Helpful ReplyAny experience with Cool Soft GM Synth? Having latency issues on laptop.

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kevjazz
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/03/31 01:18:07 (permalink)
And now, the final piece of the puzzle. In our last episode, I told you that the problem seemed to be in the CoolSoft configuration. A blind friend told me that I should change the "Additional Buffers" in the Advanced Options to 8. This change allowed the ASIO buffer setting of 96 to yield a round trip of 6, something. So, Al's well that ends well.

Thanks again,
Kevin

PS. I know TTS1. I've used Cakewalk products on 6 Billboard charting CDs going back to 1996.v
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robert_e_bone
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/03/31 06:48:43 (permalink)
That is GREAT news, indeed!  :)
 
Please note that the small ASIO Buffer Size will be great for tracking (recording), but when you finish your tracking and editing, and begin mixing/mastering, you will need to alter the buffer by making it quite a bit larger - to accommodate the much higher latency-producing plugin effects such as Boost 11 or Perfect Space Reverb.  Some folks use an ASIO Buffer as large as 1024 or more for mixing/mastering.  This is because these kinds of effects use something called 'look-ahead' processing, or otherwise consume vast amounts of CPU.
 
Soooooo, the bottom line here is that you will need to switch back and forth on the ASIO Buffer Size, depending on what you are doing in Sonar.
 
I am quite pleased that you have gotten your current latency issues resolved, and hope this inspires your creativity and productivity with Sonar.
 
Bob Bone
 

Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
 
Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others
MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es
Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms  
#32
kevjazz
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/03/31 14:05:35 (permalink)
Bob,
 
Just so we're clear, I am not a new user.  I've used Cakewalk products since the mid 90s.  I don't do my own mixing.  More importantly, this laptop is intended solely as a sketchpad for use on long plane flights when I'm on tour.  See www.kevinkern.com for more information.  The deal is that I am new to X3.  but I'm only new to it in the sense that it is physically laid out far differently than 8.5 had been.  Also, I haven't used a Windows 7 machine before, having had an XP box for the last 10 years.  Finally, I was using the 30 day trial version of X3 to see how I would get on from the blindness perspective.  the trial version has no soft synths included.  Therefore, I had to find a free GM synth with which to experiment.  So I guess I looked like more of a beginner than I actually am.  
 
Again, can't thank you enough for all your help.  I'm glad I finally got things straightened out.
 
Best,
Kevin
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robert_e_bone
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/03/31 15:16:19 (permalink)
No problem - nothing in my post or in my thoughts was connected to your being at any particular level of knowledge as a Sonar user, or of DAW processing, in general.
 
All any of us can do is react to the posts as they appear, as we have no other way to really assess others here in the forum, and my posts for this thread are simply based on whatever I can glean from posts, coupled with whatever I can best determine the things to look at - in terms of potential reasons something is or isn't happening, based on wherever I am at that moment in my own understanding of ir all or lack of.
 
I am indeed glad you are sorted out - and DO hope the reduction of stress and frustration aids in your ability to create and be productive with the software.
 
Bob Bone
 

Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
 
Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others
MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es
Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms  
#34
kevjazz
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/04/06 00:52:49 (permalink)
Sorry to be back again.  After thinking I got everything soted out, I dumped my trial version and upgraded to X3 Producer.  The reality is that everything works fine with the exception of the CoolSoft Virtual MIDI Synth, which still gives me latency of 12.3 msc round trip.  Can't seem to break that.  All the other instruments that come with X3 work like total champs.  So, I guess I'd like a recommendation for a sondfont that I can load in SFZ.  Or, I'd like another recommendation for a GM synth that I can use.  I guess I can function without a GM synth.  It's just that I'd like one so I can load patches using the bank and patch method I've been accustomed to for the last fifteen years or so. 
 
Again, sorry for coming back.
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robert_e_bone
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/04/06 00:59:57 (permalink)
The TTS-1 is a GM synth, with pretty nice sounds.  Have you tried that?
 
