Helpful ReplyFriends With GAS

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dubdisciple
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2014/09/04 12:39:34 (permalink)

Friends With GAS

Has this ever happend to you?
A good friend of mine goes through a pattern every 4-6 months where he raves about a new DAW he has acquired. Each time that product is better than sex, chocolate, free beer and Jesus combined. He insists " You HAVE to get this!" and goes on about how much better it is than the last "greatest thing ever". This is followed by a couple of weeks of updating me on tutorials he is watching and links to his new songs which he insists sound so much better now. Honestly his stuff sounds exactly the same. In fact, every person who has ever told me their stuff sounds better after getting a new DAW or plugin has pretty much given me material that sounded about the same. Maybe louder but still the same. The only time someone approaches me and claims improvement and it turns out to be true is usually because of one of the following:

1) mixed in a better environment
2) got someone else to do their mastering
3) they really dived right into getting better at understanding the eq and compression plugs they already had

He's running out of DAWs to claim are supreme unless he goes Mac or Linux. I'm not saying all new plugins are useless. Obviously there are great third party plugins that, in the right hands will produce more desirable results. I just don't see it often.
#1
Rain
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 13:10:38 (permalink)
dubdisciple
Has this ever happend to you?
A good friend of mine goes through a pattern every 4-6 months where he raves about a new DAW he has acquired. Each time that product is better than sex, chocolate, free beer and Jesus combined. He insists " You HAVE to get this!" and goes on about how much better it is than the last "greatest thing ever". This is followed by a couple of weeks of updating me on tutorials he is watching and links to his new songs which he insists sound so much better now. Honestly his stuff sounds exactly the same. In fact, every person who has ever told me their stuff sounds better after getting a new DAW or plugin has pretty much given me material that sounded about the same. Maybe louder but still the same. The only time someone approaches me and claims improvement and it turns out to be true is usually because of one of the following:

1) mixed in a better environment
2) got someone else to do their mastering
3) they really dived right into getting better at understanding the eq and compression plugs they already had

He's running out of DAWs to claim are supreme unless he goes Mac or Linux. I'm not saying all new plugins are useless. Obviously there are great third party plugins that, in the right hands will produce more desirable results. I just don't see it often.



It used to be me, pretty much. :)
 
The one thing I've eventually noticed is that when I really was inspired, I was not as inclined to switch DAWs - I focused on the music I was trying to make. But at times, when inspiration wasn't really there, then I'd start looking for new synths and new DAWs and new effects. And if I couldn't get things to sound as good as they should, I'd try different plug-ins, and sometimes fool myself into believing that the next one would magically fix things.
 
I do honestly believe that my mixes improved when I switched to Logic but for different reasons - got rid of old habits which were part of my workflow and started being more attentive to certain details. I learned Logic with a plan in mind, so to speak, a map of what I wanted to accomplish, what I wanted to improve. The fact that it's an entirely new GUI which presents you options in a different way forces you to evaluate things which you may have come to overlook otherwise. You can't be sloppy.
 
In an ideal world, I wouldn't be using any 3rd party audio plug-ins. None. As a matter of fact, I'm constantly trying to learn how I can replace the few 3rd party ones I still use w/ Logic's own. And I'm 95% there. When time comes to finally upgrade my computer, I'm kind of hoping that I won't have to install any of that stuff.
 
There's the matter of soft synths though - there are a few of those which I can't really do without, even if I only use them occasionally. But I try to stick to what I have.
 
And to be perfectly honest, when it comes to recording, I kind of realized at some point that, say, a bit of EQ on the way in did a whole lot more for me than I could get out of dozens of EQ plug-ins which supposedly emulate high end hardware. There are plenty of things on which money is better spent imho - new pick-ups for a guitar, mics, preamps, percussions - they all do more for me than yet another virtual vintage compressor.

