Helpful ReplyI understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT

Page: < 12 Showing page 2 of 2
Author
mixmkr
Max Output Level: -43.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3169
  • Joined: 2007/03/05 22:23:43
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/08 19:59:13 (permalink)
Good luck with your new system.  Jim builds some of the best on the planet, imo.  I know you were concerned about noise, and my StudioCat is VERY quiet.  You'll be very pleased I am sure...and potentially shocked how quiet it really is.  I have a cabinet I made to keep mine in, but I never shut the door, because it's so quiet!.  It's also running rock solid with SPlat.  I have yet to crash using the program on his computer build.  With X3, I might have had two crashes over the year I've had the computer....and I think that was more soundcard related, because that's what locked up.

And I agree with the "no explanation" needed.   I'm on the same page with everyone about the CCC, but really don't like to see other people (not you) bashing in such a sophomoric way. 

I'm sure you're excited!!

some tunes: --->        www.masonharwoodproject.bandcamp.com 
StudioCat i7 4770k 3.5gHz, 16 RAM,  Sonar Platinum, CD Arch 5.2, Steinberg UR-44
videos--->https://www.youtube.com/user/mixmkr
 
#31
BobF
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8124
  • Joined: 2003/11/05 18:43:11
  • Location: Missouri - USA
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/08 21:00:05 (permalink)
I checked here - no openings for self-appointed forum cops.  Sorry.
 
OTOH, I am very encouraged to see that they are hiring!!

Bob  --
Angels are crying because truth has died ...
Illegitimi non carborundum
--
Studio One Pro / i7-6700@3.80GHZ, 32GB Win 10 Pro x64
Roland FA06, LX61+, Fishman Tripleplay, FaderPort, US-16x08 + ARC2.5/Event PS8s 
Waves Gold/IKM Max/Nomad Factory IS3/K11U

#32
mixmkr
Max Output Level: -43.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3169
  • Joined: 2007/03/05 22:23:43
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/08 21:10:43 (permalink)


some tunes: --->        www.masonharwoodproject.bandcamp.com 
StudioCat i7 4770k 3.5gHz, 16 RAM,  Sonar Platinum, CD Arch 5.2, Steinberg UR-44
videos--->https://www.youtube.com/user/mixmkr
 
#33
Splat
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8672
  • Joined: 2010/12/29 15:28:29
  • Location: Mars.
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/08 21:17:22 (permalink)
Glad to see it"s all water under the bridge.

Sell by date at 9000 posts. Do not feed.
@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

Sonar Platinum(64 bit),Win 8.1(64 bit),Saffire Pro 40(Firewire),Mix Control = 3.4,Firewire=VIA,Dell Studio XPS 8100(Intel Core i7 CPU 2.93 Ghz/16 Gb),4 x Seagate ST31500341AS (mirrored),GeForce GTX 460,Yamaha DGX-505 keyboard,Roland A-300PRO,Roland SPD-30 V2,FD-8,Triggera Krigg,Shure SM7B,Yamaha HS5.Maschine Studio+Komplete 9 Ultimate+Kontrol Z1.Addictive Keys,Izotope Nectar elements,Overloud Bundle,Geist.Acronis True Image 2014.
#34
tenfoot
Max Output Level: -53.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2186
  • Joined: 2015/01/22 18:12:07
  • Location: Qld, Australia
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/09 12:01:25 (permalink)
mixmkr
I use Acronis and it takes a couple minutes on my 95gig used, C drive,  to plop another image on an external.  And that's a total image, not an update.


You can back up 95gig of data to an external drive in 2 mins using Acronis? What is your external hard drive mixmkr? Gotta get me one!

Bruce.
 
Sonar Platinum 2017-09, Studio One 3.5.3, Win 10 x64, Quad core i7, RME Fireface, Behringer X32 Producer, Behringer X32 Rack, Presonus Faderport, Lemure Software Controller (Android), Enttec DMXIS VST lighting controller, Xtempo POK.
#35
mixmkr
Max Output Level: -43.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3169
  • Joined: 2007/03/05 22:23:43
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/09 19:55:38 (permalink)
Seagates and Maxtor but actually I typically go to another internal drive that came with my StudioCat and I don't recall the brand they used.  (my couple of minutes might be a couple, couple of minutes :-D...  but seriously, it's VERY fast).

some tunes: --->        www.masonharwoodproject.bandcamp.com 
StudioCat i7 4770k 3.5gHz, 16 RAM,  Sonar Platinum, CD Arch 5.2, Steinberg UR-44
videos--->https://www.youtube.com/user/mixmkr
 
#36
tenfoot
Max Output Level: -53.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2186
  • Joined: 2015/01/22 18:12:07
  • Location: Qld, Australia
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/09 20:05:14 (permalink)
mixmkr
Seagates and Maxtor but actually I typically go to another internal drive that came with my StudioCat and I don't recall the brand they used.  (my couple of minutes might be a couple, couple of minutes :-D...  but seriously, it's VERY fast).


