Amicus717
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/25 18:57:56
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I always understood the risk in buying a lifetime membership. I had no illusions that this was only of value for as long as Cakewalk was a living business - and the end could come without warning, as it sometimes does (especially in the software industry). But I figured it was inexpensive enough that the risk was worth it if the software continued on for a year or two -- and it would be the deal of the century if it lasted another 30. I feel I got my money's worth out of it, and while it is impossible to know for sure, I honestly don't think the deal was offered in bad faith. I think it was an attempt to keep Cakewalk afloat by taking a risk with the revenue model. Other companies offer lifetime memberships (as illustrated above), and it works. Whatever Cakewalk had been doing before was clearly not working, so something new was needed, and I think the subscription based revenue stream combined with lifetime memberships for the devoted (and presumably, charging for accessory add-ons later) was a perfectly valid approach.
post edited by Amicus717 - 2017/11/25 19:49:48
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Anderton
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/25 19:44:59
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☄ Helpfulby snookerc 2017/11/25 19:49:26
AdamGrossmanLG
someone offering you a lifetime product for a few hundred dollars, and we don't stop to think (how can they pay developers for the rest of your life with this amount of money. I smelt a fish back when they offered this garbage.
Disgusting. Truly disgusting.
I can assure you that Andrew Rossa had a well-thought-out plan that took into account Platinum renewal revenue that would be lost (remember, Platinum owners were only part of Cakmewalk's clientele). When he left the company a little over a year ago, his plan was jettisoned. My personal opinion is that was a big mistake. Lifetime updates are not that uncommon, and they don't have to be a problem. When was the last time you paid anything for Windows 10? Companies make their money from add-ons designed to appeal to their base, like Image-Line has done. The add-ons either never materialized, or were given away instead of made available for sale. It wasn't Lifetime Updates that killed Cakewalk.
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chuckebaby
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/25 20:00:31
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Anderton
It wasn't Lifetime Updates that killed Cakewalk.
Then what did ? (I ask this in a respectful way)
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guitz
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/25 20:03:52
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It worked, until it didn't. Btw, was I the ONLY one who thought 'lifetime' strictly meant the USERS lifetime and NOT the softwares lifetime? lol
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kitekrazy1
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/25 20:44:12
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AdamGrossmanLG
how can any company implement such a model? lifetime updates for so cheap?
I would say buying Sonar monthly was the downfall. To outsiders it was labeled as a subscription. Some of the high end apps are often subscriptions like Avid Media Composer, Magix was the first to offer their expensive high end DAW as a subscription. Sonar wasn't in that league. As for Image Line they do a lot of things right. They are a small staff. Cakewalk had lots of people. Maybe they should have taken the staff view more seriously. You can real all over the web where people went to Cubase for a better staff view.
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Kev999
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/25 21:54:23
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The lifetime offer was good value and I'm certainly glad that I signed up for it. Right now, it would have been disappointing not to have all the final versions of the software available.
The current situation sucks big time for several reasons. But the lifetime offer is not one of them.
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bsantini99
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/25 22:46:22
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I don't know about the lifetime updates being a good value. Most companies charge $99 at most for an annual upgrade and I think the lifetime updates only lasted about 18 months or so. So at $199 you paid a premium over this unless you were one of the lucky few the got it for $99. What ticked me off most about the campaign was that I was expecting new add ons that I would be willing to pay money for. Instead it was just the lifetime updates to fuel the mac development and keep the company afloat. Should of kept the existing model and worked on offering new products. I knew this would be the death knell when it was revealed.
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Kev999
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/26 08:00:25
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bsantini99
I don't know about the lifetime updates being a good value. Most companies charge $99 at most for an annual upgrade and I think the lifetime updates only lasted about 18 months or so. So at $199 you paid a premium over this unless you were one of the lucky few the got it for $99...I knew this would be the death knell when it was revealed.
I paid $229 (Aus$) and I considered this to be worth it, despite being aware at the time that the future of Sonar may be in doubt. I don't regret it. Had I not gone for it I would be kicking myself right now.
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subtlearts
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/26 13:59:37
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☄ Helpfulby tlw 2017/11/26 16:16:39
chuckebaby
Anderton
It wasn't Lifetime Updates that killed Cakewalk.
Then what did ?
(I ask this in a respectful way)
Obviously I can't say with any authority but my guess is, just the misfortune of having come under Gibson's control at a time when they are themselves on the rocks. Nothing more, nothing less. As much as Sonar has been hugely important for us, the users, and the Cakewalk staff, it was never more than a blip on the radar for Gibson, and since they are in full freakout mode it makes more sense for them to drop it and focus on whatever it is they think is going to pull them out of the tailspin they're in. To us it's a disaster and a senseless waste, to them it's just dropping something that isn't going to make much of a difference to their situation one way or another, and the suits have decided it's easier/better to 'focus' the business, trim fat where it's not going to hurt them much in the grand scheme of things, cut losses (if indeed CW has been operating at a loss, which it may or may not have been, we're all just speculating here) and move on. The waste, impact on users and collateral damage to reputation are likely just calculated risks and unlikely to impact them much. Sad but true. But man, what a waste. I'll live, it's not the end of the world or my ability to make music, but it's just an enormous drag.
