The CLOUD! Is the forecast Overcast?

Some software makers are discontinuing their boxed releases in favor of an all-Cloud experience where you pay an annual subscription fee to access their programs from the Cloud.
 
What happens when your internet is down?
 
What happens if their server crashes?
 
What happens when you're on a deadline and the system won't let you log in to finish your work?
 
Do you think it's wise to rely totally on a remote access system like the Cloud?
 
Do you think Sonar is headed this way?

Sonar is not amenable to the "CLOUD" if you mean program execution on distant servers. The inevitable latency involved would be excessive for real time audio.
 
Some of the "cloud" distributions you see lately (annual subscriptions) are not cloud based at all. They execute on your hardware, but not before getting an authorization to do so from a distant server. There is a huge difference between a local program that will not run without checking your license status and one that runs on someone else's hardware. The downsides of such a system are somewhat less serious than a truly distant execution, but you may still be in trouble it the vendor will not (or cannot) authorize this run of your software because of connection problems. And of course there is no up side. You will not be able to run your software on someone else's supercomptuer by paying an affordable per millisecond rental. 

I think you have a wrong view on what cloud based software really is. Or can be. It's not that you have to run the software from the cloud! And it's not that everything is always saved in the cloud! I am a graphic designer and the BIGGEST player in the market, Adobe, (which is some ten thousand times bigger then Cakewalk) has switched to cloud based software ONLY. No more boxes. None at all. Everything from the cloud. And what does this mean?
 
1. You only need internet to download and install the software and to register it. 
2. In the case of Adobe the software will try to validate online once a month. If you have a year subscription that would be once every three months.
3. Your software will always be up to date, the newest version, the newest features, so no more need to wait for the next version that will be released in a year or two... hopefully. When there is something new, you get it!
 
The only drawback of course is that in the case of Adobe you have to get a subscription, so you will be paying for the software every month... every year... every decade. You CAN of course stop paying, but then you also have to stop using the software. Now if you were used to getting the latest version everytime anyway, this won't be a very big deal. But if you are used to only buying one version every two or three version, the cloud based solution will cost you a lot more money.
 
Anyway, you COULD say that CW is already using the cloud: if I want to buy X2 (which I don't own yet) I can get it from their site and I am done. The only difference is that since there is no subscription, the software doesn't need to be validated every month or so. But other then that their isn't a huge difference. With cloud based software you will still be able to use the software offline, save everything on your own desktop, etc. You won't be needing to stream audio over the internet or anything.
 
P.S. Steam is a site and a program that lets you buy mainly games online, download them and install them locally on your computer. With a login to Steam you can access everything you buy on any computer. Everything is installed locally but with Steam you DO need an internet connection all the time because you have to login to Steam before you can use the programs you have installed. It's another kind of cloud thing, you could say. This system is NOT what you would want for things like Sonar or Adobe software or anything else that can have a deadline. Games don't have a deadline... 

hellogoodbye
I think you have a wrong view on what cloud based software really is. Or can be. It's not that you have to run the software from the cloud! And it's not that everything is always saved in the cloud! I am a graphic designer and the BIGGEST player in the market, Adobe, (which is some ten thousand times bigger then Cakewalk) has switched to cloud based software ONLY. No more boxes. None at all. Everything from the cloud. And what does this mean?
 
1. You only need internet to download and install the software and to register it. 
2. In the case of Adobe the software will try to validate online once a month. If you have a year subscription that would be once every three months.
3. Your software will always be up to date, the newest version, the newest features, so no more need to wait for the next version that will be released in a year or two... hopefully. When there is something new, you get it!
 
The only drawback of course is that in the case of Adobe you have to get a subscription, so you will be paying for the software every month... every year... every decade. You CAN of course stop paying, but then you also have to stop using the software. Now if you were used to getting the latest version everytime anyway, this won't be a very big deal. But if you are used to only buying one version every two or three version, the cloud based solution will cost you a lot more money.
 