Lol......yes. I thought it might be  several couples:) I too am a big fan of Acronis. I guess that compared to reloading everything it only seems like 2 mins!

Bruce.
 
Sonar Platinum 2017-09, Studio One 3.5.3, Win 10 x64, Quad core i7, RME Fireface, Behringer X32 Producer, Behringer X32 Rack, Presonus Faderport, Lemure Software Controller (Android), Enttec DMXIS VST lighting controller, Xtempo POK.
#37
YouDontHasToCallMeJohnson
Max Output Level: -76 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 703
  • Joined: 2014/09/26 11:23:12
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/09 21:52:49 (permalink)
I installed ALL the programs of SPLAT because I want CCC to know what updates I need.
 
The installations did not respect the paths set in X3.
 
One of the most annoying results is the paths (ie DP) were reset for presets and programs and samples, that I had fixed the registry to find on the D drive.
 
So now lots of progs need to be adjusted to find the correct samples.
And I have had to copy my saved progs to the buried/hidden DP preset folder to reduce my use of short loud words.
 
After years of pros advising everybody to keep the OS disk small, and put samples,... on separate drives it would seem that the software publishers would have gotten a clue.  Installing AD was a real issue because their installer would NOT recognize where I wanted to put it.
 
And because the AD installer does not automatically create a 64 bit folder it would not install.
 
And who thought putting VST3 files into the common\VST folder is a good idea? A place NO ONE would ever suspect and therefore never backup.
 
Too many folders in too many hidden/buried folders.
 
Well, don't get me started.
 
#38
tenfoot
Max Output Level: -53.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2186
  • Joined: 2015/01/22 18:12:07
  • Location: Qld, Australia
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/09 22:57:24 (permalink)
Whilst I agree that CCC has some issues, what have we really lost? If you know enough to want to keep your c: drive "lean and mean" and have your samples on a separate drive, you will also know that you can still do a manual install and direct it wherever you like, as we all have been doing for years. I still hear about updates from this forum before I see them in CCC! Perhaps we are obsessing too much over the novelty of little green lights?:)

Bruce.
 
Sonar Platinum 2017-09, Studio One 3.5.3, Win 10 x64, Quad core i7, RME Fireface, Behringer X32 Producer, Behringer X32 Rack, Presonus Faderport, Lemure Software Controller (Android), Enttec DMXIS VST lighting controller, Xtempo POK.
#39
arachnaut
Max Output Level: -67 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1168
  • Joined: 2007/05/05 17:24:33
  • Location: Sunnyvale, CA USA
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/09 23:18:22 (permalink)
YouDontHasToCallMeJohnson
...
After years of pros advising everybody to keep the OS disk small, and put samples,... on separate drives it would seem that the software publishers would have gotten a clue. ...

And who thought putting VST3 files into the common\VST folder is a good idea? A place NO ONE would ever suspect and therefore never backup.
...



1) Yes, we really need the OS and installers to have better support for putting resources in the best places in a system with SSDs and a mix of hard drives. It's about time something serious be done about this.
 
2) The VST 3 spec states the preferred locations:
 
"On Windows platform, the host application expects VST 3 Plug-ins to be located in:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Priority Location Path Comment
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 Global /Program Files/Common Files/VST3/ native bitdepth: 32bit Plug-in on 32bit OS, 64bit on 64bit OS)
1 Global /Program Files (x86)/Common Files/VST3/ 32bit Plug-ins on 64bit Windows
2 Application $APPFOLDER/VST3/
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Note: The host recursively scans these folders at startup in this order (Global/Application). "

- Jim Hurley -
SONAR Platinum - x64  - Windows 10 Pro 
ASUS P8P67 PRO Rev 3.0;  Core i7-2600K@4.4GHz; 16 GB G.SKILL Ripjaws X;
GeForce GT 740; Saffire Pro14 MixControl 3.7; Axiom 61
64-Bit audio, SR: 48kHz, ASIO 256 samples latency, Rec/Play I/O Buffers 512k, Total Round Trip Latency 13 ms, Pow-r 3 dither 
#40
vintagevibe
Max Output Level: -51 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2446
  • Joined: 2003/12/15 21:45:06
  • Location: Atlanta, Ga
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/10 00:32:54 (permalink)
Anderton
vintagevibe
mixmkr
  Seems I NEVER hear people screaming about Windows Updates.  


Windows file belong on the C drive.  Data files do not.



I definitely agree with that, if for no other reason than you can just back up an entire data drive in one fell swoop.




And keep your system drive images a manageable size.
#41
mudgel
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 12010
  • Joined: 2004/08/13 00:56:05
  • Location: Linton Victoria (Near Ballarat)
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/10 05:29:19 (permalink)
arachnaut
YouDontHasToCallMeJohnson
...
After years of pros advising everybody to keep the OS disk small, and put samples,... on separate drives it would seem that the software publishers would have gotten a clue. ...

