paulo
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/11 15:42:45
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☄ Helpfulby Mesh 2013/06/11 21:37:33
Mesh
Glyn Barnes I have Win 8 with Classic Shell. I have uninstalled all the apps except Skydrive and Store, 'cause they can't be removed, I just un-pinned them from the start screen. Once you have got rid of that stuff the metro screen is usable, but I still work the old way with desk-top icons and the start menu, depending on the type of program. The tiles for programs are just huge, not stupidly huge like the tiles for apps just a bit daft large. If they could be reduced in size it would be a big improvement, then with the grouping functions the start screen would start to become actually useful. I decided to skip Win 7 all together and go with Win 8 as I considered it more future proof. The biggest problem with windows 8 in my book is no Solitaire, Mahjongg Titans or Minesweeper 
You guys are killing me....slowly.... Man, I'll tell you what, I've gone back and forth between these two (as of the last few days)...my heads starting to spin. The "future proof" comment is what my original thinking was too, so I really do appreciate your input/being an actual user Glyn. Have you run into any functional issues with general use in Win 8?
Mesh, Not trying to to influence you any way, but maybe go to a store and have a play with it ? It looks a little odd to start with, but think of the "metro" screen as your start button (just press windows key) and it will make sense. The search function is way better, just start typing while metro screen is up and it will automatically enter search mode and narrow down your choices - ie will show you all files/programs that have that word in them. As others have said, the desktop is still there if you want it and the first thing I did was make it look just like my old pc for the sake of familiar comfort. Never use it now to be honest. The "charm" bar can be a little annoying on my laptop as it's easy to make it come up without wanting to, hoping that 8.1 will give the option to disable that as it's a bit unnecessary imho. The "Off" button is kind of hidden away, but I just made myself a tile on the metro screen that performs the off function (windows key, select off - job done). Something else that may make a difference for you is that you don't get office stuff buillt in any more - thank the idiots with the lawsuits for that, but if you just want something for writing the odd letter etc, there are perfectly adequate free programs for this. You can of course still buy MS Office, but they are trying to push you down the yearly subscription path now, rather than just selling you the software - effectively forcing you to buy the new version every time. This might help .....
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drewfx1
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/11 16:17:07
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☄ Helpfulby Mesh 2013/06/11 21:37:19
MeshHave you run into any functional issues with general use in Win 8? When researching this myself, I honestly didn't find a plethora of Win 8 horror stories or anything like that as previous SW upgrades sometimes had. A lot of people did have driver concerns, as there are a lot of cases where "official" Win 8 drivers haven't been released. But as I said earlier, that doesn't mean Win 7 or Vista drivers won't work perfectly fine, just that they aren't officially supported in Win 8. Some SW does have some problems with Win 8 and still needs to be updated (like DPC Latency Checker), but outside of a few ancient programs I have that I could still get working in Vista but not in Win 8 (don't know about 7), most stuff seems to work without issues. But since I wanted Remote Desktop anyway, in my case I sort of hedged my bets by getting Win 8 Pro, which as I mentioned earlier also allows you to downgrade to Win 7 (if you have the 7 installation media). But if you install Classic Shell and aren't too attached to the classic versions of Solitaire and Minesweeper, I really doubt you'd want to as it's pretty much the same.
 In order, then, to discover the limit of deepest tones, it is necessary not only to produce very violent agitations in the air but to give these the form of simple pendular vibrations. - Hermann von Helmholtz, predicting the role of the electric bassist in 1877.
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Glyn Barnes
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/11 16:20:09
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paulo
Karyn The new start screen is great, if you're on a tablet. Totaly useless on a PC with no touch screen.
Totally disgree, in what way is it difficult ?
No its not useless or difficult, but I don't like it. For starters its ugly as sin. As I alluded to in a previous post it may even have some advantages. If only the tiles were not so enormous I might even start to use it. Other than that the main thing is to un-pin or un-install any unwanted social media and e-commerce junk that installs with Win 8.(in my case all of it.) paulo You can download them for free in the store.
Yeah - but they are optimised for touch versions. Very ugly!
post edited by Glyn Barnes - 2013/06/11 16:21:43
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Glyn Barnes
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/11 16:24:39
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Mesh Have you run into any functional issues with general use in Win 8?
