Final Consensus On X1C Update?

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LJB
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 06:13:31 (permalink)
After the first X1C install and the subsequent and well-documented super crash, and then a complete reinstall of Win7 32bit and all my software, I have had no crashes or hangs in my system. I'm actually fairly shocked and amazed! :O)

Ludwig Bouwer, One Big Room Studios.
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#31
tyacko
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 08:03:37 (permalink)
A1MixMan,

Are you using this for your business?  If so, I'd suggest (as I would for any software that someone running a business would do) and that is to install it first on a separate machine and run it through the hoops.  Most companies I work with in the business world do that exact thing with every software product the buy/upgrade.  It is just too costly not to work that way.

If you do this more as a hobby, then I say backup your projects, take an image of your current OS, and install it.

Tom

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#32
piangio
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 09:30:53 (permalink)
Here everything it'OK. Only some unfrequent problems previewing sample loops while sequencer playing. W7 ultimate 64 bit, 8GB ram, TC Konnekt48
post edited by piangio - 2011/08/31 09:32:43
#33
daryl1968
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 09:39:19 (permalink)
All good here but I agree with Billy 100% - it seems that X1 has to 'like' your set up to work pain free. I have had a couple of minor issues but nothing major since X1a.
#34
LJB
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 09:46:47 (permalink)
I can highly recommend a clean install all the way from OS up. Definitely worth it if you can bare the pain..

Ludwig Bouwer, One Big Room Studios.
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#35
ba_midi
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 10:15:02 (permalink)
Jim Roseberry



BUT I have recently taken the time to setup a new laptop with X1C, including a new audio device (so I didn't have to change my main DAW in any way), and installed many of my plugins (some in demo mode as I didn't want to use up a license). This "experiment" showed me that X1C runs *VERY* differently -- and resulting in MUCH MUCH better performance -- when run on certain hardware/software configurations. I was actually somewhat impressed running it on the laptop. My desktop (main) DAW is a dual monitor XP Pro SP3 32bit 4G RAM setup. My laptop is (single screen obviously) Windows 7, i5, 4G RAM setup. Both are using SATA drives. I have said, and now strongly believe, that there's something about X1 that is finnicky (touchy/sensitive) to what hardware it runs on, and that X1 prefers Windows 7.

 
Hi Billy,
 
Glad to hear X1's performance on the new machine (laptop) is more in line with what you'd expect.
 
When experiencing such major stability issues with X1... it seems logical (to me) that there's something more at play.
Thus, although I'm sure it's frustrating, it would make logical sense that X1c wouldn't take this type of scenario from complete instability... to total rock-solid performance.
Based on what we've seen/experienced... X1 does seem to work best on modern well-configured hardware and Win7.
 
At least now you've experienced the flip-side  
There is light at the end of the tunnel.

Jim,

Absolutely  there's light at the end of the tunnel.   But that doesn't excuse the fact that my 2 other favorite DAWs (Ableton Live and Studio One Pro) work virtually flawless on my main DAW where X1C does not.

And X1 still does have some bugs and idiosyncrasies that are annoying at best and downright frustrating at times.   The control bar having a limited set of viewing options is a strange decision imho and one of the annoyances that can be a workflow inhibitor to some (including me), is a small example.

So "overall" I'd give X1 a "b" or "c" rating not an "a" rating unfortunately. 

But staying in the positive groove (which seems to get extra points around here lol) - there's no doubt X1C can do a good job for the most part in a solid modern well configured (to X1's liking) system.




Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

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#36
Leadfoot
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 10:31:05 (permalink)
I love X1 and what it has done for me, but, I am having some instability issues that I didn't have before I installed X1c. Sonar has crashed a number of times while just adding midi notes in the PRV. I have had some really loud digital glitches during playback, but once I restarted the program, it was fine, until I started working the mix some more. I don't want anyone to think I'm bad mouthing the update at all. I'm just giving an account of my experience with it. I think I will go back to 1b, which I wasn't having much trouble with.
#37
ba_midi
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 11:20:27 (permalink)
Leadfoot


I love X1 and what it has done for me, but, I am having some instability issues that I didn't have before I installed X1c. Sonar has crashed a number of times while just adding midi notes in the PRV. I have had some really loud digital glitches during playback, but once I restarted the program, it was fine, until I started working the mix some more. I don't want anyone to think I'm bad mouthing the update at all. I'm just giving an account of my experience with it. I think I will go back to 1b, which I wasn't having much trouble with.

No one should feel bad for being honest if sincere.

You might want to contact tech support as your issues may be easily resolved with them -- but just as important, you may have hit some bug they weren't aware of and that would be helpful to the programmers as well as all users of the program.

I hope you get things worked out, regardless.



Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

http://www.ba-midi.com/music/files
Music gives me life, so I give life Music.
Thanks for listening - Let's Dance to the rhythm of life! :)
#38
dappa1
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 11:43:01 (permalink)
Sonar X1 is the best and I'm sure it will work thoroughly well on my system though I have not bought it yet but I know it will be the best purchase of my life.

P.S.

I'll do anything to be with the in ground!
#39
Jon Bryson
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 12:01:55 (permalink)
I'm on X1c here on a slightly older XPSP3 system. I'm looking forward to the new Win7 system I will be building shortly as it seems this may be a factor with how X1 runs.
I had a problem a couple of times since X1 was released with Sonar 'forgetting' my Kontakt vst. I would load up Kontakt 4 (latest update) and then when I reopened later it had lost the Kontakt instance (error that it couldn't find the vst referenced) I had to rescan VST's, then create a new project and drag everything in to it to get it working again. This only happened twice and I could not recreate the conditions under which it happened so didn't follow up with a problem report.

I thought this was all behind me but had the same thing happen on X1c yesterday, however, it is a project I started in X1b. All new projects have been great and I've even loaded them up to see how I could push them so I suspect it only had to do with the project having been started in X1b.

Bottom line, it looks like X1c will be great and I expect even more so with the new build I am planning. A word of caution however, there is at least the possibility of encountering an issue if you continue a project started in an earlier iteration.

The interface has grown on my since I've been getting more familiar with it.

Jon
post edited by Jon Bryson - 2011/08/31 12:21:42
#40
Mesh
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 12:07:23 (permalink)
Dappa1


Sonar X1 is the best and I'm sure it will work thoroughly well on my system though I have not bought it yet but I know it will be the best purchase of my life.

P.S.

I'll do anything to be with the in ground!


This thread is about the X1C update. So if you don't have X1 yet, your comment is really pointless and sarcasm isn't necessary.  

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#41
dlesaux
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/08/31 12:44:17 (permalink)
Works great on my system!

Peace!
Daniel

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#42
A1MixMan
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/03 22:41:38 (permalink)
For the record I'm a huge Cakewalk fanboi, sitting here in my Sonar X1 pajama's with my X1 coffee mug and newly inked X1 tatoo on my right bicep, BUT, I'm also pratical don't need to upgrade to X1c as X1b is working fine for me. I do not use it for my business, but think like a professional nontheless as that's where my focus is directed. I'll let the "community" be the beta testers. :-)

Didn't really feel like trudging through all of the posts on the forum, but it's seems the consensus is that it's working fine. I'm running a new system with Win7 64bit, so I should be ok.

Downloading now!

Thanks!

A1
#43
StarTekh
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/03 22:48:30 (permalink)
Ludwig: win7-32 here by accident, its worked out fine so far. id love 64b to test ..!!
#44
Anderton
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 01:11:12 (permalink)
This isn't really an X1c comment but a Windows 7 comment.

A few people here have noted that X1c seems to work better with Windows 7 than XP. Well, my experience is that just about EVERYTHING works better with Windows 7. I was dragged into installing it because I had to in order to fulfill a contractual obligation, and all I can say is I should have done it sooner. Vegas, Sound Forge, Live, Cubase, Pro Tools, etc...they're all happier here on W7. 