TCB - Tea, Cats, Books...
#2
dubdisciple
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 13:17:33 (permalink)
I'm still using Logic 9 in the studio and I do think it may be the most capable of creating the most genres out the box out of the various DAWS I use. My familiarity with Sonar and third party plugs compensates for that and thus it is my DAW of choice but if I ever went MAC at home I would go with Logic.
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Fleer
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 13:32:17 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby bapu 2014/09/06 16:34:13
Tell your friend to go Logic too ;)
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Rain
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 13:41:54 (permalink)
dubdisciple
I'm still using Logic 9 in the studio and I do think it may be the most capable of creating the most genres out the box out of the various DAWS I use. My familiarity with Sonar and third party plugs compensates for that and thus it is my DAW of choice but if I ever went MAC at home I would go with Logic.



Yep. It's all about making it do what you want it to do. Instant gratification is nice but knowing your tools is always a better option IMHO, whether it's Sonar or Cubase or Fruity Loops or Logic... 

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wizard71
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 13:48:53 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby bapu 2014/09/06 16:34:29
How else do we justify the huge amount of money we have wasted on plugins? :)

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#6
Sycraft
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 14:01:00 (permalink)
Nah, seems all my friends are like me and are stubborn about DAWs. We has what we likes and don't want to change. It's not that I don't like new toys, I'm just too comfortable with Sonar.
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dubdisciple
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 14:02:14 (permalink)
wizard71
How else do we justify the huge amount of money we have wasted on plugins? :)

The answer lies in the question. No need to actually justify. There is nothing inherently wrong with getting something just becaus you wanted it. If dealing with pissed spouse, by all means quote all the marketing hype and include nebulous numerical figures that will bore her/him into dropping the subject. :)
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dubdisciple
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 14:03:43 (permalink)
Rain..good point. Fruity loops is not my cup of tea but I have seen good results with people that go beyond using it as a sooped up drum machine.
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dubdisciple
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 14:04:35 (permalink)
Sycraft
Nah, seems all my friends are like me and are stubborn about DAWs. We has what we likes and don't want to change. It's not that I don't like new toys, I'm just too comfortable with Sonar.


Consider yourself lucky!
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dubdisciple
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 14:07:05 (permalink)
Fleer
Tell your friend to go Logic too ;)


That might work. I got some relatives to stop flooding me with daily emails trying to save my soul by flooding them with emails recruiting them into another religion. They got the point.
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Dave Modisette
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 14:07:07 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby mike_mccue 2014/09/05 10:19:31
Changing DAWs has helped me but I think a big part of that was having to adjust my approach to mixes and the process of learning that particular DAW led me in directions where I encountered a different level of professional and I had to step up my game a bit.  Having to search for answers to questions and tutorials was very enlightening.
 
That said, I believe that returning to any of my previous DAW products will benefit from this experience.

Dave Modisette ... rocks a Purrrfect Audio Studio Pro rig.

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My music.
... And of course, the Facebook page. 
#12
dubdisciple
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 14:10:19 (permalink)
Mod Bod
Changing DAWs has helped me but I think a big part of that was having to adjust my approach to mixes and the process of learning that particular DAW led me in directions where I encountered a different level of professional and I had to step up my game a bit.  Having to search for answers to questions and tutorials was very enlightening.
 
That said, I believe that returning to any of my previous DAW products will benefit from this experience.


I think like Rain, it sounds like you took the opportunity to approach your new DAW like a beginner and got away from the bad workflow habits you were using to get around frustration with previous DAW. I wish that was the case with my friend. His new love is studio one but I expect to hear the gospel of bitwig in about 6 months.
#13
Jim Roseberry
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 19:29:19 (permalink)
I like to think of G.A.S. as kind of a "hobby" within the greater interest of all things music.
Nice instruments to me are like a piece of art... and it's fun/interesting to explore new possibilities.
Of course, you can get lost in the process... and never really accomplish anything.  
I think there's a fine balance...
 