No Issues here. Everything seems to work fine.
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paulo
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Wookiee
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/12 07:30:56
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drewfx1
Wookiee The general view seems to be stay with Win 7 unless you really need touch. I would say the general view seems to be that many are afraid of Win 8, though it seems no one can offer any tangible reason why it should be avoided (outside of an abundance of caution).
Put it another way it has been brought to my attention that a popular patch editor and librarian software is currently beta testing in Win 7 64. A certain manufacture of high quality audio interfaces suggested that Win 7 64 is more appropriate for audio work. Just saying.
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain. Karma has a way of finding its own way home.
Primary, i7 8700K 16Gigs Ram, 3x500gb SSD's 2TB Backup HHD Saffire Pro 40. Win 10 64Bit Secondary i7 4790K, 32GB Ram, 500Gb SSD OS/Prog's, 1TB Audio, 1TB Samples HHD AudioBox USB, Win 10 64Bit CbB, Adam's A7x's - Event 20/20's, Arturia V6, Korg Digital Legacy, Softube Modular, Arturia Keylab-88, USB-MidiSport 8x8
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craigb
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/12 07:58:31
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Wait for Windows 9. Avoid every other OS release as Karyn was suggesting.
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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paulo
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/12 08:19:07
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craigb Wait for Windows 9. Avoid every other OS release as Karyn was suggesting.
drewfx1 I would say the general view seems to be that many are afraid of Win 8, though it seems no one can offer any tangible reason why it should be avoided (outside of an abundance of caution).
post edited by paulo - 2013/06/12 08:22:51
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Mesh
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/12 08:52:14
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Thanks so much Paulo & Drew for the more indepth details of Win 8.....I certainly do appreciate it...... and no, "I ain't afraid of no Win 8 ghosts"  . Except for the minor complaints on the UI and Metro of Win 8, I haven't found (online) any "real" dysfunction with this OS in making it a showstopper. On the contrary, after reading Noel B's blog (link in my OP) on Win 8, X2 actually performed much better on all their tests than Win 7. The Classic Shell eliminates this "ugly" UI/Metro and if the rest of the OS works as advertised, then it does give an open future to build on (touch screen etc...). I suppose we all like to know the worst side(s) of any software before we actually purchase it, and with Win 8, there doesn't seem to be any legitimate deal breakers.....
Platinum Gaming DAW: AsRock Z77 Overclock FormulaI7 3770k @ 4.5GHz : 16GB RAM G.Skill Ripjaws X 250GB OS SSD : 3TB HDD : 1TB Sample HDDWin 10 Pro x 64 : NH-D14 CPU Cooler HIS IceQ 2GB HD 7870Focusrite Scarlett 2i4The_Forum_Monkeys
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drewfx1
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/12 12:36:18
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WookieePut it another way it has been brought to my attention that a popular patch editor and librarian software is currently beta testing in Win 7 64. A certain manufacture of high quality audio interfaces suggested that Win 7 64 is more appropriate for audio work. Just saying. 
Do they have any mention of why? I'm just curious, as before I made the Win 8 jump I couldn't find much in terms of technical deal breakers. I suppose I never grew up to the point that the words, "don't do it" without a good reason why I shouldn't are effective. Oh, and "popular patch editor and librarian software" made me smile, as I didn't know such things were "popular" anymore. Maybe there are more of us guys who still sometimes use HW than I thought.
 In order, then, to discover the limit of deepest tones, it is necessary not only to produce very violent agitations in the air but to give these the form of simple pendular vibrations. - Hermann von Helmholtz, predicting the role of the electric bassist in 1877.
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Wookiee
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/12 15:19:07
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Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain. Karma has a way of finding its own way home.
