Helpful ReplyLack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad news?

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Sanderxpander
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 02:55:17 (permalink)
Disregarding all the debate about membership, I do agree that the link in the email should have gone to the "what's new" page, or perhaps a special "why upgrade" page with a buy button. If you go to the site manually it's obvious how to get there, but if you send out a newsletter with a link it should direct you to the most helpful place. Getting a mail with a simple "buy now" link is almost akin to those viagra spam mails. Just very unelegant. With my apologies to the marketing guy who wrote the thing :)
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Anderton
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 03:13:29 (permalink)
WDI
Anderton
I think you can still email for support and the forums are an excellent place for support. Members get access to phone support. I suppose Cakewalk could have done the $99 per incident phone support as with Logic, but I don't think that's more generous at all. As to the fixes, see above. Cakewalk may not have provided a STATED cutoff for fixes, but that's what happened for the reasons given above. So now there is no ambiguity.



Apple provides support for Logic if you have purchased AppleCare.




My point exactly. You have to pay for support. The only one that doesn't require paying in advance is the per incident option.

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Anderton
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 03:14:21 (permalink)
Sanderxpander
Disregarding all the debate about membership, I do agree that the link in the email should have gone to the "what's new" page, or perhaps a special "why upgrade" page with a buy button. If you go to the site manually it's obvious how to get there, but if you send out a newsletter with a link it should direct you to the most helpful place. Getting a mail with a simple "buy now" link is almost akin to those viagra spam mails. Just very unelegant. With my apologies to the marketing guy who wrote the thing :)



I'm curious where the link took people. Can you provide?

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#33
WDI
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 04:00:51 (permalink)
Anderton
WDI
Anderton
I think you can still email for support and the forums are an excellent place for support. Members get access to phone support. I suppose Cakewalk could have done the $99 per incident phone support as with Logic, but I don't think that's more generous at all. As to the fixes, see above. Cakewalk may not have provided a STATED cutoff for fixes, but that's what happened for the reasons given above. So now there is no ambiguity.



Apple provides support for Logic if you have purchased AppleCare.




My point exactly. You have to pay for support. The only one that doesn't require paying in advance is the per incident option.




My point was that there is another option and it's not as bad as you were making it sound.
 
But regardless, your always paying for support. For Cakewalk I suppose that is included in the price of the product. It does sound like OP is partially correct in that you do get about a year less phone support under the new model. However, I don't think that is unreasonable. I'm sure there is quite a bit of overhead providing technical support. 

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#34
Sanderxpander
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 10:34:12 (permalink)
Anderton
Sanderxpander
Disregarding all the debate about membership, I do agree that the link in the email should have gone to the "what's new" page, or perhaps a special "why upgrade" page with a buy button. If you go to the site manually it's obvious how to get there, but if you send out a newsletter with a link it should direct you to the most helpful place. Getting a mail with a simple "buy now" link is almost akin to those viagra spam mails. Just very unelegant. With my apologies to the marketing guy who wrote the thing :)



I'm curious where the link took people. Can you provide?

The OP already did.
#35
Anderton
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 10:41:56 (permalink)
Sanderxpander
Anderton
Sanderxpander
Disregarding all the debate about membership, I do agree that the link in the email should have gone to the "what's new" page, or perhaps a special "why upgrade" page with a buy button. If you go to the site manually it's obvious how to get there, but if you send out a newsletter with a link it should direct you to the most helpful place. Getting a mail with a simple "buy now" link is almost akin to those viagra spam mails. Just very unelegant. With my apologies to the marketing guy who wrote the thing :)



I'm curious where the link took people. Can you provide?

The OP already did.



Maybe I need new glasses, but I don't see a link in any of his posts. Can you tell me which post has the link? It's not all that important, but I'm curious to see what he's talking about.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#36
Anderton
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 10:45:20 (permalink)
WDI
 
Apple provides support for Logic if you have purchased AppleCare.



And since I'm asking questions...do you know what the AppleCare Professional Audio support costs? The info for support on this page doesn't really give any answers.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#37
cowboydan
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 10:57:53 (permalink)
People get hung up on the word "Subscription" and only see  that part of the Sonar Platinum Upgrade.
 
I, for one don't like that word.
 
The way I see it is that you pay $149.00 up front for the upgrades from X3 to Platinum, which would be normally the case with a usual upgrade. BUT, in the next 12 months you get all the upgrades and features free, which for me is a 2 year upgrade package for the same $149.00. No extra charge.
 
The "Subscription" as they call it seems to me like a payment installment plan. You choose to upgrade and you pay in 12 consecutive months. It does cost a little extra as do all payment installment plans, but if you are short on cash you could always go this way and get the same as everyone else for $30.00 more.
 
It's not the greatest way to get Platinum, but for some maybe the only way.
 
