Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e)

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microapp
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/22 01:44:03 (permalink)
Spencer,
Have you set min and max processor performance to 100% in POWER OPTIONS.
Have you tried turning OFF CPU smart stepping in the bios (or what ever they are calling it this week. e.g smart response technology) ? I see you have an I5 @ 4.4Ghz. Just as a test try no overclocking.
Michael
 
post edited by microapp - 2014/04/22 02:19:51

Sonar Platinum, Cubase Pro 8.5, Reaper 5, Studio One 2
Melodyne Studio 4, Finale 2012
I7-5820K 4.5GHz, 32 GB DDR4-2800,3 monitors,Win 10 Pro
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#31
Spencer
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/22 15:24:27 (permalink)
Happens with or without overclock. CPU power options already set at 100% for both min and max. No memory issues. Full re-install didn't help. I don't have smart response installed. Also tried enabling the administrator account, same problem in there.
post edited by Spencer - 2014/04/22 16:27:06
#32
Spencer
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/23 19:23:52 (permalink)
Hmm. Installed windows on another hard drive, installed nothing at all except my saffire drivers and X3, faders still made noise. Damnit. Something must be wrong with my system then. But what? How can only the audio be problematic. It would help if support could get back to me at last, there can't be 36 ways that noise can come out of fader operation, surely they could help me pinpoint the issue.
#33
Anderton
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/23 21:03:49 (permalink)
Spencer
Hmm. Installed windows on another hard drive, installed nothing at all except my saffire drivers and X3, faders still made noise. Damnit. Something must be wrong with my system then. But what? How can only the audio be problematic. It would help if support could get back to me at last, there can't be 36 ways that noise can come out of fader operation, surely they could help me pinpoint the issue.



If someone hasn't come to Cakewalk with this problem before, and if it's system-specific, then they have to figure out a problem that's outside of Sonar. I really feel for you, these kinds of things are a major hassle to try and track down (I speak from, unfortunately, lots of experience wrestling with computers and software of all kinds).
 
I can't remember if you tried uninstalling the audio interface drivers and using only the internal sound card but if not, I'd try that next. But it still "smells" like something related to video.
 
I keep checking out this thread hoping that you've found an answer I could add it to my "internal database" in case something like this happened to me in the future. Really sorry to hear you're having these issues. Good luck!!

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#34
Spencer
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/23 21:59:05 (permalink)
Hmm again. My WMD Realtek onboard sound constantly makes the same noisy timbre as I get when moving faders with the Saffire, except very loud, and independently of faders*. I don't think that's normal, the sound comes out ok on soundcloud, youtube and such. It's beginning to smell like a fried motherboard circuit to me. Noooo, my trusty old mobo :( well, yeah, maybe not so trusty after all.
 
*Nevermind this, after further testing, this was only because of a too short buffer size in the driver settings. With a longer buffer, the problem is the same as with the other cards.
 
I wonder if it could be power supply, or even power bar related, though. In any case, it's settled. I'm selling out, and making cheesy, atrocious pop. Then I'll be rich and when these issues come up I'll just go get a whole damn new setup. HA!
post edited by Spencer - 2014/04/25 18:39:32
#35
Cactus Music
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/23 23:01:16 (permalink)
 
This always brings up the point that thousands of people are out there using average quality gear running Sonar with no issues. 
You have a 1 in a thousand issue. And even though like all, you try and blame the software, this is almost never the case. User error or hardware gone sour. 
And yes Video card drivers are well known to cause issues with Sonar. Just like on board audio card drivers, yes Sonar is the most picky of all known DAW's when it comes to the system it runs on, but as I say, thousands of people have no real show stopping problems.  
 
But this does not sound like a software issue to me.

Johnny V  
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#36
Spencer
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/26 19:27:55 (permalink)
I figured out a way to record the noise, this time from my Focusrite instead of my X-Fi, using the loop back input. http://bit.ly/1h1Sc71
Pretty much the same thing. Support is now on the case. Pause-Break key disables the video engine, and it doesn't solve the problem, so this confirms it's not the video card, from what I understand. I've tested with some spare RAM I have without any luck, and my CPU passes 8 hours of prime95 without errors, so by now I'm pretty much looking for a new mobo.
#37
Cactus Music
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/26 19:49:26 (permalink)
That noise sound vaguely familiar, I have this Sound Blaster card and when you wore headphones you could hear the mouse when it moved around. And there was always that sort of clock work ticking too. Different , but very close to what you hear. It's interesting how the clicks are at a tempo? 
 
Have you ever disabled your on board audio card during your troubleshooting?  
 
 

Johnny V  
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3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
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#38
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/26 20:32:47 (permalink)
yeah it used to be disabled in the bios at first when the issue came up. also, when I put a new windows on another partition, I installed nothing at all, no drivers, no windows updates nothing, except the saffire and sonar, and faders still were noisy. this is when I started realizing that it's likely not software related after all.
 
also like I said I can filter out the noise with a high pass, which pretty much certifies it's part of the signal flow somewhere, thought not necessarily the software itself's fault.
 
oh, that rhythmic click is just the 808 attack, these things sound pretty bad without further processing. heh. click/pops aren't constant and there didn't seem to be any during that recording pass. only the glitchy digital noise from the volume, then pan, then gain faders.
post edited by Spencer - 2014/04/26 20:47:28
#39
robert_e_bone
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/26 22:48:17 (permalink)
I am TRULY grasping here - what kind of power supply wattage does this computer have?
 
Bob Bone
 

Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
 
Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
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#40
Spencer
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/27 18:59:17 (permalink)
It's a Mushkin Joule 800w
#41
John
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/27 19:31:28 (permalink)
It is possible that your motherboard is faulty. You have tried everything that would relate to the graphics card and the mouse. In the past we had a lot of conflicts with mice and graphics cards using the same IRQ but what you have described seems like a fault in the motherboard. 
 