Primary, i7 8700K 16Gigs Ram, 3x500gb SSD's 2TB Backup HHD Saffire Pro 40. Win 10 64Bit Secondary i7 4790K, 32GB Ram, 500Gb SSD OS/Prog's, 1TB Audio, 1TB Samples HHD AudioBox USB, Win 10 64Bit CbB, Adam's A7x's - Event 20/20's, Arturia V6, Korg Digital Legacy, Softube Modular, Arturia Keylab-88, USB-MidiSport 8x8
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LaryMary
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/13 19:46:00
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☄ Helpfulby Mesh 2013/06/14 09:19:46
Okay, for my two penn'orth, I installed Win 8 Pro about a month ago on my desktop PC. I have no touch screen. The start screen took a bit of getting used to but once I 'modified' it to my liking (grouping tiles into 'sets' of similar apps, resizing the tiles, making sure the tiles I use most are on the main part of the start screen) it all started to fall into place. I have a tile for X2 that requires one click to launch and no 'double clicking' required for any app on the start screen. The traditional desktop screen is still there, you just have to switch to it, and the installation of Classic Shell gives almost identical functionality of the original start button. Now as for performance! Compatibility is excellent - all the programs that worked under W7 work faultlessly under W8. W8 drivers for most of my hardware is available and installed and for those that don't have W8 drivers (an old casio Keyboard) work fine with the W7 drivers. X2 performs exceedingly well with no glitches, freezes, pops etc., and latency is very low. All my VST's work fine too. Overall the OS seems 'snappier' - it may be my imagination but programs seem to load quicker, windows open quicker, dialog boxes open and close quicker etc. I get the impression that under the hood W7 has been 'tweaked' to get better performance and the W8 interface sits neatly over the top. One issue to be aware of - you CAN install W8 pro without needing an account or password (no-one else has access to my machine) BUT if you use your desktop PC as a normal PC for the internet, emails etc., and you LINK your social website accounts using a Hotmail, Outlook or other e-mail address to make use of the live tile updating of Facebook, Twitter etc., FROM THAT POINT ON YOU WILL HAVE TO SIGN INTO W8 WITH YOUR ACCOUNT NAME AND PASSWORD!! There is no going back from this. You cannot then create an account that DOESN'T have a password. Personally this is my biggest gripe and is the reason I went back to W7 temporarily before re-installing W8 and learning my lesson. I HATE WITH A VENGEANCE having to 'Log In' to my own computer - I know all about security BUT there are thousands of people who don't have kids or have other people who may have access to or use their computers, so in my view this is totally unnecessary. It's like having an overriding 'User Account Control' that you can't tun off! Save for this annoyance I have found W8 a pleasure to use, even without a touch screen. 99% of my existing programs are compatible and seem to work just as well if not better under the new OS. I am not too fussed about having a touch screen, but when they become affordable I will give one a try. Hopefully, if I don't like the 'touch' part I will be able to turn that off!!
Homebuilt Desktop PC AMD Phenom II four-core processor 3.4Ghz, Asus M5A78L AM3+ mobo, 16Gb Ram, 250Gb SSD for OS & Programs, 120Gb SSD, 1TB Project HDD, 1TB Samples HDD, Sonar Platinum, Zoom R16, Shure SM58
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Mesh
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/14 09:29:04
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Excellent post LordElpus and I appreciate all the details. I don't use any of those social websites, but do use the internet for email and general research. So, my understanding is that if you actually LINK these social websites to your email, then the log in process begins......(if you don't LINK it, then it won't happen) right? Although there are Win 8 drivers for my hardware, it's comforting to know that Win 7 (even Vista) drivers will work. Great info to know.....thanks again for posting this and clearing up a lot.
Platinum Gaming DAW: AsRock Z77 Overclock FormulaI7 3770k @ 4.5GHz : 16GB RAM G.Skill Ripjaws X 250GB OS SSD : 3TB HDD : 1TB Sample HDDWin 10 Pro x 64 : NH-D14 CPU Cooler HIS IceQ 2GB HD 7870Focusrite Scarlett 2i4The_Forum_Monkeys
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paulo
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/14 17:36:15
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Like you, I don't use any of the social sites etc. I use hotmail for email purposes. When first setting up my W8 pc, which is a breeze btw, I too made the "mistake" of entering my email add / password when it was requested by the set up prog. What this resulted in for me was that my email was automatically signed in when I was on the pc. The problem with that for me was the way the hotmail prog, now called outlook, works with this set-up, mainly that when I clicked on the mail prog, it automatically directed to Inbox (fair enough) but also automatically opened the most recent message, which I was not happy about. Sometimes emails that I don't wish to open make it past the spam filters etc. (usually Facebook related even though I've never been on it). How this works with other email clients I don't know. However, it IS possible to undo this link when you sign in, which I did and now I can just sign in and use my email the same way I always did. When you switch on W8, the first thing you get to is the "lock screen" which does require a password, but this needn't be linked to anything else. I just made a seperate password to get past this. A little unecessary for me, but no big deal really. I only have to sign in when switching on from total shutdown, the stand-by modes keep you "signed-in" so it's a once a day thing for me as I shut down my pc at night.
