Texrat
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 13:47:08
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I could not find more recent info offhand, but I read last year that the California bill would be signed. I will try to confirm.
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slartabartfast
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 14:53:23
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PUBLIC LAW 110–140—DEC. 19, 2007 ORIGINAL: henkejs
So, you're saying old-fashioned incandescents are going to be outlawed soon? I need to read more about this -- can you tell me where it's been reported? Not trying to be argumentative, I just don't watch television news.
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alexoosthoek
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 14:57:18
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There is a lot of pop science in this. Yes CO2 is up. But the cause and effect of Global Warming - if it is a permanent straight line - have NEVER EVER been proven. And, when I was about 20, people were screaming about the pending ice age.
Have to agree with that, nobody knows for sure. For all we know the global warming could turn into a global "cooling", the temps are measured over what, some 200-300 years or something like that. That is nothing compared to earth's history, I think that it will take a much longer period to claim that temps are going up or down. I don't say we should be wasting energy and stop surching for new energy-recourses. But there is a lot of money involved in all of this and some people would like it to put that money in their pockets. Regards, Alex
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Guitarhacker
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 18:06:10
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ORIGINAL: henkejs
So, you're saying old-fashioned incandescents are going to be outlawed soon? I need to read more about this -- can you tell me where it's been reported? Not trying to be argumentative, I just don't watch television news.
The phase-out of incandescent light is to begin with the 100-watt bulb in 2012 and end in 2014 with the 40-watt. All light bulbs must use 25 percent to 30 percent less 2014. By 2020, bulbs must be 70 percent more efficient than they are today. Australia was the first country to announce an outright ban by 2010. Google Incadescent light banned... or read more here... http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=59298 There are a bunch of news stories on this...yeah...it's real. Light bulbs are going the way of the dinosuar.
post edited by Guitarhacker - 2009/04/01 18:14:01
My website & music: www.herbhartley.com MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface BMI/NSAI "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer "
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Guitarhacker
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 18:11:30
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If you want to see what the USSA will look like in a few years... go to a third world country. I returned from Argentina....not exactly third world.... but every light in every house was a CFL. Mostly hanging from a pendant in the center of the room.
Almost every car & truck down there is dual fuel. Natural gas and gasoline...change with the flip of a switch on the dash... CNG is cheaper so most of my friends there used that instead of Gasoline.
My website & music: www.herbhartley.com MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface BMI/NSAI "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer "
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Texrat
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 18:16:08
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ORIGINAL: alexoosthoek
There is a lot of pop science in this. Yes CO2 is up. But the cause and effect of Global Warming - if it is a permanent straight line - have NEVER EVER been proven. And, when I was about 20, people were screaming about the pending ice age.
Have to agree with that, nobody knows for sure.
For all we know the global warming could turn into a global "cooling", the temps are measured over what, some 200-300 years or something like that.
That is nothing compared to earth's history, I think that it will take a much longer period to claim that temps are going up or down.
I don't say we should be wasting energy and stop surching for new energy-recourses. But there is a lot of money involved in all of this and some people would like it to put that money in their pockets.
Regards,
Alex
No, Alex. There is ice core data showing climate trends going back hundreds of thousands of years. Google "Vostok"-- but don't fall for the edited versions of the data table. Many naysayers have stripped out the most critical aspect to match their agenda. Look for the complete table that illustrates climate trends since the dawn of the Industrial Age, and then read the analysis of why this is significant.
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Fog
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 19:48:16
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I remember ages ago , they spoke of stopping selling the old fashioned lights.. seems this is apparent now when I go shopping for bulbs. the ones a few years ago, although they said equivalent to 40-60 watt bulb.. well weren't so good. they have got better, but I notice they are dimmer than the older sort still. or the bases on the newer bulbs, look silly in the sense of they raise the light so much over a light shade..e.g. a lamp. as for the halogen lights that are in ceilings.. well they have dimmers on the old sort.. to get the energy efficient ones isn't cheap.. and the other sort you can't have a dimmer on
post edited by Fog - 2009/04/01 19:56:20
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foxwolfen
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 20:07:21
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ORIGINAL: Guitarhacker
Foxwolfen...that's a cheap shot buddy. I expect a more intellegent response from you than that.
Any body can tell you the NRA has nothing to do with lightbulbs.
Lets stay on topic: LIGHT BULBS
You set the rules bro. Now live by em.
A scientist knows more & more about less & less till he knows everything about nothing, while a philosopher knows less & less about more & more till he knows nothing about everything. Composers Forum
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auto_da_fe
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 20:25:45
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I am not particularly green.....but I am cheap and lazy.