Bob Bone
 

Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
 
Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others
MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es
Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms  
#36
kevjazz
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/04/06 01:13:16 (permalink)
Haven't seen TTS1 in X3. I remember it in 8.5 and earlier.
#37
scook
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/04/06 01:15:30 (permalink)
Synths are organized a little differently in X3, TTS-1 is in DirectX menu in whichever method is used to insert synths.
#38
kevjazz
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/04/06 02:01:43 (permalink)
Okay.  YOu won't believe this.  This sucker was right under my blind nose.  It turns out that the text to speech gizmo I use, reads TTS as, wait for it, Text to Speech.  So, I had no idea that this was an error in the "text to speech" engine and its pronunciation dictionary.  Wow!  TTS works fine. As I recall, one used to be able to choose a patch in TTS1 using the channel, bank and patch drop downs in each MIDI track strip.  I know that you can go to the inspector for this.  But I wish I could figure out how to get to the channel, bank and patch boxes in the individual tracks in TTS1 the way I could with CoolSoft.  How do i expand the MIDi strip so I can reliably see that layout?
 
thanks,
Kevin
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scook
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/04/06 02:11:47 (permalink)
The channel, bank and patch drop downs can still be displayed in the MIDI track strip. There is a Track Control drop down between the Track View Menu (in the red box in the image below) and the first track strip just to the right of the time display which controls the track strip display. In the image below the drop down is set to Mix. Set the drop down value to All.

#40
kevjazz
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/04/06 03:02:47 (permalink)
Thanks. Now, finally, things are actually making sense. I still can't get CoolSoft to work. But I don't think I need it.
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robert_e_bone
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2014/04/06 09:37:42 (permalink)
Yay!  I hope TTS-1 fits the bill for you.
 
Bob Bone
 

Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
 
Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others
MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es
Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms  
#42
SigiZ58
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2016/08/30 16:01:39 (permalink)
Even this thread is older, maybe I have a hint.
 
I also use sometimes Cool Soft. I struggled about this latency Problem also. But after a bit of thinking it might be clear, that Cool Soft is a virtual midi device, like the gm midi device. This means, the Audio is routed to the Audio device directly. So the latency depends on your Standard Audio Driver.
 
However, plugins like tts-1 or other VST Soft Synths use the Audio device of the DAW (Sonar e.g.). The midi ist routed to the VST and the Output of the vst is routed back to sonar. I experienced also bad latency, when i tried to make a mix from TTS & Coolsoft. The Coolsoft has noticable more latency then the "internal" synths.
 
The round trips in Sonar cannot measure this, as the Audio Output from Coolsoft never comes back to sonar.
 
Does this makes sense for anyone ?  
 
post edited by SigiZ58 - 2016/08/30 16:22:40
#43
pharohoknaughty
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Re: Any experience with Cool Soft GM Synth? Having latency issues on laptop. 2016/08/30 16:35:53 (permalink)
kevjazz
Hi All,
 
Does anyone have experience using a soft synth called, "Cool Synth?"  i just installed it on my laptop running the 30 day demo of SONAR X3 and I'm having terrible latency.  I've looked at the buffer size and chosen Cool Synth as my output device.  but I still can't kill the latency problem.  i've changed my audio drivers from MM32bit to WDMKS.  Originally, I couldn't get sounds.  Now I get sounds in WDm, but can't still get the latency down.  I may try again in ASIO.
 
Any advice appreciated.  Feel free to aSsume I've missed something basic.
 
Kevin

 Its possible that someone already mentioned this in the 42 responses, but latency also is caused by having certain effects in one of the channel's fx bin.
 
Some effects are low or zero latency, but others, especially Waves, induce latency.  Look ahead buffers for limiters and phase linear EQ are typical high latency plugs. The Waves website gives latency figures for each product.
 
So try to hit the "E" key in Sonar to turn off the effects and see if this is the culprit.
 
Suerte.

Cakewalk user since DOS3. Currently Platinum on a ASUS Z97 Sabertooth Mark 1 USB 3.1, i4790 3.6, 16 gigs memory, Windows 10 64, RME UCX using firewire.
#44
pharohoknaughty
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Re: Any experience with Cool Synth? having latency issues on laptop. 2016/08/30 19:43:51 (permalink)
This might be the problem:
 
CoolSoft is actually the company name and the synth they have adds 250 ms to the playback latency.
 
Here is from their FAQ
 
See the advanced option "Additional output buffer" into VirtualMIDISynth confgurator.
This buffer is meant to be useful on mid-low performance systems, to avoid stutering and glitches while playing.
If you set it to 1000ms (1 second) it means that each note is player 1 second after the MIDI message is sent.
Default value is 250ms, which is an acceptable value for everyday use. VanBasco player also have a setting to delay karaoke text over music; setting it to the same value will make text and sound synchronized back again.
If you use VirtualMIDISynth for live performance (i.e. connecting an USB piano keyboard), set this buffer down to 0ms.

Cakewalk user since DOS3. Currently Platinum on a ASUS Z97 Sabertooth Mark 1 USB 3.1, i4790 3.6, 16 gigs memory, Windows 10 64, RME UCX using firewire.
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