that is so, then I think that should work. If you assign a midi CC to a "knob" then I believe you can control it in the Piano Roll... Just wondering... will that also allow you to assign an envelope to it as well ? -- TAP --
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Beagle
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 29, 09 11:03 PM
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if you can assign the parameters to some CC value then you can control them on the MIDI track instead of on the synth track using the ENVELOPES>CREATE TRACK ENVELOPE>MIDI function. that will pop up a window allowing you to choose which CC value you want to control in the MIDI track envelope.
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greenfrog
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 2:01 AM
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Robert, I'm using Windows Vista Home Premium (32 bit). Yes, I use a MIDI controller, the M-Audio Oxygen 61. Yes, Triangle II responds to a small number of the knobs / sliders on my controller (some filters, vloume, some chorus setting... seems like a random selection and 90% of the controls have no effect on it). My problem is shown precisely in Greg's post #10. I've never heard of midi CC values before (I've been using MC4 for a long time now but still feel like I've only learned about 10% of it!!). I'm going to try it tonight and see if I can automate using MIDI envelopes as Beagle suggested. Thanks so much for all the help everyone, this place gives the best tech support I've ever experienced!!!
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RobertB
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 8:04 AM
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This is kind of strange. I'm' not doing anything out of the ordinary when I insert the synth, but I see this:
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Beagle
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 8:06 AM
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Robert - is that Sonar 8? maybe they updated the parameters between Sonar 6/ MC4 (MC4 is based on sonar 6 and Sonar 6 is what I have) and sonar 8?
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RobertB
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 8:10 AM
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No, that's SHS6XL. I used it because of the similarities you mention.
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Beagle
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 12:10 AM
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hmmm - that's really odd that Greg's doesn't have those parameters but yours does! Greg - I'm assuming you're photos are of SHS6XL as well? Sonar 6 didn't have Triangle, so i don't have it to check directly. something really odd going on for certain!
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57Gregy
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 12:53 AM
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Right, I have SHS 6 XL, too. I downloaded T-II from the Cakewalk site. Weird.
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RobertB
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 1:05 PM
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Greg, are you running XP or Vista? TII is an older DXi synth, and I wonder if this might be an underlying code issue with Vista. Anybody else running XP that might want to check this out?
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Beagle
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 1:05 PM
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ah - I didn't even realize it was a free download. I'll try that tonite or tomorrow when I get time and see if I get the same results.
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57Gregy
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 1:19 PM
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XP. I tried it in MC Pro 24, too, and didn't even get the Triangle II to appear in the envelopes dialog box like in SHS 6. Just the usual envelope choices.
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RobertB
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 9:16 PM
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Well. that blows my Vista theory. What are we not seeing?
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Beagle
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 9:27 PM
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I don't know what the difference is. Bob did you download Triangle or did you get it on a disk with SHS or Sonar? I just downloaded it and I get nothing for parameters to automate. I'm using Sonar 6PE, WinXP
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RobertB
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 9:42 PM
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I can't say for certain, but I believe I may have downloaded it. This is curious, indeed.
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Beagle
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 9:55 PM
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I don't know what the difference is then. very puzzling.
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57Gregy
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 10:38 PM
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Could it be a difference in DXi and VSTi? Mine is a DXi, but it seems there is a VSTi version, too. What version is yours, Bob?
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Beagle
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 30, 09 11:15 PM
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good question. the download version is DXi.
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Tap
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RE: Track envelope automation for Triangle II / Cakewalk TTS parameters
January 31, 09 2:29 AM
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O.K. I was going to go to bed ( It's about 2:00AM ) but I thought I would try this in MC4 (XP) I inserted Triangle 2 as a soft synth. Then on the Triangle 2 Midi Track I was able to right click on envelopes and select Triangle 2 to get all of the different options controllable like RobertB. -- TAP --
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