Helpful ReplyHow Dumb Were We?

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AdamGrossmanLG
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2017/11/24 21:41:43 (permalink)

How Dumb Were We?

someone offering you a lifetime product for a few hundred dollars, and we don't stop to think (how can they pay developers for the rest of your life with this amount of money.  I smelt a fish back when they offered this garbage.
 
Disgusting.  Truly disgusting.
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SiberianKhatru59
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 21:48:07 (permalink)
PFD, apparently.

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TranceCanada
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 21:48:40 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby snookerc 2017/11/25 19:49:50
That has nothing to do with it.  Imagine-Line has offered lifetime updates for as long as they've been around and they are HUGE now, the majority of people using FL hasn't had to pay for it for quite some time now and they're doing great.  Plus from what I've been seeing there has been a huge amount of Sonar users that never did spring for the Lifetime updates either,  plus how many users never upgraded past X1, X2, or X3, they would never have to pay for anything more. 

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SimpleM
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 21:50:37 (permalink)
Yes, we were the usual gullible hopeful idiots. 
 
When Anderton got the boot, I started getting anxious that something dirty was afoot.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 21:54:17 (permalink)
how can any company implement such a model?  lifetime updates for so cheap?
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jeff oliver
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 21:57:23 (permalink)
I think eyebrows were raised because most were willing (including me) to keep paying yearly. I suspected that the level of upgrades would go down to what it did. The first year was fantastic! And for a company to say "Naw, just pay once and you're good for life." I probably would have jumped myself but had already seen the decline in the montly upgrades. WE were called all sorts of names... Today is not a good day for me. 52yrs old and got my studio just right, for me anyway. Springing for studio one and the studiolive iii, may as well, right? I feel very sorry for those who just paid their money.

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Rasure
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 21:59:28 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby jude77 2017/11/24 22:29:05
I purchased the lifetime updates as soon as it was announced, I don`t regret it either, how could I for only £87.66

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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 21:59:37 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby BobF 2017/11/24 22:04:53
Not dumb at all.....at the time, lots of people questioned what was happening.  But the math was really simple: if SONAR lasted for more than a year, the lifetime subscription would pay for itself.  And it did.
 
 
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John T
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 22:01:31 (permalink)
I never thought the lifetime updates were a necessary or smart move for Cakewalk, but there's more sense to it than might initially appear to be. They always said that Platinum users made up a minority of the user base, and I'm guessing the calculation was "we can raise some cash now from long termers, who are the most likely buyers of multiple add-ons, and everyone walks away happy". Sadly, it didn't turn out that way, but I don't think it was either stupid or cynical.

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John
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 22:09:10 (permalink)
FL Studio has had life time updates for as long as I can remember.

Best
John
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dubdisciple
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 22:18:17 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby fresh101 2017/11/25 01:31:02
Fl has had lifetime updates from day 1
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fitzj
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 22:25:06 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby jude77 2017/11/24 22:29:31
Not a problem as I got two years for my money so I break even.
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Hangdog Cat
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 22:25:43 (permalink)
I'm not happy about Sonar's demise any more than you, but I figure I would have paid all or most of that "lifetime" money to some other DAW developer in updates along the way, so I'm more or less even in dollar terms.
 
Was Gibson unethical in making the "lifetime" offer, in view of what they probably knew at the time but were not revealing? IMO, yes.
 
But to me the true disaster is the time I've invested in Sonar. Some of that knowledge (the basic concepts) will transfer to my new DAW (Cubase), but not all. Not the specifics. I'll have to learn to walk all over again before I can get up to speed. If I had chosen Cubase from the start, this "Sonar is dead" thing would be just a vague rumble off in the distance.
 
Oh well, crap happens. I'm trying to view it as an opportunity to learn something new.
 
But I'll sure miss Sonar. It was a good ride while it lasted. People will be discussing and debating its demise long after the program has stopped working.

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bsantini99
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 22:39:30 (permalink)
John
FL Studio has had life time updates for as long as I can remember.