 
 
 

Best
John
#42
gswitz
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/27 19:43:07 (permalink)
Has anyone asked you to verify that your wifi card is disabled?
 
I'm looking for some kinda thing that uses electricity in bursts.
post edited by gswitz - 2014/04/27 19:52:16

StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen.
I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
#43
millzy
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/27 19:58:12 (permalink)
Hi Spencer,
 
I can sympathize with you, I experienced the 'zipper' type sound when moving faders around in Sonar a few years back. Like you, I tried everything. I disabled everything I could think of, tried a new video card, onboard graphics, no mouse, driver updates, tweaks here and there etc etc etc etc, everything you have just been through - days of fiddling around. I wish I could say I had the answer because, like you, I found nothing that could stop it. Having said that, I had no other pops or clicks other than that, everything ran fine. About 18 mths ago I built a new DAW and upgraded my sound card to an RME Babyface. Since then all has been perfect with Sonar.
 
There must have been something specific in my old setup that caused the issue but I'll never know what it was!  
 
  

Millzy

i7 3770K, 16gb ram, Samsung EVO SSD, 2 x WD drives, RME Babyface, Win 10 (x64), Cakewalk by Bandlab, heaps of other stuff.
#44
Spencer
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/27 23:14:26 (permalink)
gswitz
Has anyone asked you to verify that your wifi card is disabled?
I'm looking for some kinda thing that uses electricity in bursts.



I don't have one, I got an RJ45 cable to the router. Its driver wasn't installed on my test windows boot, so it can't be that.
 
@Millzy, when you say you built a new DAW, you mean it's on a new motherboard right? Was the problematic one an ASUS by any chance?
#45
robert_e_bone
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/28 07:30:36 (permalink)
Have you gone through the process of seeing what might either BE running while Sonar is running, or might get STARTED as a scheduled task when Sonar is running?
 
I have had scheduled tasks whack things out before, and it took me a LONG while to think of looking for something there as a possible culprit.
 
If not a scheduled task that kicks off, perhaps something else that is a background service might be doing things that interfere with Sonar's operation.
 
I sure wish I could be more help to you, I sometimes feel like a newb with so many different areas of both Sonar and with computers, despite decades with both.
 
Bob Bone
 

Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
 
Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
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#46
lawp
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/28 10:13:18 (permalink)
Are you adjusting the faders with a controller or a mouse?

sstteerreeoo ffllllaanngge
#47
Spencer
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/28 18:07:51 (permalink)
Both mouse and midi do the same problem, it's the software fader itself.
 
There couldn't possibly have been any problematic background processes running when I installed a bare-bones Windows test boot. Also the problem is 100% occurrence rate.
#48
robert_e_bone
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/28 18:49:54 (permalink)
I figured that - I was grasping.  I just have no idea what is causing this on your system - sorry.
 
Bob Bone
 

Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
 
Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others
MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es
Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms  
#49
millzy
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/28 20:12:06 (permalink)
Hi Spencer,
 
My old board was an Asus and so is this one (P8Z77-V-LK). I run an i7 3770K with 16gig of ram, using onboard graphics, and my Babyface. It is a DAW only, and I only run Sonar. All runs perfectly. I feel your frustration, like I said I wasted days trying to problem solve. Good luck!

Millzy

i7 3770K, 16gb ram, Samsung EVO SSD, 2 x WD drives, RME Babyface, Win 10 (x64), Cakewalk by Bandlab, heaps of other stuff.
#50
millzy
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/28 20:13:55 (permalink)
And also just to add, from memory I had the issue when I moved faders by mouse or controller. I'm convinced it was a graphics glitch somewhere.
 

Millzy

i7 3770K, 16gb ram, Samsung EVO SSD, 2 x WD drives, RME Babyface, Win 10 (x64), Cakewalk by Bandlab, heaps of other stuff.
#51
robert_e_bone
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/28 20:33:47 (permalink)
I know you tested it without the graphics card present, but I am unclear as to whether or not you also explicitly disabled the video drivers and then tested.  I am wondering if they would have still loaded unless explicitly disabled.
 
Bob Bone
 

Wisdom is a giant accumulation of "DOH!"
 
Sonar: Platinum (x64), X3 (x64) 
Audio Interfaces: AudioBox 1818VSL, Steinberg UR-22
Computers: 1) i7-2600 k, 32 GB RAM, Windows 8.1 Pro x64 & 2) AMD A-10 7850 32 GB RAM Windows 10 Pro x64
Soft Synths: NI Komplete 8 Ultimate, Arturia V Collection, many others
MIDI Controllers: M-Audio Axiom Pro 61, Keystation 88es
Settings: 24-Bit, Sample Rate 48k, ASIO Buffer Size 128, Total Round Trip Latency 9.7 ms  
#52
Cactus Music
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/28 20:41:06 (permalink)
Graphics yes because even with midi the graphic fader image moves. This is what I was talking about too. Any movement on the screen made noises with that one set up I had. It didn't come though on the recordings so I just ignored it. It could be only recorded by using "what you hear." 
 

Johnny V  
Cakelab  
Focusrite 6i61st - Tascam us1641. 
3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
 http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
 
 
#53
bvideo
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Re: Clicks and pops, and audible noise from track faders (x3e) 2014/04/29 10:12:30 (permalink)
There is a parameter in aud.ini called "MixDezipperUsec". Any clues in the manual? (E.g. "Setting MixDezipperUsec too low can cause clicks while rendering abrupt gain changes due to envelopes.".)
#54
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