 

Best Regards,

Jim Roseberry
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rtucker55
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 20:31:05 (permalink)
Great points Jim,
 
Currently I am not getting anyplace because I don't know which New vst/vsti to start working with. My G.A.S is making Bank of America happy but I'm not sure I am getting as much out of it anymore. I really am getting burnt out on new plugs and currently there isn't anything else out there I even have interest in much less want...  I think I have exceeded that fine balance... 

Purrrfect Audio DAW here.  Wow!...
#15
bitflipper
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 22:14:56 (permalink)
Most of us came into this recording stuff from the standpoint of a musician. That, I think, is the source of much of our unrealistic expectations for music software.
 
Remember the first time you held a real Strat in your hands? Compared to your starter guitar from the pawnshop, it was like a seductive woman whispering Play Me! And you really could play things that would have made your fingers bleed on your old guitar.
 
Or, if you're a piano player like me, the first time you sat down at a Steinway concert grand and marveled at how light the action was, and how you could play really quietly or really loud. Your old beat-up upright at home just couldn't do that. If you tried to play it lightly it often made no sound at all.
 
In either case, your next thought was: how on earth am I going to come up with the money for one of these? It didn't even occur to you that "making do" with what you already had was a viable option. 
 
We grew up thinking that expensive instruments were better, that new instruments would inspire creativity and improve our playing. Those beliefs are mostly true.Unfortunately, they don't translate to software. A new EQ or compressor is probably not going to make your mixes sound better. A different DAW will not inspire better compositions. Another synthesizer isn't going to be your ticket to sonic nirvana. Music is all about taking the sounds that are already around you and assembling them into something new. 
 
So why was an image of Pro-Q2 floating over my head when I woke up this morning, accompanied by the smooth voice of Dan Worrall saying "that's all I've got time for in this video"? Like the spirit of Yoda vanishing after only hinting at Luke's true destiny.


All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. 

My Stuff
#16
rtucker55
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/04 23:04:29 (permalink)
I do remember those days. The first real Guitar I got was a Gibson SG and I played that thing every spare minute I could find. It was the only guitar I had...  Then I wanted to play keyboards so I got a Hammond B3 and I played it every spare minute I had plus more. It was the only keyboard I had... I was a much better player in those days and could squeeze everything I could get out of them.
 
Now I spend more time trying to figure this stuff out than I do playing... Major step backwards.
 
But, You're also right about that Pro-Q2 cause it is Really Sweet. My New goto EQ! 

Purrrfect Audio DAW here.  Wow!...
#17
MachineClaw
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 10:23:10 (permalink)
Sonar X1 Pro, Sonar X2 Pro, Sonar X3 Pro, Ableton 8, Ableton 9 Suite, ProTools 10, ProTools 11, Cubase 7.5, Reason 7, FL Studio Signature Bundle.
 
I DON'T HAVE A DAW PROBLEM!!!!!!
 
okay, maybe I do.  But....but one of them HAS to have a "Make Music" button!  I just know it!
 
<<bangs head on desk>> okay, I admit it, I have a problem.  <<get's idea>>HEY maybe there  is a plugin or app to solve this problem!!!!  <<runs off to shop>>
#18
AT
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 11:22:05 (permalink)
I never really changed from Cakewalk or had a reason.  Back in the early days of DAWs, I groked it and never really saw a need to change with all the re-learning necessary.  Hell, I still don't know SONAR as well as I should.  I did really like P5, which was a great platform for electronic/loop music and could still record audio.  But Cake let that die, although they did incorporate a lot of the functions into SONAR.
 
And I've pretty much given up on new software effects.  The PC is about as good as it gets and works most of the time.  Soft synths - that is a different matter.  Still, I've got just about all I need and I have all the major synth types - VA, sample, FM, Additive, wavetable and granular.  Like Sonar, I'm still learning Alchemy, which does most of the above all by its lonesome.  I still get a kick out of new sounds/presets, like Heavocity's stuff.  Such is always good for inspiration and new songs.
 
What I do like is new analog hardware - I ain't a guitarist but a new hardware comp or preamp is where I'm putting money these days.  Digital saturation - blah.  Analog is where it is at for me.  My wife thinks I spend too much but I don't question her shoe-buying so we have peace on that front.
 
