'Firefrost' - alternative mix without drums

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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/08 02:52:07 (permalink)
Lynn


James, this is a short, but sweet piece of music.  I enjoyed the listen, but I think the mix could come up in volume somewhat.  It's very smooth, but there's not much tension and  release.  But, kudos to all involved for writing good parts.

Thanks Lynn. The track is un-mastered as yet, so there's room for some more volume.

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/08 02:54:11 (permalink)
markno999


James, 
 
I do like the song.   I listened yesterday and again today.   The song itself it really good, I like the melody guitar tones, etc...  I found something about it distracting and it took a few listens to put my finger on it.    I think what you have are some timing issues, it is apparent when the drums first come in with the piano.   It is mixed well and is certainly an enjoyable listen but to my ears the rhytmn section just is not together and it detracts from the overall performance.   By the time the drums get more prevalent and active in the mix towards the end it does come together.   I am a fan..
 
Regards

Thanks Mark. The general consensus is a distraction with the drums, and I have a feeling the track may breathe a little easier without them. I'll experiment and see.

 
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ohgrant
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/08 18:51:45 (permalink)
 Cool stuff guys, I enjoyed

Me
 
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/08 20:58:01 (permalink)
I like the drum rhythms, but the sounds you chose for them: not so much. Especially in the first part where the snare thing sounds like a clipped wav edit.

There are real moments of beauty here, but it does come across kinda disjointed. The bass is fine I think, but it sounds too prominent and upfront for this track. Maybe grab some fundamentals and low pass the rest. Then there wouldn't be so much contention with the rest.

The piano could stand to be pushed back a tad with some reverb, 
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 03:32:04 (permalink)
blipp


Very nice composition James and an interesting arrangement that keeps your attention. 

You always have great tones coming from your guitars and this one is no exeption. Very enjoyable melodically too.

I have to agree with markno though about the occasional timing errors of the percussion and it did distract me a few times.

Overall though a very well crafted piece of work.

Thanks a lot John. I'm taking these comments on board, and will be revisiting the percussion in the track.

 
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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 03:33:11 (permalink)
notnat


markno999


James,  
  
I think what you have are some timing issues, it is apparent when the drums first come in with the piano.  

I noticed this too James... I love the arrangement, and the performances, but not so much the drums..
you mentioned revisiting them... I think you should...  Very cool music and production otherwise...
Well done guys...

Frank, thanks very much as always..yep..the drums..(makes cutting motion across throat) 

 
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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 03:34:41 (permalink)
drumstixkev


I love the flow of this piece.  I don't know if its the  drums or the space the drums are sitting in that throws me off.  GREAT colab looking forward to hearing more of your project.


Kev

Cheers Kev!

 
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 04:57:39 (permalink)
Scottytunes


That worked out nicely.

Thanks Scotty!

 
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 04:58:42 (permalink)
CLEAN


Beautiful song - great playing. I love this a lot.

Hey, thanks Mark, glad you liked it so much.

 
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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 04:59:45 (permalink)
Old55


A fine job all around.  

Thank you Jan!

 
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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 05:01:47 (permalink)
The Band19


Sorry James, I meant to listen and comment earlier. I like it, "as usual." Something a miss with the bass though? Did you know I'm a bass player? And? I have an Alembic? (Not many bass players can say that :-)

This actually kind of a Steve Vai vibe to me? It's the guitar melody and in some respect the tones. It's over now, in retrospect, it feels almost like part of a rock opera? Like "a scene?" As it it was something else, then this happened, and it's about to transition to the next scene?

(I'm sorry for that Ed, I didn't bust um too hard? Just a tap really? Like a fist bump?)

Actually it sounds pretty nice all the way around? I did particularly enjoy the guitars. Good job.

Thanks Robby. For all your joking around, you always have some good insights. The above comment is spot-on actually, that's exactly what this piece is.

I like the bass though.

 
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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 05:03:05 (permalink)
ohgrant


 Cool stuff guys, I enjoyed

Thanks Grant, much appreciated.

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 05:06:56 (permalink)
jamesyoyo


I like the drum rhythms, but the sounds you chose for them: not so much. Especially in the first part where the snare thing sounds like a clipped wav edit.

There are real moments of beauty here, but it does come across kinda disjointed. The bass is fine I think, but it sounds too prominent and upfront for this track. Maybe grab some fundamentals and low pass the rest. Then there wouldn't be so much contention with the rest.

The piano could stand to be pushed back a tad with some reverb, 

Hi James, thanks very much for the mix tips, always welcome. I did struggle with the drums on this one, I will admit. I probably made a rod for own back by writing it with an alternating time sig (it goes from 6/4 to 4/4 and back). Probably needs a drummer to make sense of it.

