elijahlucian


any of you guys ever used battery?

All the time, very familiar with it. Great program, would likely suit your needs well. Very simple yet can be quite deep and flexible. Offers lots of nice tweaks like filters, envelopes, basic compression, looping (with variations) etc.
 
In fairness, though, Battery is largely a sample player with a drum machine type interface that uses pads instead of "keys" as in a keyboard. In reality it's very similiar to Kontakt or any other sampler.

Beepster


Considering he's using FL Battery would probably be a huge step up for creating beats. That however is merely based on what I've seen people say about it online.

Yes and no. Essentially you could operate just as in the video but drag the samples into Battery instead of SD3 and it would be every bit as user friendly. Battery is quite simple to use. After watching the video again (I guess I initially fast forwarded past the initial FL stuff) I'd say if the goal is to use the Step Sequencer and just drag and drop files into a player anything will do: SD3, Dropzone, even Cyclone DXi. The huge benefit to Battery or another sampler is if, and I say if, someone is looking for more functionality in the long run.
 
For me, a step sequencer doesn't cut it, not enough flexibility and even in the case of "step sequenced" material I can enter and edit far quicker in the PRV. Set the snap as need and the PRV is a visual hyper-step-sequencer. YMMV
 
Disregarding how you enter your notes, however, I need flexibilty. I may find a kick I like but often I need to mess with the kick to get exactly what I want -  add filters (resonance, cutoff etc), set one hit to cut another off for a gated effect, set different kicks for different velocities, whatever. I think one also has to consider what their longer term goals are if they're going to invest some time. Most samplers are just as simple to use as SD3 in the beginning but there are far more options if you care to dig deeper.
 
As far as the video, it looks like the only issue is Elijah doesn't quite seem familiar with SD3 or some of the other tools yet. Once you set up the outputs etc. of SD3, Cyclone, Dropzone or any other sample player and create a template or something you would likely speed up the workflow quite a bit. And some VSTi's like Rapture have step-sequencers built in. There are probably some other good choices out there.
 
Ultimately to get the best workflow you have to consider your needs, pick the right tools, set them up properly and spend the time to familiarize yourself with everything. A little work but in the long run you save so much time.
 
A little off topic but, if you're looking for the ultimate in flexibility, Reaktor by NI is a monster! And it functions as a  VSTi. If you can name it, Reaktor will do it. Step seq, fx, almost any possible type of synthesis, sampling, analyzing, A little example:
http://soundcloud.com/stoons-1
(listen to "Breakfast...")
This was done entirely with Reaktor using nothing but a sample of white noise as the sound source, there are no other VST's, synths or samples used, sequenced in Sonar. All instruments including drums were created with a short sample of white noise and nothing else (as part of a challenge/competition). If I had to "desert island" a plugin it would be Reaktor, it will do almost anything. Not as user friendly as SD3 ;-p

Bigdogs



I agree with you about the auditioning, but incidentally I don't have crash problems using FL as a VSTi in Sonar.

Yes it works, it is stable, but have you double-checked to see if they actually tight in timing ? You will see that it is not, 
FL lags about 400-500 samples late, so for rhythm creation (or anything else TBH), it's useless... 

Beepster: Considering he's using FL Battery would probably be a huge step up for creating beats. That however is merely based on what I've seen people say about it online

actually, I would tend to say the opposite!!, not to start a fan war here, but FL is quite a powerful software when in good hands.  for so many reasons it's better than a pad sampler like Battery (which is also good BTW)!, but FL is a full DAW afterall, and you get plenty for your money... only it's so much of a different workflow, compared to Sonar. 

As to answer the OP question, maybe in X2 we'll be able to trigger matrix cells in MIDI ? from then, apart from the browsing with up/down issue, would make it closer to FL. 

One thing I did at some point, is to use FL as VSTI, and drag and drop from FL browser to Sonar tracks (or sampler of your choice).then you don't have to deal with the FL VSTI latency issues, and you have the super nice browsing workflow you want. 

HTH

Cheers ! 

V 

  Bigdogs. you don't? what versions of both are you using? could you possibly try and help me debug my problem? I would really really appreciate it, if i could just use both my life would be complete.