That was one of the reasons I decided to skip the Sonar lifetime updates and go with Fl Studio since it was included in the price and didn't have to pay extra. I was able to pick up the signature edition for $178 over at JRR on a sale, so saved a few bucks in the process. I knew Gibson was struggling and smelled a rat with the lifetime updates offer. I also since won a contest over at Imageline and got three free plugins of my choice. I feel they treat their community better with a lot of giveaways. They have one of the largest user bases and I feel a lot more secure with them, and as a big plus, they are not owned by Gibson.
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Leadfoot
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 22:51:26 (permalink)
I'm running Windows 7 on an offline computer. I will continue to run Sonar Platinum. I've got Mixbus 4 and 32C as well, but Sonar is going to be my DAW for as long as it runs, which should be a long time.
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TranceCanada
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 23:25:11 (permalink)
bsantini99
John
FL Studio has had life time updates for as long as I can remember.


That was one of the reasons I decided to skip the Sonar lifetime updates and go with Fl Studio since it was included in the price and didn't have to pay extra. I was able to pick up the signature edition for $178 over at JRR on a sale, so saved a few bucks in the process. I knew Gibson was struggling and smelled a rat with the lifetime updates offer. I also since won a contest over at Imageline and got three free plugins of my choice. I feel they treat their community better with a lot of giveaways. They have one of the largest user bases and I feel a lot more secure with them, and as a big plus, they are not owned by Gibson.




When was there a sale on it? I've been waiting for it to go on sale

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SandlinJohn
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 23:53:46 (permalink)
I took the lifetime update and as a result I have the most current version of SONAR PLatinum, which my status says Expiration: (infinity) Status: Owned.... So, since I doubt the few of us that bought the Lifetime Updates significantly altered the income status of SONAR, since apparently few of us took the opportunity, it appears that SONAR was on life-support already and little we did as customers would save it by then.

I was oblivious to the frailty of the company then and only when Craig Anderton split the scene did I realize how much was amiss. I held out hope, though, since the Bakers seemed confident that good things were coming.
 
We were too optimistic.
post edited by SandlinJohn - 2017/11/25 00:22:52
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SandlinJohn
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/24 23:57:00 (permalink)
As a side note, I may have been the last to purchase from the Cakewalk store. I bought the PDF of Anderton's "The Big Book of SONAR Tips" and then waited for my download link in Purchased Products. Before it came, the store was offline with nothing in my Purchased Products (only a few minutes after my purchase). Fortunately the next morning, in my Purchased Products, the book was in the list and a download link was available, which I happily used. 
 
#18
mumpcake
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 00:09:30 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Del 2017/11/25 22:30:33
fitzj
Not a problem as I got two years for my money so I break even.


I also got more than I put in.
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denverdrummer
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 00:10:12 (permalink)
That was why I never did the lifetime updates. It seemed to me they were trying to get money to pay for the Mac version. In the past under Roland and before I always 2thought Sonar' s upgrades were reasonable, but after the Gibson buyout it just got worse and worse. Paying money for a known upgrade is one thing. Paying for future promises of what was essentially vapor ware is not. I feel bad for the folks that just renewed their subscription. Really Gibson should offer rebates but considering how they run their company, I wouldn't hold my breath.

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rmfegley
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 00:24:53 (permalink)
I'm not saying this was done with foreknowledge, but at the time there were Gibson/Cakewalk employees who basically argued "Cakewalk has been around for thirty years, anything is possible, but there is no reason to think anything is amiss here". This was basically my thinking as well, and I fully intended to buy the lifetime update plan, but some unforeseen emergency expenses cropped up and I was unable. Had I done so in Dec, at the last opportunity, I would have paid more for the updates I received in 2017 than I did with the monthly plan. I had purchased on a special offer of $14.99 a month, which makes my total for updates I received in 2017 $149.90 as opposed to $199 I would have paid for the lifetime plan, which turned out to be 10 months (assumiing purchased in 12/17.
post edited by rmfegley - 2017/11/25 01:12:38

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#21
rj davis
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 01:03:41 (permalink)
I knew the future was shaky when the lifetime updates was offered, seemingly too cheap.  But paid it anyway, if just to support the strategy.  Saddened, but not surprised by where we are.  Very sorry for folks who got sucked in late, hope Gibson makes things right by you.  But I'm ok...