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#19
Sidroe
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 12:40:18 (permalink)
I have worked in Logic, Cubase, and Pro Tools extensively down through the years. When I was introduced to Pro Audio 9 back in the late 90s, Cake sank a hook in me. I have whenever and wherever possible worked with Cakewalk products. I have hung in there all this time and I do not see me jumping ship anytime soon. That being said, the statement I just made is dependent upon the Gibson/Tascam takeover. Time will tell what looms in the future but the last few years have been inspiring working with the X series.
I am, however, messing around with Mixbus 2, lusting for the version with MIDI and 64 bit and it makes me feel like I'm cheating on my wife! LOL!

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dubdisciple
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 13:54:49 (permalink)
I recall the difference when I started playing trumpet as a child when I moved to a betyer instrument. The tone was so much better that I practiced more.
#21
Starise
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 14:01:22 (permalink)
I like every new generation of Sonar better and better. Yeah it still has some of that old windows feel to it but the capabilities are there and the pluses far outweigh anything negative...so I don't really NEED to look at anything else and I don't especially WANT to work in anything else. I'm talking to some other musicians who use Reason...and they like it..can't win them over and don't want to try. We all have what we like I guess. Feature sets are so similar now that I question how much of a difference any of it makes in the final product. Get used to workflow and you're most of the way there.

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#22
Kroneborge
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 14:03:08 (permalink)
I will note that different workflows can force you to work in a different manner which might inspire new results. And there's definitely been synths that have inspired me. 
 
That being said it's easy to spend WAY to much time jumping from synth to synth, and never making much music.
 
Side note I never was much of a musician, every couple of years, I start to work on my keyboarding but get distracted, though I guess the same goes for my music production.  Stupid real life interfering with hobbies.  Where's that lotto ticket again...


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#23
dubdisciple
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 14:07:05 (permalink)
Life has a way of interfering with fun. My musicianship has slipped horribly over the years for the same reasons. Fortunately for me, I never have to perform live. 90% of music I make is for backing tracks for video.
#24
blindhorse
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 18:01:50 (permalink)
Let me say this about that....
 
  As a human, and a consumer, I am in a perpetual state of GAS.  However the extent of the GAS, whether it is a severe bloat or just a minor percolation, depends on my wants in relation to my needs.
For instance, when I come to the software forum I am in a profound state of GAS.  It can get mighty windy around here.  Sometimes I feel like I am watching a 24/7 fast food dollar menu cable channel...so many choices, so little time or money.
 
  As much as I want to get the “FF Pro Q2 super freekin magic... line in the sand difference maker,” I am at a loss as to how I could justify buying it considering that I do not want to live in poverty, nor do I wish to forgo sharing a portion of my meager earnings with family and friends. 
So, I am left with the available tools in Sonar.
 
  I love women, but as I have come to realize there is no universal perfect woman, I have also come to realize that there may be the “perfect woman for me.”
 
  The perfectness of my woman, in a large part, depends the perfectness of me, and my abilities to meet her needs and desires, both physically and emotionally.  The better I know her, and execute the moves I have learned, the stronger her love towards me will be.  We are symbiotic.
 
  Don’t get me wrong.  I do not believe woman are software, or that they are plug ins.  What I am trying to convey is that “like women,” plug ins need to be understood, and the learning should never stop.
 
Each plug in has specific characteristics that make them sing.  It is dependent on the mix engineer to learn which buttons to press and knobs to turn that will achieve the desired result, be it earth shattering or smooth.
 
   I have a friend who drives a Porsche.  When I see that car I nearly lose my mind.  People fawn over him when they see that car.  He can get into and out of situations because of people’s perceptions about the car, which they transfer to his personae.  Ultimately though, it is just a car. 
 