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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chuckebaby
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 08:53:57 (permalink)
what a great piece, im in love with the main melody of the song, its beautiful James, your guitar work is just amazing in this song.
the piano is very nice as well and what can I say about the bass ? just great ed.

man I just keep going back to the melody, its great.
I would just die to hear this with lyrics some how built in to it.
the melody lines are big sellers/top 40 #1 hit stuff, the things hits are made of.

I didn't know what to expect when I hit play, I haven't listen to many of your songs.
I really liked this.

id love to critique it but I just cant im sorry, I felt everything was right there and where it needed to be.
could it have been recorded in a 5 million dollar studio and mastered at the record plant?
sure I would notice the difference but for polished/non polished mix, this is great.

thanks for sharing

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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 09:33:37 (permalink)
chuckebaby


what a great piece, im in love with the main melody of the song, its beautiful James, your guitar work is just amazing in this song.
the piano is very nice as well and what can I say about the bass ? just great ed.

man I just keep going back to the melody, its great.
I would just die to hear this with lyrics some how built in to it.
the melody lines are big sellers/top 40 #1 hit stuff, the things hits are made of.

I didn't know what to expect when I hit play, I haven't listen to many of your songs.
I really liked this.

id love to critique it but I just cant im sorry, I felt everything was right there and where it needed to be.
could it have been recorded in a 5 million dollar studio and mastered at the record plant?
sure I would notice the difference but for polished/non polished mix, this is great.

thanks for sharing

Chuck, this may seem like bumping, but I don't care, 'cos you just made my day!  This piece started with the melody, and I'm so pleased you liked it.

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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Guitarpima
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/09 17:14:45 (permalink)
I think the mix could be much clearer. The seperation is not there yet.

Musicly, I think it's excellent. You bring your melody then go off elsewhere then the main melody comes back. Something I think a lot of people forget.

I saw the comment about Ed's playing. I like his lines. I think what the comment was about is Ed was following the climaxes along rather than pushing the next phrase in (if that makes sense).

I agree about Terry's excllent playing being lost. I think clearing up the mix would help.

Excellent work by all!!!

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paulo
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/10 09:41:54 (permalink)
I've listened three times now on different days to see of the drums would grow on me, but I'm still not feeling the love for them. Guitar tones are to die for as usual. It's good, but not there yet for me.
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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/10 11:11:06 (permalink)
Guitarpima


I think the mix could be much clearer. The seperation is not there yet.

Musicly, I think it's excellent. You bring your melody then go off elsewhere then the main melody comes back. Something I think a lot of people forget.

I saw the comment about Ed's playing. I like his lines. I think what the comment was about is Ed was following the climaxes along rather than pushing the next phrase in (if that makes sense).

I agree about Terry's excllent playing being lost. I think clearing up the mix would help.

Excellent work by all!!!

Thanks Robert, appreciate the thoughtful comments.

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/10 11:12:19 (permalink)
paulo


I've listened three times now on different days to see of the drums would grow on me, but I'm still not feeling the love for them. Guitar tones are to die for as usual. It's good, but not there yet for me.

Hi Paulo, thanks for taking the time to do that. See original post for an alternative mix without drums (until the final 4/4 section)

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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chuckebaby
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/10 11:31:18 (permalink)
jamesg1213


chuckebaby


what a great piece, im in love with the main melody of the song, its beautiful James, your guitar work is just amazing in this song.
the piano is very nice as well and what can I say about the bass ? just great ed.

man I just keep going back to the melody, its great.
I would just die to hear this with lyrics some how built in to it.
the melody lines are big sellers/top 40 #1 hit stuff, the things hits are made of.

I didn't know what to expect when I hit play, I haven't listen to many of your songs.
I really liked this.

id love to critique it but I just cant im sorry, I felt everything was right there and where it needed to be.
could it have been recorded in a 5 million dollar studio and mastered at the record plant?
sure I would notice the difference but for polished/non polished mix, this is great.

thanks for sharing

Chuck, this may seem like bumping, but I don't care, 'cos you just made my day!  This piece started with the melody, and I'm so pleased you liked it.

came back for another listen today,true to my word, i love this piece.the melody's grow on you a lot.
I listened to the version without drums as well. just a great work of art.
post edited by chuckebaby - 2013/03/10 11:34:17

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darylcrowley
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/10 13:08:40 (permalink)
Nice mix.  Each instrument sits very nicely.  Killer tone as always James..  Terry.. Love the piano.  Nice bass tone ED.  Very pretty tune, a great smooth jazz piece.