I will say I find the year after that too expensive just for 1 continueous year IMHO. We have already paid for the basic program the first year and will not have to buy that again. The upgrades from the first year we also paid for and best of all we get to keep them at the end of the year.
 
I hope that when the time comes, Cakewalk will change the prices of the upgrade to be more reasonable.
Anyway, that is how I see it.
post edited by cowboydan - 2015/01/23 13:49:35
#38
Sanderxpander
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 11:07:39 (permalink)
Anderton
Sanderxpander
Anderton
Sanderxpander
Disregarding all the debate about membership, I do agree that the link in the email should have gone to the "what's new" page, or perhaps a special "why upgrade" page with a buy button. If you go to the site manually it's obvious how to get there, but if you send out a newsletter with a link it should direct you to the most helpful place. Getting a mail with a simple "buy now" link is almost akin to those viagra spam mails. Just very unelegant. With my apologies to the marketing guy who wrote the thing :)



I'm curious where the link took people. Can you provide?

The OP already did.



Maybe I need new glasses, but I don't see a link in any of his posts. Can you tell me which post has the link? It's not all that important, but I'm curious to see what he's talking about.

You're right, Craig, sorry. Someone else posted a link and I misrembered. I'd also like to know in that case.

I'm still altogether confused why there seems to be such a hot defense of Cakewalk's failure to link to the "What's New" page instead of the "Buy Now" page in the newsletter. It seems a simple mistake or misjudgment and I would be happy it was brought up. Heading to a "What's New" page is just much friendlier than to one that says "spend money on our stuff".
#39
mettelus
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 11:17:58 (permalink)
The email is a bit long, so in a normal browser, the only thing that shows initially is a picture with this link embedded into it: http://www.cakewalk.com/Products/SONAR/Buy-Now/?utm_source=bronto&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Image+-+New+SONAR&utm_content=The+New+SONAR%3A+Now+Available+-+Buy+it+today&utm_campaign=Jan+21+2015+-+All
 
However... if you scroll down, the following is immediately below that picture (with even more below this):
 
"The New SONAR: Now Available - Upgrade today! The new SONAR is more than just a digital audio workstation - it's the most advanced music production experience available today. We've completely changed the way our software is developed by introducing a Membership program that offers continuous updates to the software including new features, improvements, fixes, content, and video tutorials that guide you along in the process. And thanks to the new Cakewalk Command Center, we've made the installation and update process a breeze so you can focus on what's truly important - making music.
IMPORTANT, PLEASE READ FIRST: Click the option you would like to buy and login/create a Cakewalk SSO account to see your upgrade price in the cart. Please watch this video for download and installation instructions with the new Cakewalk Command Center.
See What's New in SONAR
Choose your SONAR Version - Upgrade today!
"
 
The entire email is roughly 3 pages long (or more).

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#40
Andrew Rossa
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 11:33:31 (permalink)
n13L5
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n13L5
Support (and fixes?) aren't included with the product anymore but turn into a separate subscription: just the backlash one would expect when one's favorite company gets bought out by corporate foam whippers.

Sorry you didn't find the info you wanted right off the bat, but there certainly is/was plenty of info out there telling us all about the new Sonar, at least when I was researching the possibility of upgrading.  Also, the above statement is a bit off, as really within the new model, support and fixes aren't included WITH the product because in all essence they ARE the product.  However you decide to attack this new version of Sonar financially (lump sum or monthly installments) you are paying for 1) the license to use the software and
                                              2) ongoing support, fixes, updates, and additional content for as long as you decide
                                                    to maintain such an agreement
 
At least that's my take.  And I'm happy with the whole shebang, after carefully researching and analyzing pros/cons of both the new Sonar software and the new Cakewalk purchasing model. 


You may well be right about the information, but as a mere Cakewalk newsletter subscriber, I was not told anything until the email I just received and that was the only link in it.
 
As for fixes and support, you're making my point for me. Prior to today, there was no separate agreement needed to get that.  So its a price hike by splitting out something that was previously included into a separate subscription. All thanks to corporate buyout, imho.


Sorry you were disappointed. That wasn't the only link in it though. Perhaps you should open it again and read through it completely.
#41
gustabo
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 12:10:19 (permalink)
There was a "What's New" link on that email.


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#42
Sanderxpander
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 12:12:26 (permalink)
Cool, case closed.
#43
Andrew Rossa
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 12:43:46 (permalink)
You know after further reflection, I will concede his point. When we put the email together, we debated whether to put the buy now links at the top or after the introduction section (where he expected to see information about the version). We know sometimes people don't read the entire email and we know people were anxious to buy so we put the buy now links at the top and then followed it with introduction emails, which in all fairness had the links he was looking for and that's he's upset about it. There's probably a better way to do this and we'll fix for next week. I do apologize for any confusion.
 