Here is my personal experience with CFLs...and I have the data to proove it...(1.5 years worth of power bills)
Despite the fact that the power company (FPL - Florida) has raised prices twice in the last 2 years, my power bill is flat or slightly less month to month from 1 year ago.
All I have done is replace all incandescents with CFLs. (when they burn out, not just because) (And you are all correct, I would need to factor in cost of bulbs etc...but I buy them in bulk, so they are not too expensive that way and now I have enough for the next 5 years)
It does not take a scientist to figure out that a bulb you cannot touch with out burning your hand (incandescent) is going to be heating up your house a lot more and thereby turning on the air conditioner a lot more, which is most of my power bill in Florida in the summer, spring and fall. So, while there may be some other reason for this decline in power bill, caeterus paribus, I have not been able to put my finger on it.
Also, I have a lamp that hangs above a stair case and I need an extension ladder to change the bulb. I was on that ladder at least 3 times a year with incandescents. I changed to CFL over a year ago and the ladder has not been needed.
So you all can argue and postulate whether this move to CFLS is good or bad, all I know is seems to save me money on my power bill and it definitely saves me work.
I still remember when 'they' made us all wear seatbelts and all it did was screw up the whole organ donor supply. I hope this is not another situation where something that seems good on the surface has unintended bad consequences later on. (tongue firmly in cheek)
JR
HP DV6T - 2670QM, 8 GB RAM, Sonar Platypus, Octa Capture, BFD2 & Jamstix3, Komplete 10 and Komplete Kontrol Win 10 64 SLS PS8R Monitors and KRK Ergo https://soundcloud.com/airportface
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jhughs
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 21:11:13
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I was an early adopter of CFLs, but I still find that in some situations, an incandescent bulb works better; e.g. when using a dimmer or any light that's going to be turn on for just a few seconds at a time (like in a closet). Tried a three-way CFL, but it stopped working properly after a few months.
I did have one pop and smoke - so that's disconcerting (any mercury in that smoke?)
We haven't noticed a major change in out electric bill, but there's the problem: this should be a personal choice and not mandated; the government should focus on a way for people to easily monitor their electricity usage. People should have a choice whether to use CFLs or not.
They mandated low flow toilets and how well did that turn out?
All that's going to happen with this is that people will have a living room full of CFLs while they watch their 62inch plasma screens.
ASUS P5ND/Intel E8500, Line6 Toneport UX2/PODFarm, Sonar, Axiom 25, Blue Bluebird, Audio-Technica AT3035s, Blue Snowflake, Line6 Spider IV 150 & AMPLIFI, Crate 1 J Hughs Soundclick
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Texrat
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 21:19:25
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Hey jhughs-- some low-flow toilets work VERY well. My Vitra for example: much less water and OUTperforms the big beast it replaced. It's all in the re-engineering; one can't simply reduce tank size and be done. But back on topic, I agree where it comes to forcing CFLs on us. The policy needs more thought. I have seen a benefit to my power bill but I did not go whole hog-- I have a balanced mix of CFL, incandescent and halogen. I will soon be adding skylights and solar tubes. I also added glass blocks to an outer bathroom wall and half the time don't even need the lights. You can't beat the power savings on those.  Oh, and I've got some CFLs in closets that have been going for over 5 years, no problem. You have to buy the ones with a decent ballast.
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i8ipop
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 22:30:40
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the sun wasn't shining. the sun is always shining! just like my beeeeeeeeautiful dental work! I can't believe no-ones commented on my recent oral upgrades?
post edited by i8ipop - 2009/04/01 22:39:26
Still raining...still dreaming!
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foxwolfen
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/01 22:45:36
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ORIGINAL: jhughs
All that's going to happen with this is that people will have a living room full of CFLs while they watch their 62inch plasma screens.
Now that is something worth complaining about!
A scientist knows more & more about less & less till he knows everything about nothing, while a philosopher knows less & less about more & more till he knows nothing about everything. Composers Forum
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Guitarhacker
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/02 08:11:43
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I did have one pop and smoke - so that's disconcerting (any mercury in that smoke?)
Not unless the glass broke. The mercury is inside the bulb... But the electronics that smoked...there's no telling what toxic stuff is in there. I have had a few CFL's do the same thing. Turning a CFL on for just a few seconds.... like locating a shirt in a closet ...or leaving them on for extended periods of time.... like in the evening when you're home... shortens the bulb's life. The ones I have used do NOT seem to be giving me the long life...as seen on TV.... I have also heard...never verified buy doing an actual test myself.... that a florescent light uses more current to start than an equal wattage incadescent uses in 30 minutes of running..... meaning, if you turn a florescent light on & off frequently, you will burn more energy than if you leave it run after turning it on. At least that's what my electrical/electronics teacher said in class one day. I was actually in favor of swapping out every incadescent in my house about a year after they were introduced, and the price had fallen a bit. They were quite expensive to start. My wife didn't like the color of the light.... something about the carpet & drapes looked dull in their light...or the fact that they took a few minutes to "warm up" to full brightness. I noticed that a few of the ones I did manage to install didn't last near as long as they were supposed to...some burned out rather quickly. I don't think they should be Mandated by government...after all...we do live in the "Land of the Free" where we are supposed to be able to make our own choices. To smoke or not, to drink or not, to use CFL's or not.
