help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording

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Guitarhacker
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Re:help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording 2011/01/13 08:57:08 (permalink)
I prefer a streaming site like soundclick or reverbnation..... sorry.... I am also very particular with what I DL these days.

Stream it and I'll have a listen.

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#31
dlogan
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Re:help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording 2011/01/13 09:07:03 (permalink)
David - I got the .wav files you sent me. Here's my objective opinion...

There is nothing "harsh" about the recording. It's a nice, clean recording actually. Sounded fine on my monitors (Mackie MR8s). A few thoughts...

* Maybe your monitors/headphones have an overhyped high end that's making them sound harsh to you?
* Maybe you're going for a certain tone with your vocals and are comparing them to what you're aiming for? For rap vocals, yours may sound harsh if you're trying for a mellow tone like Snoop Dog for example. If that's the case, it's not the recording - you would need to work on the tone of your actual vocal delivery.
* Since I just heard the soloed vocals, maybe when heard in context of the whole recording there is a cumulative effect in a certain range that's making it sound harsh to you? Do the vocals still sound harsh to you when soloed, or just when heard in the track? If that's the case, remix the music to make room for the vocals.

Good news (IMO) - your vocal track is not harsh!! Bad news - you're not happy with it! So I'm not sure why you're thinking they sound harsh, but at least IMO they sound good!
#32
davidrr
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Re:help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording 2011/01/13 13:40:04 (permalink)
Rothchild


Hope you don't mind davidrr, I've stripped out one of your vox tracks and re-uploaded here (so folk can see it's just a .wav and not a dubious payload hidden in a rar (which it's not)) https://www.yousendit.com/download/bFlHQ3QyRSt0QTN2Wmc9PQ the file expires on 20-01-11 but if you want me to take it down I can.

On a very cursory listen (admittedly on my laptop, so of limited value) I'm not really hearing harsh but I am hearing fairly nasal / bunged up. I'm hearing an improvement as I sweep an eq notch around 1khz. I'm sure others here will be able to offer a more considered take.

Also, you can save a bunch of space on you computer by recording your vocals in to a mono track, there's no real need for rap vox to be in a stereo file, you're just eating up twice as much hard drive space for no real gain.

Child
i recorded the vocal on mono, i dont know if it converted the file to stereo which i doubt


#33
davidrr
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Re:help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording 2011/01/13 13:55:49 (permalink)
dlogan


David - I got the .wav files you sent me. Here's my objective opinion...

There is nothing "harsh" about the recording. It's a nice, clean recording actually. Sounded fine on my monitors (Mackie MR8s). A few thoughts...

* Maybe your monitors/headphones have an overhyped high end that's making them sound harsh to you?
* Maybe you're going for a certain tone with your vocals and are comparing them to what you're aiming for? For rap vocals, yours may sound harsh if you're trying for a mellow tone like Snoop Dog for example. If that's the case, it's not the recording - you would need to work on the tone of your actual vocal delivery.
* Since I just heard the soloed vocals, maybe when heard in context of the whole recording there is a cumulative effect in a certain range that's making it sound harsh to you? Do the vocals still sound harsh to you when soloed, or just when heard in the track? If that's the case, remix the music to make room for the vocals.

Good news (IMO) - your vocal track is not harsh!! Bad news - you're not happy with it! So I'm not sure why you're thinking they sound harsh, but at least IMO they sound good!

when i try to mix it to the beat, it sound so bad, harsh to me, i cant get it to fit in the beat, do you mind mixing it for me and sending it so i can see how it sounds,

#34
Kalle Rantaaho
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Re:help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording 2011/01/14 03:46:44 (permalink)
I listened to the clip a few times, and I started to wonder if we're using the word "harsh" very differently.

I did not hear anything harsh, just a normal male voice, actually a soft voice, opposite to harsh.

Assuming that by "harsh" you mean lack of ambience and ...what would be the english word for it....musical characteristics (??)....uh..I don't know.

By ambience I mean there's no reverb or delay to smoothen the tone, to make it fit in the mix. There are many things you can try. One is:  Copy the track, nudge the other one a few ms forward, send them to a bus where you put a compressor and a little delay and maybe reverb. You could also try adding quite strong compressing on the copied track and lower it's volume and have no compressor on the bus. Google for Parallell compression, artificial double tracking, for example, and read Roey Izhakis book "Mixing audio". If you want a little more snappiness to the voice, a little EQ could help, but I don't know what to cut/boost without trying.

By the other I mean some vocal training could give more intensity and muscle to your performance. I don't mean more volume or that you'd need to exaggerate your expression,
but that your voice comes out soft and ( excuse my language, I try to make myself understood, not hurt your feelings!!) sausagelike with no vibration or sonorosity (sonorous..could that be the word I'm after?). In that clip your voice is sort of squeezed through your throat like toothpaste from the tube, when it should pour out like water in the rapids. Your abdomen isn't supporting your voice, it all comes just from your throat.
 
With a little training I believe you can get some edge to your voice, and that added edge (better control of breathing and vocal chords) also automatically reflects to your expression.

At least, now you know it's not the mic or recording and that there's nothing wrong with your natural voice.  

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#35
Rothchild
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Re:help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording 2011/01/14 04:54:46 (permalink)
i recorded the vocal on mono, i dont know if it converted the file to stereo which i doubt

 
I was half asleep when I played with it in the morning but I double checked last night and it's definitely a 2 channel file, I guess you probably just missed setting it to mono on export, no biggie (especially as you obviously know it only needs to be mono.
 
Kalle, the last time I heard anyone use reverb on a rap record was probably about 1985! Sure, hip hop keeps reinventing itself (and recycling old ideas) so the OP may be able to lead out the new wave of verb laden Rap vox but I'm not sure that's the issue.
 
David, out of interest, are those your own lyrics? IMO great rap / hip hop is either really catchy (Early Eminem, Chronic era Dre etc) or has to be actually saying something (BDP/KRS1, De la Soul et al) as with all great music the composition and arrangement comes first. 
 
I'd happily have a go at mixing a song for you if you were to provide an original 'beat' and a whole vocal arrangement. Hit me up on PM if you want to try something out.
 
Child
 
 
#36
Kalle Rantaaho
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Re:help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording 2011/01/14 06:55:34 (permalink)
Yes, I agree about the reverb. My point is clearly stated though. I believe the OP and we were talking about different kind of harshness. In my ears the voice is soft = opposite to harsh.
What I think the OP means is something in the direction of "too dry, too plain, too flat (acoustically)".
post edited by Kalle Rantaaho - 2011/01/14 06:59:04

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#37
Rothchild
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Re:help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording 2011/01/14 07:21:40 (permalink)
Hi Kalle, yes your point is well made. Sorry if you thought I was trying challenge you uncessarily, I'm just shooting the breeze really. I agree that I think the OP needs to focus on his performance more and worry about his recording less.

And yes, you're right, a little bit of 'ambience' goes a long way and isn't necessarly the same as 'reverb'.

Child
#38
mattplaysguitar
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Re:help!!! harsh vocal!! i lost all motivation on recording 2011/01/15 02:12:47 (permalink)


And yes, you're right, a little bit of 'ambience' goes a long way and isn't necessarly the same as 'reverb'.




I tend to think of ambience as more those reflections that you don't hear, and reverb is more something you can hear. Reverb is more the body and the tail, and ambience is more of the early reflections... You think?

And yes, ambience can go SO far. For the most part, I think most musical pieces (depending on the style) need more ambience and less reverb.


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#39
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