 
#44
Paul P
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 13:00:09 (permalink)
cowboydan
... but if you are short on cash you could always go this way and get the same as everyone else for $30.00 more.



Hey Danny, I realize everyone is saying this, but you've wrapped it up quite nicely  
 

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#45
WDI
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 13:56:38 (permalink)
Anderton
WDI
 
Apple provides support for Logic if you have purchased AppleCare.



And since I'm asking questions...do you know what the AppleCare Professional Audio support costs? The info for support on this page doesn't really give any answers.




I'm not sure what it costs for AppleCare for professional audio support.
 
But for AppleCare for a computer which covers hardware and phone support for OS X and apple software including logic, I think it was like $350 for rMBP and $150 for 27" iMac for 3 yr extended warranty. It's different for each product. The rMBP being the most expensive.
post edited by WDI - 2015/01/23 14:05:26

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#46
n13L5
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 14:20:32 (permalink)
Thanks Anderton.
 
Still doesn't change that the link from the newsletter doesn't drop you to any of the places you mention.
 
If what you say here was even in part in the newsletter or some links provided either there or on the landing page the newsletter sends you to, everything would be perfect.
 
As for fixes in previous versions of Cakewalk software, I got bug fix patches for quite a bit past 6 months.
 
And in I *was* talking about buying the software outright, rather than what looks more like a friendly, interest free payment plan for people short on cash after seeing some clarifications on the subject.
 
So but you have to buy the software outright every year again to have support and fixes.  If my memory servers me right, there wasn't a clockwork-like release schedule of a new Sonar once a year, was there...
 
But anyway, this post is more than answered, with the exception of a lack of marketing or links to such in a place after the news letter link and before the buy-it-now page. 
 
You may think its strange, but I'm not likely to click through to the top level page of the domain if I came in over a link specific to a certain product.  I expect to be walked to the relevant blurbs praising the goods... hand holding to make sure the customer sees the info you want them to see without detour to forums... the job of marketing  ;)
 
If nobody did it like this, maybe I would expect to search around, but you go and travel from other company's product links and see how they present their stuff.
 
Either way, I'll unsub from this, after all, its up to cakewalk how to market their stuff. I wrote more than enough words to point out where I think there's a little pot hole that doesn't need to be there.
 
And I'll buy the new Cakewalk too, even though I'm already worried about what of my old stuff is going to end up broken or missing...  But then maybe you fixed that problem once and for all with your new downloader system. would be great.

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#47
n13L5
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 14:27:53 (permalink)
@ Andrew: Just saw your mention of a "what's new" link in the newsletter.
 
I really only cared about Sonar, so that's the link I used. No reason to click on "what's new" which could be anything. "moved to a new office", "changed our billing provider" or whatever...

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#48
dwardzala
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 14:32:44 (permalink)
There will be "regular" (the bakers hinted at monthly) updates and content releases throughout the year.  There will not (it appears) be a major release every year (or any year).  The content that used to be in that major release will be released in smaller doses throughout the year.

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#49
Andrew Rossa
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 17:04:13 (permalink)
n13L5
@ Andrew: Just saw your mention of a "what's new" link in the newsletter.
 
I really only cared about Sonar, so that's the link I used. No reason to click on "what's new" which could be anything. "moved to a new office", "changed our billing provider" or whatever...


I was trying to see your point but now I see you just want to argue. The link was in the SONAR section and says:
 
"See What's New in SONAR"


Are you sure you looking at the right email. Please post a screenshot. This is silly.
#50
John T
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 17:13:47 (permalink)
n13L5
If my memory servers me right, there wasn't a clockwork-like release schedule of a new Sonar once a year, was there...
 

Actually, that's how it's been, for as long as I can remember. New release every year, in the October-December period, more or less. There was never a published schedule saying that, but that's what happened.

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#51
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 21:43:35 (permalink)
Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]
n13L5
...Just saw your mention of a "what's new" link in the newsletter...


...The link was in the SONAR section and says:
 
"See What's New in SONAR"
 
Are you sure you looking at the right email...

 
I received 3 emails and that link was present in 2 of them but missing from the third, which appeared earlier today. Maybe that's the one that the OP is referring to.

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#52
Andrew Rossa
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Re: Lack of any nicely written intro why the new Sonar is better makes it look like bad ne 2015/01/23 21:52:50 (permalink)
Kev999
Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]
n13L5
...Just saw your mention of a "what's new" link in the newsletter...


...The link was in the SONAR section and says:
 
"See What's New in SONAR"
 
Are you sure you looking at the right email...

 
I received 3 emails and that link was present in 2 of them but missing from the third, which appeared earlier today. Maybe that's the one that the OP is referring to.


Yes, that was the third email. But the one he got had it.  It's going back in next week regardless :)
 
But it's not like we are trying to hide information. We've posted tons of stuff on the forums, sent emails, and have a lot of info our website. 
 
#53
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