My website & music: www.herbhartley.com MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface BMI/NSAI "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer "
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OffAnAirplane
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/02 08:31:12
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ORIGINAL: space_cowboy
You make electricity from natural gas by burning gas to heat water to make steam to drive a turbine that generates AC electricity.
Kinda sorta. Actually in most natural gas plants they utilize what is called "combined-cycle process." This means that you will typically have 2 or 3 natural gas fired turbines making electricity and the exhaust from those turbines (which would normally be vented to the atmosphere and waste a ton of heat energy) is used to heat very large boilers and make steam which is used to power a steam turbine and make even more electricity. So basically the steam turbine is making electricity for free, because it is using heat that would normally be wasted from the combustion turbines. It's a very effecient system. And it's not like the steam turbine just puts out a little power. It puts out more than any of the combustion turbines. And out where I work, we use "Low-Mercury" flourescents. Which can be just thrown in the trash legally. I don't know why those haven't reached the consumer market yet. Hopefully they will.
post edited by OffAnAirplane - 2009/04/02 09:00:22
Rom 8:18 For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us.
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auto_da_fe
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/02 08:36:34
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Don't get me wrong....I do not agree there should be a law against incandescents. Just tax them so they are twice as expensive as CFLs.......KIDDING.
Just like I do not believe the government should make you wear a helmet on your motorcycle....organ donars need to come from somewhere.
JR
HP DV6T - 2670QM, 8 GB RAM, Sonar Platypus, Octa Capture, BFD2 & Jamstix3, Komplete 10 and Komplete Kontrol Win 10 64 SLS PS8R Monitors and KRK Ergo https://soundcloud.com/airportface
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jackn2mpu
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/02 09:59:02
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ORIGINAL: space_cowboy
It does not support that humans solely reponsible. I spent 12 years as an engineer. Science is a big hobby of mine. I read probably more than anyone I know.
I cannot stomach CNN. There is no balance there, but that is a different issue. I read news basically 10 hours a day. It is part of my job. I read news directly from the news wires. They are not filtered but are just the facts.
CNN's a laugh - they are so left-leaning (except for maybe Lou Dobbs) it's pathetic. I know AP has a site - what other news wires are out there available to the general public?
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jackn2mpu
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RE: Toxic lightbulbs???
2009/04/02 10:08:02
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ORIGINAL: Guitarhacker
I did have one pop and smoke - so that's disconcerting (any mercury in that smoke?)
Not unless the glass broke. The mercury is inside the bulb... But the electronics that smoked...there's no telling what toxic stuff is in there.
I have had a few CFL's do the same thing. Turning a CFL on for just a few seconds.... like locating a shirt in a closet ...or leaving them on for extended periods of time.... like in the evening when you're home... shortens the bulb's life. The ones I have used do NOT seem to be giving me the long life...as seen on TV.... I have also heard...never verified buy doing an actual test myself.... that a florescent light uses more current to start than an equal wattage incadescent uses in 30 minutes of running..... meaning, if you turn a florescent light on & off frequently, you will burn more energy than if you leave it run after turning it on. At least that's what my electrical/electronics teacher said in class one day.
I was actually in favor of swapping out every incadescent in my house about a year after they were introduced, and the price had fallen a bit. They were quite expensive to start. My wife didn't like the color of the light.... something about the carpet & drapes looked dull in their light...or the fact that they took a few minutes to "warm up" to full brightness. I noticed that a few of the ones I did manage to install didn't last near as long as they were supposed to...some burned out rather quickly.
I don't think they should be Mandated by government...after all...we do live in the "Land of the Free" where we are supposed to be able to make our own choices. To smoke or not, to drink or not, to use CFL's or not.
The color balance in cfl's is so off it makes people look sick. Drives me nuts as a photographer. As to disposal, Home Depot will take back as recycle intact bulbs, but for broken ones, you're sol. They should provide a disposal bag with each bulb sold. The rfi generated by these things is another consequence to be dealt with. Oh yeah, what about those fixtures where the shade sits on the bulb? How's THAT going to work with cfl's?
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