   On the other hand, I drive a very old car. It starts every time.  I don’t have to park at the far end of the lot for fear of getting a ding, and the cost insurance is much less.  Of course, no one fawns over me, but people do comment on the frugality and practicality of using what I “have” to get me from point A to point B.
 
   Plug ins are no more like cars than they are like women.  But learning what makes them tick, and makes their engine purr, is the holy grail for me.  I need to listen better, and tweak those parameters that make me one with the vibes.  Within and without, when you can do that...KAPOW...music.
 
the blind horse
#25
Rain
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 18:22:17 (permalink)
dubdisciple
I recall the difference when I started playing trumpet as a child when I moved to a betyer instrument. The tone was so much better that I practiced more.



I'm quite convinced that the piece of junk which was my first electric guitar severely hindered my progress and caused me to develop very very and habits, some of which took me years and even decades to reverse. Likewise, not having an amp for years and then only a uber cheap radio shack so-called amp didn't help. 
 
On the other hand, all those years fighting against my ridicule set up probably helped me build determination and taught me a lot. I've earned every little scrape of progress that I made the hard way, which made it all the more significant.
 

TCB - Tea, Cats, Books...
#26
stevec
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 18:25:53 (permalink)
Nice post and big ole +1.   I drive a 2001 Saturn wagon with about 180K miles so I can identify.        But I'd rather have Komplete than put that $$ towards new car savings because I believe I can get better "mileage" from Komplete.   And I already have, many times over.   But it's also the only major software purchase I've made over the last six months.   And it'll take a lot more time before I've learned it's ins and outs.
 
 
BTW.... I'm really surprised there haven't been more posts commenting about this thread's title.   Y'all are missing a lot of opportunities...   
 

SteveC
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#27
Eddie TX
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 18:54:35 (permalink)
While it's always good to become proficient with the tools you have, steady improvements in technology over time mean better tools.  Not that they'll automatically make your mixes better, but advancements in GUI design, efficient resource usage, and stability tend to make modern tools more enjoyable to use, letting us focus on the music rather than the tool.  Good tools enhance the creative process, or at least don't impede it.  They don't make you wonder whether they'll crash or act weird or gobble up your CPU.  Worrying about that kind of thing is a real buzzkill when it comes to creating music, at least it is for me. 
 
That's why products like Pro-Q are, in my view, worth the asking price.  It won't instantly transform a mix to sound noticeably better, but it might make the process more enjoyable and less frustrating.  Thus many of us like to try out these new tools to see if we like them better than what we've been using ... sometimes, the search is rewarding.  In any case, it's usually fun to give the latest plugin a test drive -- a hobby unto itself, as Jim mentioned -- we're not unlike automotive enthusiasts who check out the latest models, go to car shows, spend time on forums, and read magazines comparing all the contenders packing the newest tech.
 
The plugin market is a fascinating one, very dynamic, with new players appearing all the time, including disruptors like Valhalla, Klanghelm, ToneBoosters, HoRNet, OverTone, and other independent developers who make high-quality products and sell them at prices anyone can afford.  This makes plugin shootouts fun, to see the scrappy Davids go up against the established Goliaths and hold their own, if not win the match.  There's something satisfying about seeing the tool you paid twenty bucks for slay that giant that sells for hundreds ... hurrah for the little guy! 
 
Anyway, let me stop rambling and thank all those who contribute to this forum.  It's been a great place to exchange info and opinions about these bits of software that make it possible to create things that used to take thousands and thousands of dollars to make.  Fun times, friends ...
 
Cheers,
Eddie
 

Sonar X3 Producer / Win 10 
The future exists in all directions.
#28
cclarry
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 19:06:40 (permalink)
I'm not friends with GAS...I AM GAS...

I feed the fire and make it burn...and burn...and burn...


#29
ShellstaX
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Re: Friends With GAS 2014/09/05 20:09:24 (permalink)
7 stages of Gear Acquisition Syndrome (according to MusicRadar):
 
1. Dissatisfaction
2. Desire
3. Research
4. Purchase
5. Guilt
6. Acceptance
7. Relapse
#30
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