Good job guys, very nice

Daryl

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notnat
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/12 12:32:12 (permalink)
Interesting to hear the difference... I would prefer the drums come in earlier, but different voices than the previous kit...
I'm still hearing some timing issues with the bass... it comes in  a hair late, and it's just not there on a couple of critical downbeats...
I like what he's doing... but someone needs to zoom-in, split clips, and do some micro-surgery... move the bass track adjacent to the guitar track, zoom-in and visually line 'em up...   I love the music, by the way...
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/12 13:26:18 (permalink)
chuckebaby


jamesg1213


chuckebaby


what a great piece, im in love with the main melody of the song, its beautiful James, your guitar work is just amazing in this song.
the piano is very nice as well and what can I say about the bass ? just great ed.

man I just keep going back to the melody, its great.
I would just die to hear this with lyrics some how built in to it.
the melody lines are big sellers/top 40 #1 hit stuff, the things hits are made of.

I didn't know what to expect when I hit play, I haven't listen to many of your songs.
I really liked this.

id love to critique it but I just cant im sorry, I felt everything was right there and where it needed to be.
could it have been recorded in a 5 million dollar studio and mastered at the record plant?
sure I would notice the difference but for polished/non polished mix, this is great.

thanks for sharing

Chuck, this may seem like bumping, but I don't care, 'cos you just made my day!  This piece started with the melody, and I'm so pleased you liked it.

came back for another listen today,true to my word, i love this piece.the melody's grow on you a lot.
I listened to the version without drums as well. just a great work of art.

Thanks again Chuck!

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/12 13:27:26 (permalink)
darylcrowley


Nice mix.  Each instrument sits very nicely.  Killer tone as always James..  Terry.. Love the piano.  Nice bass tone ED.  Very pretty tune, a great smooth jazz piece.

Good job guys, very nice

Daryl

Thanks for the compliments Daryl! Not sure about 'smooth jazz' tho..

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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jamesg1213
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/12 13:29:23 (permalink)
notnat


Interesting to hear the difference... I would prefer the drums come in earlier, but different voices than the previous kit...
I'm still hearing some timing issues with the bass... it comes in  a hair late, and it's just not there on a couple of critical downbeats...
I like what he's doing... but someone needs to zoom-in, split clips, and do some micro-surgery... move the bass track adjacent to the guitar track, zoom-in and visually line 'em up...   I love the music, by the way...

Thanks for coming back to it Frank, that's beyond the call of duty  At this point I'm stumped on the drums, I'm going to have to let it rest a while and come back to it. Tried a few things but nothing's sitting right.

 
Jyemz
 
 
 



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notnat
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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/12 13:51:37 (permalink)
jamesg1213


notnat


Interesting to hear the difference... I would prefer the drums come in earlier, but different voices than the previous kit...
I'm still hearing some timing issues with the bass... it comes in  a hair late, and it's just not there on a couple of critical downbeats...
I like what he's doing... but someone needs to zoom-in, split clips, and do some micro-surgery... move the bass track adjacent to the guitar track, zoom-in and visually line 'em up...   I love the music, by the way...
Thanks for coming back to it Frank, that's beyond the call of duty  At this point I'm stumped on the drums, I'm going to have to let it rest a while and come back to it. Tried a few things but nothing's sitting right.
 
That's a good thang... let it stew a while, and when you come back, it'll jump right out at ya... Just don't loose it...

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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/12 14:07:35 (permalink)
Well done, fellas. Lovely lyrical tune.

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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/12 14:10:17 (permalink)
I prefer mix 5 to 4 but as mentioned it sound like it need a little down time then some surgery to bring it together.

Nice tune like the melodies and tone look forward to hearing some more.

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Re:'Firefrost' featuring two guests 2013/03/12 22:05:49 (permalink)
Hi, James,
 
I absolutely love this gorgeous piece of music, and think that you, Ed and Terry did a splendid job on this!
 
I love the classy sounding guitar work, Ed's bass sounds great, and Terry's piano adds a very fresh, delicate melody and sound texture to the overall mix.
 
I listened to both versions and really can't make up my mind on a preference, although, I think for some reason, I prefer the new mix with  the drums coming in toward the end.  It seems to showcase the melody lines and solos a bit more.
 
By the way, just a coincidence, the name of one of my High School bands was "Frostfire", named after a magical sword in a book that I read as a kid. :)
 
This new project sounds like it's really going great, James, lots of very cool stuff coming from you, keep 'em coming, my friend!
 
Best Wishes,
Bob

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