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ØSkald
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 01:16:30 (permalink)
Our petition to Microsoft to rescue Cakewalk out of Gibson!
 
Cakewalk and later Sonar has been our favorite DAW (Digital Audio Workstation) for many years. It is the home we go to when being creative. From writing songs, record songs, mixing songs to master songs and albums. We deeply love Cakewalk and Sonar.
 
Gibson is now stopping developing and service of Cakewalk and Sonar. So they are basically giving it up.
 
Dear Microsoft.
 
Please rescue Cakewalk and Sonar out of Gibson. You can make Sonar a system like Office and Office 365. And Music Creator to an app in the store. And please make it under insider, so that we, the users can have a say in the development. You can rebrand it if you want, but please make it backward compatible with current Sonar, Music Creator and pluggin base.
 
https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/microsoft-please-rescue-cakewalk-and-sonar-out-of
 
PS! I don't give up yet. Please sign and share on Facebook an Twitter!

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#23
rmfegley
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 01:19:56 (permalink)
I didn't get worried until Craig Anderton announced that he had left (been sacked by) Gibson. Somehow that seemed like a warning, as he had been one of Cakewalk's most credible advocates.

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#24
Unknowen
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 01:26:21 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Karyn 2017/11/25 01:29:39
We got so much stuff for the cash we put in... and it all still works...
So what if it still has a few bugs, I've worked around them for almost 3 years now with SPlat.
its all good...
I'm going to watch the DAW world for now and see who comes up with the features I like with SPlat because the Bakers will land someplace DAWish... I hope...
 
Peace!
 
 

Hay look,
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#25
35mm
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 01:38:37 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Del 2017/11/25 22:31:52
Truth is, I did think about it but couldn't resist! I got my years worth so I won't complain about that.

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#26
wmountney
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 01:46:48 (permalink)
AdamGrossmanLG
how can any company implement such a model?  lifetime updates for so cheap?




Image-Line does it with FL Studio by regularly coming out with new plugins and add-ons for sale.  The base program gets free updates, but those updates will not normally include any new effects, synths, sample libraries, etc. - just updates to the core program functionality.  As long as they keep making new add-on items that people want to buy, they have continual income.
 
When Cakewalk first announced the lifetime updates, I thought they would adopt a similar model.  It may have been their intention, but I guess there wasn't enough time to find out.  More likely it was just Gibson trying to get some quick cash.
 
Anyway, in my case, I paid $99 for the lifetime upgrades in May 2016.  If I hadn't done so, I would have had to pay $99 to renew my yearly subscription in January 2017, which I would have done, so the lifetime updates cost me nothing beyond the paltry interest I could have made keeping the $99 in the bank for seven months.  I guess people who didn't get the best price on the lifetime updates or who renewed their subscription on a different timetable may have gotten a worse deal, though.

Bill Mountney
#27
Mosvalve
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 01:55:29 (permalink)
AdamGrossmanLG
someone offering you a lifetime product for a few hundred dollars, and we don't stop to think (how can they pay developers for the rest of your life with this amount of money.  I smelt a fish back when they offered this garbage.
 
Disgusting.  Truly disgusting.


Somewhere in the fine print it said "Cakewalks Life Time"

BobV 
 
 
 
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#28
AT
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 04:12:45 (permalink)
Before there was FL Studio there was Fruityloops.  Same deal - one time buy and free updates forever.  Until Fruityloops became FL Studio.  Same program, new name, new buy in.  That is what I figured would happen with SONAR.  Fruityloops was well worth the money, and FL Studio it is still a solid program from what I understand, tho I don't use it.  It was one of the funnest beat makers around.
#29
mudgel
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Re: How Dumb Were We? 2017/11/25 18:33:45 (permalink)
Ain’t 20:20 hind sight a wonderful thing.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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