BTW, I use FL signature 10.6.0, and Sonar X1d producer build 533.

V

I truly love it when someone sorts something out like this. Gives me a lift ;^)

elijahlucian


  Bigdogs. you don't? what versions of both are you using? could you possibly try and help me debug my problem? I would really really appreciate it, if i could just use both my life would be complete.

Looks like you have a solution. If you still want to look into using FL inside Sonar I'd be happy to try things out - not at my main computer for another week or so though, but got both on my laptop, which also works fine.

I'm running Windows7 64 bit, but latest Sonar Expanded (32 Bit) and the latest non-Beta FL, and I don't have latency issues or stability problems. Laptop is 32 bit for everything.

Not often you get the opportunity to try and make someone's life complete!

I find my best stuff always comes when I use Battery 3...when I use samples I feel like I'm cheating but I usually mish-mash many samples together and mix it up until I have something new. But Battery 3 is ultimate creative expression for me.

 Dude, I feel your pain. I've been complaining about the lack of a great sample player that doesn't get in the way for years. I have massive amounts of drum sounds and I never set up kits. I like to scroll through sounds until I hear "it." Nothing in Sonar allows me to do that. It should be effortless. Either be able to hit the arrow keys to audition or us CC's to assign a controller to cycle through sounds until you find the right one. My solution was NI's Maschine. Great tool. The only problem I have is the way it works with Sonar. I wish I could just freeze it like any other VST and have my beats recorded that way. But I can't. I have to export them to a folder and import them into Sonar or drag and drop them from Maschine to Sonar. Which, sounds like what you want to do but I having to do that interrupts my workflow. The best and most efficient method I had of working with drum sounds was a Sonar / Guru combination. I used Guru simply as a sample player but sequenced my drum sounds using Sonar. Easiest way ever. I had all the control over the samples I needed with Guru. I could scroll through sounds lightning quick. But, I had the work flow of Sonar. And when I got my drums bangin' like I like em', I just hit "freeze" and I was off to the next instrument. Best of both worlds. At least, for me. If Sonar came with a better sample player geared more toward us beat makers, I'd sell my Maschine and use that. As it stands now, Sonar is severely lacking in the very, very basic area. Until then, if you can find an old copy of Guru, try that. FXpansion stopped making Guru and began making Geist. I haven't used it but if the sample play works the same as Guru did, your problem is solved.

i miss the s950...but not enough to actually use one again

elijahlucian


  and by electronic i simply mean like this synth-pop era type drums... None of the kits in dimension or superior are useable for dance/pop so you end up having to use the clumsy browser to try and preview and import samples... I just end up making a placeholder beat and then making drums in another program. kind of pisses me off tbh.

See me iam total opposite of you, for me iam lost without sonar for drum programming, i think this sonar is Probally one of the best in this area,better than Studio one,Reaper,ableton,cubase,fruityloops,reason,Allthough stability stops me from using sonar full stop, but after programming drums in sonar nothing else quite compares, more so for the combination of the drum maps and the inline piano roll, that is the key for me, being able to see and compare different midi drum parts via the inline,  dont bother with step sequencer its too much a screen waster and lacks control over vst parameters, beatscape is more trouble than its worth.but For standard midi editing of drum parts you can not go wrong with the inline and drum maps. However if its maniupluation of audio loops i would forget it, you would need, stuff like Imagline slicex or FXpansions geist etc, some vst that will chop and slice audio like rex files do.
 
Personally i think its more about the add on drum vst you need, as far as drum devices included with sonar go, they are pretty basic and not worth the time if you want to be serious with the creativity, but like is say that stands for squat when it comes down too the instability of sonar and the sound engine etc, But if it is stable for you, including with bitridge then Imageline slicex for audio and drumaxx for electronic sounds, and with bitbridge un-needed Fxpansion geist for audio loop slicing and standard drum hit programming with up to 8 different kit engines, so thats 8x16 pads, not that you would need that many lol, and throw in the most important aspect you will need for electronic drum programming in any vst is round robbin settings.