Don't just install W7 because you think it will solve any particular Sonar problems, install it to make your life easier!! I went for the 64-bit version for video purposes - it's working fine, although I patiently (well okay, impatiently) await installing 64-bit ReWire.
#45
The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 09:07:59 (permalink)
Did you install Win7 64 on your existing computer... or did you purchase a fresh new system?


#46
DonM
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 09:30:27 (permalink)
ba_midi

I suppose this is as a good a thread to jump in on as any regarding X1C, so ...

As many of you know - I have not had good luck with X1 and have not been using it.  This is after many years of being a heavy power Sonar user up until X1.

I've seen TOO many times people mention a feature they think is cool and new that, in fact, has been in Sonar for a long time -- proving to me at least - that many simply did not use Sonar to its fullest and therefor can easily have a "good" experience with it.

As for me -- when time allows I'll put together a nice "X1 friendly" system so I can use it along with the other hosts that don't need such high maintenance.

So that's my .02cents (times 10? lol)

B:


Great post - exact same sentiment here. I have still yet to pull the trigger on X1 - it seems "C" is the charm so my time 8.5.3 may migrate.


Best to all and don't work too hard on Labor Day


-D

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#47
mavafamusic
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 09:37:16 (permalink)
Works great for me on x64. Take the plunge, its worth it.


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#48
cyphersuit
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 14:49:05 (permalink)
works well for me but there are still some bugs that need to be fixed in X1D. for example you can't use alchemy or NI's razor right now. also there are some problems with matrix view...
#49
quibb
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 17:27:27 (permalink)
Any instability I've experiences always seemed to be related to soft synths where I would get random crashes or hangs when I was using Rapture or Dimension. I also posted a thread a couple of months ago about my 'vanishing synths' problem where I would minimize the synth and then couldn't pull it back up, even though the synth still played.
 
Happy to report that X1C has fixed whatever issues were affecting my system!!! (fingers crossed)...  I've really pushed it trying to make it hiccup, but it's been rock solid. I would definitely update again. (I must say I had similar issues in 8.5, so I don't think my problem was specific to X1)
 
btw - Don't know how I survived all these years without the browser. It's a fundamental change that ranks up there with track folders for me. LOVE the browser.
 
Vernon

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#50
SONARtist
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 17:37:27 (permalink)
ba_midi


A1MixMan


I see some people with problems and some without, so what's the final verdict on X1C?

To install or not to install, that is the question.


I suppose this is as a good a thread to jump in on as any regarding X1C, so ...

As many of you know - I have not had good luck with X1 and have not been using it.  This is after many years of being a heavy power Sonar user up until X1.

X1 does not seem to like my main DAW which runs other host software (Live, Reaper, Studio One Pro, etc) without problems.  Only X1 is a problem.    Aside from crashing and other showstoppers, it just doesn't "look" right either  (the naming schemes are silly in my opinion).

BUT I have recently taken the time to setup a new laptop with X1C, including a new audio device (so I didn't have to change my main DAW in any way), and installed many of my plugins (some in demo mode as I didn't want to use up a license).

This "experiment" showed me that X1C runs *VERY* differently -- and resulting in MUCH MUCH better performance -- when run on certain hardware/software configurations.    I was actually somewhat impressed running it on the laptop.

My desktop (main) DAW is a dual monitor XP Pro SP3 32bit 4G RAM setup.   My laptop is (single screen obviously) Windows 7, i5, 4G RAM setup.    Both are using SATA drives.

I have said, and now strongly believe, that there's something about X1 that is finnicky (touchy/sensitive) to what hardware it runs on, and that X1 prefers Windows 7.   

So -- to answer your question whether to install or not ...   I'd say if you were having trouble with it before and are using the same environment/hardware, you MIGHT see some improvement, but probably not much better than before.

IF you're running a newer, well built, well configured system -- then X1C will probably work really well.