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chuckebaby
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/26 14:08:14
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subtlearts
chuckebaby
Anderton
It wasn't Lifetime Updates that killed Cakewalk.
Then what did ?
(I ask this in a respectful way)
Obviously I can't say with any authority but my guess is, just the misfortune of having come under Gibson's control at a time when they are themselves on the rocks. Nothing more, nothing less. As much as Sonar has been hugely important for us, the users, and the Cakewalk staff, it was never more than a blip on the radar for Gibson, and since they are in full freakout mode it makes more sense for them to drop it and focus on whatever it is they think is going to pull them out of the tailspin they're in. To us it's a disaster and a senseless waste, to them it's just dropping something that isn't going to make much of a difference to their situation one way or another, and the suits have decided it's easier/better to 'focus' the business, trim fat where it's not going to hurt them much in the grand scheme of things, cut losses (if indeed CW has been operating at a loss, which it may or may not have been, we're all just speculating here) and move on. The waste, impact on users and collateral damage to reputation are likely just calculated risks and unlikely to impact them much. Sad but true. But man, what a waste. I'll live, it's not the end of the world or my ability to make music, but it's just an enormous drag.
Nicely said Sub. I don't feel people lost any money on the lifetime updates because they paid for around a years worth of updates and that's what they got. However I do feel this was a bad move. Aimed at generating quick cash for a company that is deep in dept. I also really like Andrew Rosa but how does he leave cakewalk merely weeks after he pushing lifetime updates on that very large thread started in may 2016. I think we can all see things a bit clearer now like Support being very slow to get back to its users (in some cases didn't get back to users at all) we could see it here on the forums with users complaining. which in my opinion meant Cakewalk was down to a skeleton crew. The writing was on the wall.
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BJN
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/26 14:34:25
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While it is a shock to be invested in Sonar and have the rug pulled from underneath us; it is understandable to be upsetting for most of us. But it is not like we suddenly don't have a DAW anymore.
On a light note. Remember when you would upgrade every year and there was a patch or two to fix a few bugs in the interim.
It is a bit like that now.
Sonar is still a very well featured DAW and wont go out of date for a year or two.
I have heard there are still those who keep their Atari's going!
Might as well get some more value out of it for a while.
And set up a dedicated fully backed up PC off the grid to keep it until there really are way better DAWs to migrate to.
We can still stay connected and help each other out.
------------------------------------------------------- Magic: when you feel inspired to create which in turn inspires more creation. And the corollary: if magic happens inspiration might flog it to death with numerous retakes. Bart Nettle
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subtlearts
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/26 14:45:44
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Indeed, and many of us have indicated our intention to continue using it as long as it can be made to work and authorized, or until something else supercedes it organically. My own point was just that I think it's highly unlikely there was any malicious intent involved at any level of this - I've seen a number of angry rants suggesting that Gibson/Cakewalk knew this was going to happen ages ago, and made a cynical play to extract some cash via the lifetime updates offer. I just don't see it. I think this was a recent decision, made along the lines of what I wrote above, and that we're just the unlucky ones who are affected (along with of course the other major stakeholders in CW, the employees). It sucks, but I highly doubt it was premeditated in any way. It just happened. Sometimes there's no secret dastardly plot, just people who have to make business decisions and who have very different priorities than we do.
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Leee
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/26 14:48:48
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The lifetime subscription offer was a good deal for customers, and brought in some quick cash for the company.
It was a win-win situation. As others have mentioned, even if I got 12 months of updates after purchasing the lifetime subscription, I got my moneys worth. I do not regret it at all. And if I had to do it again, knowing what I know now, I probably STILL would have taken the offer.
Lee Shapirowww.soundclick.com/leeshapiro Welcome BandLab and thank you for giving Cakewalk and Sonar a new lease on life.
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gswitz
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/26 15:06:56
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I feel duped, but my company makes me feel a little less foolish.
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SupaReels Music
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Re: How Dumb Were We?
2017/11/26 15:53:40
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Well after reading these and many more comments I, like so many, kind of knew with all the problems of keeping a company in the black is frigging hard! Cakewalk Sonar is a really great programme and I reckon some of what we see here is the big boys not supporting sales of this product, so many times when I've told people I use Sonar Platinum their response is at best cold … If it had been advertised with the revere that say Pro Tools or Cubase etc had, I really feel Cakewalk would have been a successful . I will keep this for as long as it works … and I bet that will be a long time ... Thankyou Cakewalk for the ability to write and produce my music as a pro!! Fingers crossed for the future of the people who made it happen
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