Anyway, you COULD say that CW is already using the cloud: if I want to buy X2 (which I don't own yet) I can get it from their site and I am done. The only difference is that since there is no subscription, the software doesn't need to be validated every month or so. But other then that their isn't a huge difference. With cloud based software you will still be able to use the software offline, save everything on your own desktop, etc. You won't be needing to stream audio over the internet or anything.
 
P.S. Steam is a site and a program that lets you buy mainly games online, download them and install them locally on your computer. With a login to Steam you can access everything you buy on any computer. Everything is installed locally but with Steam you DO need an internet connection all the time because you have to login to Steam before you can use the programs you have installed. It's another kind of cloud thing, you could say. This system is NOT what you would want for things like Sonar or Adobe software or anything else that can have a deadline. Games don't have a deadline... 

I don't really have so much a problem with downloading "my copy" of the software, which I can then keep on some kind of back up media and use for re-installations etc. I would still prefer, for some reason, to just go to a store and buy a disc (without the frankly ridicluous massive box that companies used to put them in to try and make you fee like you just got something for your £300). Probably because I genuinely fear the day when there are no more stores, no more banks etc and your whole life is at the mercy of the www and customer service that consists of FAQ's that never contain the actual question you want to ask or "we'll get back to you on that" which often translates as "No, we won't".
 
I think that the OP wasn't really referring to this type of thing, more the MS Office type model where you use "their" software via a www connection and cannot use it otherwise. This is what I meant when I said I see only disadvantages.  As far as DAW stuff goes, my DAW pc is not and never will be connected to the internet, some say it's not a problem to do so, but I see it as no coincidence that it's my online pcs that are always the ones that have problems. I have already encountered some DAW related software that can't be used without a www connection. Their loss, because I won't be buying it.
 
Continuing to use MS Office as an example, what you refer to as  the advantage of always having the latest version, updates, etc, I call forcing me to continually buy the "new" version, when truth be told MS Works that came "free" with XP is more than adequate for the needs of the average home user. This is the real reason why they don't want you to just buy a disc and be done with it. ( Yes, I know you still can at the moment, but the signs are that this is on the way out.)
 
BTW, Nice to see you back round these parts Jeroen. You need to be little more patient with the submit button, lol ! ;)

There are many good reasons for basing (meaning they execute in a cloud based server) applications in the cloud. I'm a senior software developer/designer for a multi-national multi-discipline engineering firm and the cloud provides an excellent platform for applications that need to be accessible from anywhere our staff my be who need access to project related information.
 
But as MarioD points out any clock based application faces some serious challenges that to me at this point are not campatible with cloud based execution. However I can see that there could be a time when those challenges could be overcome with advances in technology. I recall a time when a bought a personal computer for myself and my co-workers laughed because I got a 1Gig Hard Drive...the pinnacle of technolgy at that time.
 
The subscribe/download/upate model is not really cloud based computing in my opinion.
 
Regards,

"3. Your software will always be up to date, the newest version, the newest features, so no more need to wait for the next version that will be released in a year or two... hopefully. When there is something new, you get it!"
 
As an Adobe user, I see this as good for Adobe, bad for the consumer. What is the incentive for them to improve their products for the existing customer base? Once you join the Cloud, you're locked in if you need to use their software. It's like a captive audience.
 
For me I'm going to stick with Adobe Creative Suite CS5. It works for me and I won't have to spend $360/yr for the privilege of using their software. I'm not a pro graphics guy that needs the latest and greatest...
 
Walt

hellogoodbye
P.S. Steam is a site and a program that lets you buy mainly games online, download them and install them locally on your computer. With a login to Steam you can access everything you buy on any computer. Everything is installed locally but with Steam you DO need an internet connection all the time because you have to login to Steam before you can use the programs you have installed. It's another kind of cloud thing, you could say. This system is NOT what you would want for things like Sonar or Adobe software or anything else that can have a deadline. Games don't have a deadline... 

Steam can actually be launched in an offline mode. The MC6T - Steam experience is the same if you are online or offline. 