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LaryMary
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/14 19:00:53
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Thanks Mesh, glad you found my comments helpful. I think Paulo may be right - it may not have anything to do with 'linking' the social media sites, but linking W8 to an email account creates the issue. When I first installed W8 I didn't set an Administrator or User password for the OS, so on boot up W8 went straight to the Start screen or Desktop, by-passing the lock screen altogether. Later on when I foolishly used my windows 'live' email account i.e. outlook (formerly hotmail) to be my 'mail' client on the start screen, using the 'mail' tile, that's when the problem started. I could still use Thunderbird for all my other emails but from that point on I had to use my outlook sign in credentials to get past the lock screen! For people who buy their computers pre-installed with W8 they are stuck with this, unless they re-install. Fortunately, I had made an image of my hard drive when I first installed W8 so I just rolled it back to that version and I won't be making that mistake again.
Homebuilt Desktop PC AMD Phenom II four-core processor 3.4Ghz, Asus M5A78L AM3+ mobo, 16Gb Ram, 250Gb SSD for OS & Programs, 120Gb SSD, 1TB Project HDD, 1TB Samples HDD, Sonar Platinum, Zoom R16, Shure SM58
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Leadfoot
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/14 23:23:39
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I bought my daughter an HP pre-installed with 8 and ended up putting 7 on it. I just wasn't into the feel of it at all. Heck, it's only been a couple years since I upgraded my studio comp from XP sp3 to 7.:)
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Moshkiae
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/06/15 18:56:45
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Hi, I'm using W8-Pro (32bit) on 2 computers now, and added Classic Shell to them because those other Windows are annoying as heck! The kernel in W8 appears to be really stable and working fine, despite some things that were annoying ... like the early version did not have a DVD playing anything and you had to spend $10 bux on the Media Center garbage, that does not even have a Main Menu/Root Menu setting that works correctly! I guess that things should improve by SP1. Per my ole roomate, who is now at Intel, the Windows 8 kernel is the best they have ever put out, and it is much better designed and defined than before ... and that is coming from someone that had been a Network/Server Administrator (took ISP from 3k to 25k folks in 4 years!) whose preference was Unix BSD. With all that said, W8-Pro has a nasty ... NASTY ... issue with losing networking information that is a pain in the wazoo. I might recomend setting up a real network, and tell W8's Homegroup Bullmerde to take a hike!
post edited by Moshkiae - 2013/06/16 15:47:10
As a wise Guy once stated from his holy chapala ... none of the hits, none of the time ... prevents you from becoming just another turkey in the middle of all the other turkeys!
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Mesh
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 10:02:47
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<<<<<Just updated OP......>>>>>
Platinum Gaming DAW: AsRock Z77 Overclock FormulaI7 3770k @ 4.5GHz : 16GB RAM G.Skill Ripjaws X 250GB OS SSD : 3TB HDD : 1TB Sample HDDWin 10 Pro x 64 : NH-D14 CPU Cooler HIS IceQ 2GB HD 7870Focusrite Scarlett 2i4The_Forum_Monkeys
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Beagle
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 10:33:11
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What's the classic shell and how do you access it? We just got my FIL a new machine and it was loaded with Win 8 and he doesn't like it. if there's a way to make it operate more like Win7 then he'd probably enjoy it a lot more.
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Mesh
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 10:45:40
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Beagle What's the classic shell and how do you access it? We just got my FIL a new machine and it was loaded with Win 8 and he doesn't like it. if there's a way to make it operate more like Win7 then he'd probably enjoy it a lot more.
