uptoolate
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24/44.1 or 24/48?
I have heard some say to stay at 44.1 because of the math. I have the option of either one. Which is best? Also, on the new machines, is it worth going higher like 24/96?
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ohhey
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 24, 05 4:37 PM
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ORIGINAL: uptoolate I have heard some say to stay at 44.1 because of the math. I have the option of either one. Which is best? Also, on the new machines, is it worth going higher like 24/96? I have always recorded 48K just because many of my old tracks I'm adding to are from ADAT and were transfered in digital so they are 48K. I use Sound Forge to resample them to 44.1 to go to CD and they seem to sound just fine to me. I have not tried 96K or 88.2 yet but I can't wait to hear what it sounds like. I'm facing the same decision on 88.2 vs 96K when I do. Maybe it would be best for me to use 88.2 since it's a bigger jump to 44.1 and it would make the math easy. I think I can hear a bit of difference between 48K and 44.1 but I'm not sure if it matters on tracks. 48K does sound a little better on most cards (converters). I tend to leave the stereo export at 48k till I'm done with the mastering then convert it to 44.1 as the last step. If you ever do sound for DVD you will want 48K since that is the native sample rate of a DVD sound track.
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bubbadoody
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 24, 05 5:15 PM
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48 is better. I don't know about 96 as just like Frank I have ADAT stuff I use and that is the setting for it. The last project I had when you compared what was done in 44.1 to 48k it only became really apparent when you got to the mastering. If you can record at 48 and leave it until the very last to apply the dither and convert to 44.1.
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gdugan
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 24, 05 6:03 PM
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ORIGINAL: bubbadoody 48 is better. I don't know about 96 as just like Frank I have ADAT stuff I use and that is the setting for it. The last project I had when you compared what was done in 44.1 to 48k it only became really apparent when you got to the mastering. If you can record at 48 and leave it until the very last to apply the dither and convert to 44.1. Dither has nothing to do with sample rate. It's only an issue when you change bit depth.
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pdarg
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 24, 05 8:24 PM
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This has been discussed many times in this forum in the past, and I myself have conducted numerous experiments. Here's my summary: All things being equal, higher sample rates sound better. However, each audio card is different, and a 44/24 signal on a good card is probably preferable to a 96/24 signal recorded on a bad card. Also, consider your final format: if it's going to end up as a 44/16 CD track, you will have to convert sample rates in your mastering process - not impossible, but like any other processing, you're messing with the purity of the sound. I started recording at 96 and then 88.2 about 18 months ago. The results have been very mixed. The files are massive, and Sonar will play fewer tracks in a mix. Also, I have been told that 88.2 is preferable to 96 since the math involved in converting 88.2 to 44.1 is much smoother than converting 96 to 44.1 I am back to recording at 44/24 and my life is a lot simpler. I upgraded my card to a LynxTwo and have never looked back. Again, this is not to say that higher sample rates can't improve the sound - but let's face it: most of us are dealing with much more prominent issues in our recording chain, and sample rate is towards the bottom of the list (in my opionion) in getting a better sound.