I know there are some users who claim to have no issues with X1 and are not running top of the line or totally up to date systems; and I believe they are telling the truth.   I'd also bet that most (though maybe not all) aren't really pushing X1 to the limits and therefor don't use some of the features that might kick it into sensitive areas.

I've seen TOO many times people mention a feature they think is cool and new that, in fact, has been in Sonar for a long time -- proving to me at least - that many simply did not use Sonar to its fullest and therefor can easily have a "good" experience with it.

But overall I think X1C probably is mostly (if not fully) solid when running on hardware IT likes.   If it's on a system it doesn't like (even one that IS up to specs), then be prepared for a bumpy ride.

As for me -- when time allows I'll put together a nice "X1 friendly" system so I can use it along with the other hosts that don't need such high maintenance.

I liked the way X1 flowed on my laptop, and it definitely felt like a usable DAW; but I'm going to wait until I have a new desktop to get serious with it.

So that's my .02cents (times 10? lol)
Hi Billy, thanks for this update.  I got X1c running on 32-bit Win7 with the obvious RAM limitations.  It runs okay, but can be very temperamental when ASIO latencies are set low ... I tend to get "not responding" messages quite regularly in this scenario with a semi-translucent white screen (I just don't touch anything and wait until the messages disappear and the screen comes back to normal - sometimes as long as 2 mins).  I tend to think it is the RAM limitation causing this as I run quite some "heavy" projects.  But it's a PIA !
 
My wife has just "inherited" a new laptop (i7 with 8GB, 64-bit) and I shall be testing SONAR out on that; even more so now that I've read your comments.  Thanks.
 
Alas, I had wanted to move to Win7/64 about 18 months ago, but eratu had quite some issues with plugins, and I've been putting it off since.  Seems I need to build me a new system (+ backup system) soon ...
#51
jbow
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 17:40:54 (permalink)
Really.... final? Finally, final?
 
Just DO IT.
 
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#52
ba_midi
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 18:38:44 (permalink)

Hi Billy, thanks for this update. I got X1c running on 32-bit Win7 with the obvious RAM limitations. It runs okay, but can be very temperamental when ASIO latencies are set low ... I tend to get "not responding" messages quite regularly in this scenario with a semi-translucent white screen (I just don't touch anything and wait until the messages disappear and the screen comes back to normal - sometimes as long as 2 mins). I tend to think it is the RAM limitation causing this as I run quite some "heavy" projects. But it's a PIA ! My wife has just "inherited" a new laptop (i7 with 8GB, 64-bit) and I shall be testing SONAR out on that; even more so now that I've read your comments. Thanks. Alas, I had wanted to move to Win7/64 about 18 months ago, but eratu had quite some issues with plugins, and I've been putting it off since. Seems I need to build me a new system (+ backup system) soon ...


I'm glad my post helped in some way.   It's actually pretty easy (and quick) to find out if Sonar X1 "likes" a system or not because it seems it exhibits problems early on if it doesn't like a system.   I say this based on the anecdotes / my observations  on this forum.

When I saw that my i5 laptop would run X1(C) pretty nicely, I couldn't resist unintalling and reinstalling X1 through C on my main DAW (yes, some would call that being a glutton for punishment lol).

Everything was going just great -- no burps/issues.    I even redid my normal.cwt from scratch.

And then - when I was all ready to try to record something simple (like a kick drum via Maschine), I hit "R" and *!(#BAM!)(*  X1 crashed LOL.

So it really is a finicky thing :)   

Anyway - hopefully your experience on the new laptop will be more like mine on my laptop (ie, a much improved one).

Good luck ;)



Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

http://www.ba-midi.com/music/files
Music gives me life, so I give life Music.
Thanks for listening - Let's Dance to the rhythm of life! :)
#53
Anderton
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 21:23:29 (permalink)
mike_mccue


Did you install Win7 64 on your existing computer... or did you purchase a fresh new system?