Yeah, it'll have all the access itmes like Win, but work in the background on Win 8. It's an extremely easy install (very small file). This is what I used: http://www.classicshell.net/
Platinum Gaming DAW: AsRock Z77 Overclock FormulaI7 3770k @ 4.5GHz : 16GB RAM G.Skill Ripjaws X 250GB OS SSD : 3TB HDD : 1TB Sample HDDWin 10 Pro x 64 : NH-D14 CPU Cooler HIS IceQ 2GB HD 7870Focusrite Scarlett 2i4The_Forum_Monkeys
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Beagle
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 10:47:52
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jbow
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 15:02:33
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I am on W764 but when I get another computer (for a DAW) I wnt hesitate to get W8 and will get the biggest touchscreen monitor I can afford, one that will set down to a low angle. Like it or not, everything is moving in the "touch" direction and we cannot stop it. J
Sonar Platinum Studiocat Pro 16G RAM (some bells and whistles) HP Pavilion dm4 1165-dx (i5)-8G RAM Octa-Capture KRK Rokit-8s MIDI keyboards... Control Pad mics. I HATE THIS CMPUTER KEYBARD!
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Mesh
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 15:21:17
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I also wanted to get a touch screen, but that was way over my budget. As time goes on, they'll all come down in price and maybe then it'll be a good time to get one. I ended up getting an ASUS 23" LCD.
Platinum Gaming DAW: AsRock Z77 Overclock FormulaI7 3770k @ 4.5GHz : 16GB RAM G.Skill Ripjaws X 250GB OS SSD : 3TB HDD : 1TB Sample HDDWin 10 Pro x 64 : NH-D14 CPU Cooler HIS IceQ 2GB HD 7870Focusrite Scarlett 2i4The_Forum_Monkeys
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dcumpian
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 15:34:40
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Just to throw this out there: you can't future proof a computer. It is just not possible. Something will always come along to make it obsolete. Besides, where's the fun in NOT upgrading every few years? Regards, Dan
Mixing is all about control. My music: http://dancumpian.bandcamp.com/ or https://soundcloud.com/dcumpian Studiocat Advanced Studio DAW (Intel i5 3550 @ 3.7GHz, Z77 motherboard, 16GB Ram, lots of HDDs), Sonar Plat, Mackie 1604, PreSonus Audiobox 44VSL, ESI 4x4 Midi Interface, Ibanez Bass, Custom Fender Mexi-Strat, NI S88, Roland JV-2080 & MDB-1, Komplete, Omnisphere, Lots o' plugins.
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craigb
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 16:20:37
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Mesh <<<<<Just updated OP......>>>>>
Oh MAN!!!! We've got to go allllll the way back to the OP now???? Dayum...
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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Mesh
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 16:25:06
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craigb
Mesh <<<<<Just updated OP......>>>>>
Oh MAN!!!! We've got to go allllll the way back to the OP now???? Dayum... 
Ya. At least it's not like having to go through the FSF..........Carpe Diem Baby!!
Platinum Gaming DAW: AsRock Z77 Overclock FormulaI7 3770k @ 4.5GHz : 16GB RAM G.Skill Ripjaws X 250GB OS SSD : 3TB HDD : 1TB Sample HDDWin 10 Pro x 64 : NH-D14 CPU Cooler HIS IceQ 2GB HD 7870Focusrite Scarlett 2i4The_Forum_Monkeys
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craigb
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7??
2013/07/12 16:46:45
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There's an FSF somewhere? Why?
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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Moshkiae
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Re: Windows 8 or Windows 7......Update!!
2013/07/20 18:54:32
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Hi, My music machine has W7-Pro 64bit. It's ok ... and I will leave it at that. However, the two machines that I have that got W8-Pro (32bit on both!),are smoother all around, but they also have a bigger processor (not by much). All in all, no complaints, though I'm enjoying not having to find drivers for my butt, my teeth, my googles, my nails, my nose ... you get the idea!
As a wise Guy once stated from his holy chapala ... none of the hits, none of the time ... prevents you from becoming just another turkey in the middle of all the other turkeys!
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