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dcastle
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 24, 05 8:26 PM
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ASUS M3A78 AMD 9950 Quad 2.6G 8GB Shure • Rhode • Audio-Technica • Allen&Heath GL2200-24 MOTU 24i • Presonus Firepod • E-MU 1212m • Zoom H2 SONAR 2XL-8PE • Sound Forge 1-9 • Audacity 0.1-1.3
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DonM
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 24, 05 8:32 PM
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All: I have stopped at 48Khz / 24 bit for all of the reasons stated above. Nyquist says 44.1 is enough for humans but electronics don't care about our limitations and 48Khz adds one more harmonic that may relieve a hard wall against realism. I've read some folks post about the benefits of 96Khz and 192 - I've played around there and can't for the life of me imagine staying there yet given the watermark delivery medium is still red book CD. -D
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dcastle
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 24, 05 9:00 PM
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Let's don't start this all over again --- if there's anything that wasn't said in the last thread 16 bit vs. 24 bit which covered everything under the sun, let's add it there so we keep things nice and tidy around here. May I recommend the Search feature at the top right hand corner of this window --- it really will yield marvelous results if asked about 44.1 48.1 88.2 96 16-bit 24-bit etc. etc. Regards, David
post edited by dcastle - May 24, 05 9:03 PM
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CP
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 25, 05 1:53 AM
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ORIGINAL: pdarg This has been discussed many times in this forum in the past, and I myself have conducted numerous experiments. Here's my summary: All things being equal, higher sample rates sound better. However, each audio card is different, and a 44/24 signal on a good card is probably preferable to a 96/24 signal recorded on a bad card. Fully agree, it simply matters as to what sounds best with your interface as there is no usable difference between 48kHz and 96kHz. Unlike the pictures would lead you to beleive, there is only ONE mathematical way for a waveform to proceed based on amplitude and time. Also, consider your final format: if it's going to end up as a 44/16 CD track, you will have to convert sample rates in your mastering process - not impossible, but like any other processing, you're messing with the purity of the sound. Absolutely! For film use 48kHz, for CD use 44.1kHz. I started recording at 96 and then 88.2 about 18 months ago. The results have been very mixed. The files are massive, and Sonar will play fewer tracks in a mix. Also, I have been told that 88.2 is preferable to 96 since the math involved in converting 88.2 to 44.1 is much smoother than converting 96 to 44.1 Unfortunately all current SRC uses a round about method and does not directly divide, so there's no benefit. I am back to recording at 44/24 and my life is a lot simpler. I upgraded my card to a LynxTwo and have never looked back. Again, this is not to say that higher sample rates can't improve the sound - but let's face it: most of us are dealing with much more prominent issues in our recording chain, and sample rate is towards the bottom of the list (in my opionion) in getting a better sound.
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uptoolate
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 25, 05 2:51 AM
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odhey, I use soundforge to do my mastering also. Do you use the dithering in sound forge, or do you use another method. I have the original version of L2 and have wondered if I should use that to dither. Let me know your thoughts. If I should use the L2, should I do the processing and then simply save the processed file as 16/44.1? Does this do additional dithering if I have already done it with the L2? Thanks for your help.
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CapnSpanky
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 25, 05 11:21 AM
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FWIW, I've felt like I've heard a slight improvement in the sound when going from 24/44 to 24/48.
Tim Wells ------- Cap'n Spanky From the Planet Screwball
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hv
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 25, 05 11:53 AM
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They're both very good but I understand that Sonar 3's built-in PowR dither is better. But not accessible from the burning program I use. Its so convenient to export from Sonar at 88.2/24, master in SF, then burn with CD Arch which automatically downsamples/dithers at the same time. So I usually end up using Sony's triangular/high-pass contour DirectX dither as a compromise. Been also thinking about Izotope's Ozone 3 which comes with MegabitMax. And is available in DirectX. Howard
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uptoolate
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 28, 05 6:57 PM
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Harvey Cedars
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 28, 05 7:01 PM
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I record at 24/44.1. I always have, and have gotten good results so far. But I can go to 24/96. I never tried it, but one of these days....................
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name1432
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RE: 24/44.1 or 24/48?
May 28, 05 7:25 PM
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ORIGINAL: uptoolate I have heard some say to stay at 44.1 because of the math. I have the option of either one. Which is best? Also, on the new machines, is it worth going higher like 24/96? One reason you might mix at a higher sample rate: Suppose you use a high sample rate and your samples containing frequencies higher than 22.05. Then you route the signal through an effect that transfers some energy from the ultrasonic frequencies down into the audible frequency range. Maybe the result sounds good... That said, I do everything at 44.1 because I produce for CD and I'm scared of sample-rate conversion math.
post edited by name1432 - May 29, 05 6:31 AM
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