Thanks for all the input on this. It seems there are many different ways vendors are utilizing the Cloud for software distribution, which can make things confusing for the user. I 'm sure there will be a lot more changes as things progress.
 
In some cases the move is clearly for increased profit margin. And though some users will like it, for many it will change the whole idea and purpose of what "personal computing" is all about. So I hope it never becomes the only option.
 
Steve

I'm not too interested in the prospect of paying some continuous subscription to rent a piece of software. What's so wrong with wanting to simply pay a one-time price, have your copy of the program and be done with the matter?... Adobe's switch to cloud-only, subscription-based technology is the primary reason I won't be upgrading my Creative Suite programs, and I don't think I could justify doing any differently if Sonar went in that direction (which I pray it never does, at least not EXCLUSIVELY; if there's a fair choice between options, that's might be ok - and I emphasize "fair", meaning not to charge double the price to buy your own copy instead of "renting" the thing...).

dimelives1
 What's so wrong with wanting to simply pay a one-time price, have your copy of the program and be done with the matter?....

From the consumers view, nothing. From the vendors view, that way they can't make you buy the "new, improved" version every year.
 
 

There are many advantages to true cloud (remote program execution) software.
1. No piracy: since there is never a copy of the software that is out of the control of the owner/landlord there is no way to steal or crack it, or to sell second hand copies.
2. No update problems (aka Forced Upgrade) bug fixes and features can be automatically added and need not be distributed. No worry that your customer will find that he can still do anything he needs with version 1.0 when you are selling version 23.11
3. No hardware or software compatibility issues: Since the remote hardware can be completely defined and program can be the only program running on the remote server it does not matter what the client is using
4. Operating system agnosticism: the client may be running a completely different OS than the server (as in much web browsing today) and the server need not be running an expensive or potentially problematic updated OS (until Microsoft or Apple figure out how to move the OS to the cloud)
5. Minimal support issues: the landlord only has to keep his own software and hardware running, and can avoid dealing with problems on the client side altogether. If you are paying your own support staff, some of that is now transferred to the landlord.
6. Continuous revenue stream: No need to offer sale prices to get the new (or obsolete) version out the door and hope you make enough on the initial release to keep running.
7. Access to cheap massive computing power: no need to buy or support a supercomputer that is used only infrequently, the landlord can provide that power for a fee when it is needed
 
As you may have noticed these advantages, as in most rental arrangements, asymmetrically favor the landlord. The only clear advantage to the average user is the potential reliability gain by having the software running somewhere else where it is understood and maintained by experts. Since the landlord has near total control over distribution of the software, it is pretty much inevitable that much of what can be moved to the true cloud will be.
 
Resistance is futile. Meld with the Borg. 
 
 
 

The new Adobe model is exactly why I will not be upgrading either Photoshop or Lightroom.

Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]true cloud based model
FWIW, we use Creative Cloud here and it has worked out pretty well. Believe this has been corrected but you do not need to be online to use the program. You do need to connect once a month to renew your subscription but beyond that it works like any other software offline. There are def pros and cons depending on if you like to own your software or you are ok with renting. Craig Anderton just wrote an article on Harmony Central about this issue.
 
http://www.harmonycentral...ssue-225/ba-p/35542813

I take it  that this unusual post by one of the Cakewalk minions indicates there is at least some discussion at the Roland end of things to make Sonar a subscription  model application. If it has not, one would wonder why not given the favorable benefits.
 
Just to be clear, a subscription model offers none of the advantages to the user of a true cloud based model (see post # 20 above), but most of those advantages to the software distributor. Since Cakewalk/Roland owns Sonar and can do as they like with the product, there is nothing to stop them from adopting the advantageous (to them but not to us) model except customer resistance. Unless users are willing to go to a competitor (losing all the valuable time they have spent learning how to use Sonar and all of the work they have saved as Sonar proprietary files), and competitors are willing to continue to actually sell their software (or at least license it perpetually), resistance is futile. But don't worry I already own the somewhat-buggy-but-probably-good-enough-for-my-purposes-for-now-at-least Sonar X2.