Existing system.
#54
John T
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 21:26:33 (permalink)
Yeah, mine had a former life as an XP system too.

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#55
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/04 21:50:13 (permalink)
quibb


Any instability I've experiences always seemed to be related to soft synths where I would get random crashes or hangs when I was using Rapture or Dimension.


This is what ended up being the bulk of my issues. Various soft synths causing Sonar to crash or for the audio engine to need to be restarted. Dimension Pro has crashed Sonar countless times on me due to a (confirmed) fatal bug with a setting that certain presets use: http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=2074837&mpage=1 

I also had some stability problems with a couple other Cakewalk synths. Pentagon 1 gave me some hell.

Now that I've clarified those issues to be plugin related and I've given X1C a proper burn in test I have found it to be stable for me. There are quirks to be sure. I've found a lot of annoying little bugs but nothing I can't work around.

In conclusion, minor bugs aside, X1C is performing quite well for me.

post edited by audiyo - 2011/09/04 21:54:03

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#56
quibb
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/05 05:31:30 (permalink)
Audiyo,
Just out of curiousity - Your issues didn't start around the time you jumped to 64-bit, did they? I've always wondered if that had something to do with it.
 
I am curious what fix in X1c made the difference in my case.
 
Glad to hear of your success.
 
V

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#57
italights
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/05 07:45:46 (permalink)
Seems to me that most problems are connected to the way X1 relates to other software/Hardware the annoying thing is a lot of this hardware software was fine with 8.5. If it is absolutely necessary for X1 to be so picky, then they should say so...not leave it to a guessing game. Buying it on the off chance that it will work with some of our very expensive plug ins or hardware . Give us a list of what doesn't work before we spend sizeable sums on this software. X1c for me is more stable but still the occasional crash which is not good during a session.

Windows 8 64bit i5 intel 4gb ram Sonar X1; VS100. ART tubefire8 fw; Casio mg510 midi guitar;Korg Trinity V3; Roland hpd15. Gretsch 5129; Gibson j200 etc; Gretsch 6120
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/05 08:11:39 (permalink)
Anderton


mike_mccue


Did you install Win7 64 on your existing computer... or did you purchase a fresh new system?

Existing system.


Thanks for elaborating Craig. The fact that you compared like to like makes your observation seem especially pertinent.

best regards,
mike


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audiyo
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Re:Final Consensus On X1C Update? 2011/09/05 08:33:59 (permalink)
quibb


Audiyo,
Just out of curiousity - Your issues didn't start around the time you jumped to 64-bit, did they? I've always wondered if that had something to do with it.
 
I am curious what fix in X1c made the difference in my case.
 
Glad to hear of your success.
 
V

Hey Quibb,

I'll give you a little more background with what I have experienced

I actually started with Sonar X1b x64. I've never used an x86 version of Sonar. I'm also not a fan of bridging so I avoid using any 32 bit plugins just to be on the safe side.

The Dimension Pro issue I was having is due to the Random Unipolar sample delay setting in the DP Midi matrix being set to anything other than 0. This has been confirmed by Cakewalk via a bug report that I sent in a while back.

I've never had Dimension Pro crash for any other reason. At first I thought this was Sonar's fault but I was able to crash Reaper in the same fashion. I'm wondering if you were running into that bug in the past and just haven't happened to run into it again in X1C due to using presets that don't have that setting. 

As far as Pentagon 1, I gave up on it. It would occasionally kill the audio engine and that got to be rather annoying. Owell though, it's an old synth and a DX synth at that, I tend to try to avoid DX plugs for the most part.

I have had one of the Studio Instruments VSTS disappear in X1b, I had to re-personalise to get it back.. but so far so good in X1C. 

Anyway, It's nice that things are running smoother for the both of us.

Sonar X2a Producer (64 bit), Win 8 Pro (64 bit), Intel Core i7 920@2.67Ghz, Asus P6T, 6GB DDR3 Ram, Komplete Audio 6, Fender BT Jazzmaster, AKAI MPK Mini
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