And who thought putting VST3 files into the common\VST folder is a good idea? A place NO ONE would ever suspect and therefore never backup.
...



1) Yes, we really need the OS and installers to have better support for putting resources in the best places in a system with SSDs and a mix of hard drives. It's about time something serious be done about this.
 
2) The VST 3 spec states the preferred locations:
 
"On Windows platform, the host application expects VST 3 Plug-ins to be located in:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Priority Location Path Comment
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 Global /Program Files/Common Files/VST3/ native bitdepth: 32bit Plug-in on 32bit OS, 64bit on 64bit OS)
1 Global /Program Files (x86)/Common Files/VST3/ 32bit Plug-ins on 64bit Windows
2 Application $APPFOLDER/VST3/
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Note: The host recursively scans these folders at startup in this order (Global/Application). "


That's one of the weird things about the CCC. It's the first installer I've ever encountered that gives you an option to change the default installation path for VST3. Even if in its development the CCC next allowed you to download the installers and then ran them as if you had selected the installer yourself to give you advanced options.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

STUDIO: Win 10 Pro x64, SPlat & CbB x64,
PC: ASUS Z370-A, INTEL i7 8700k, 32GIG DDR4 2400, OC 4.7Ghz.
Storage: 7 TB SATA III, 750GiG SSD & Samsung 500 Gig 960 EVO NVMe M.2.
Monitors: Adam A7X, JBL 10” Sub.
Audio I/O & DSP Server: DIGIGRID IOS & IOX.
Screen: Raven MTi + 43" HD 4K TV Monitor.
Keyboard Controller: Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88.
#42
GLG
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 38
  • Joined: 2013/11/17 05:50:28
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/14 03:31:01 (permalink)
Paul P
 
TreeSizeFree is great for finding out what's taking up all the space.
 



Thanks very much for this link. After reading about the product on their website, I downloaded and installed it, and discovered that the pagefile.sys and hiberfil.sys were gobbling up over 26GB of my 128GB SSD C: drive. After much Googling and reading, I managed to get 22 GB of it back!
Also, just a comment re this thread. I can never understand why people need to turn intelligent threads into pissing competitions. Surely we can agree to disagree with respect.
 
Greg
 
#43
GregGraves
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 282
  • Joined: 2014/11/14 11:32:14
  • Location: florida usa
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/15 06:03:43 (permalink)
I have one drive, a terabyte Western Digital, with a fixed pagefile of 1024.  If you calculate the throughput of that drive, it is like a zillion tracks, more than you'd ever use.  The chokepoint [in my experience] is the CPU, not the drive, so methinks you guys are "getting musician" on me.  One drive means I can make a single system-image once a month with Win7 Backup utility, and run Richcopy to scan the whole drive for changes whenever I get paranoid.  Since Richcopy simply makes a copy, I don't have to worry about some damn backup software's proprietary file structure nonsense.  I have successfully recovered from multiple hard drive failures.  I never have dropouts that I cannot attribute to the CPU running out of steam.
 
* "getting musician", transitive phrase, attitude best exemplified in the movie Spinal Tap as regard the Marshall amp's ability to "go to 11".

I am "Five Foot Wall" on Spotify, Deezer, etc.  Platinum, Windows 7 64bit, AMD FX-6100 hex-core @3.8ghz, 8 gig ram (never use more than 5 gigs), Delta 44, UM-2
[Note: join date reflects inability to migrate old account to new forum]
 
 
https://greggraves.bandcamp.com/track/whatcha-gonna-do
https://greggraves.bandcamp.com/track/true-believer-man
 
#44
Paul P
Max Output Level: -48.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2685
  • Joined: 2012/12/08 17:15:47
  • Location: Montreal
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/15 09:47:58 (permalink)
GregGraves
I have one drive, a terabyte Western Digital, with a fixed pagefile of 1024.  If you calculate the throughput of that drive, it is like a zillion tracks, more than you'd ever use.



This might be true if you computer was doing nothing but tracking.  I don't know how often or under what circumstances Windows accesses the OS drive, but the minute it does it puts a stick in the wheels of your recording by hijacking the hard drive head and moving it somewhere else.  Once Windows is done, you then have to bring the head back to where it was to continue your recording.  If you have a separate drive for tracking, and it's not fragmented, its head can hopefully remain positioned for recording.  If you're recording multiple tracks I imagine the head is already dancing around writing the various track files even without Windows (or other background tasks) interrupting.  For similar reasons it's a lot faster to move large amounts of data from one drive to another than within a same drive.
 
If you look at the file transfer rates while you're saving something to disc, you'll see that you get nowhere near the ideal throughput for a drive.  You'll also see that it's a lot faster to move stuff between drives.

Sonar Platinum [2017.10], Win7U x64 sp1, Xeon E5-1620 3.6 GHz, Asus P9X79WS, 16 GB ECC, 128gb SSD, HD7950, Mackie Blackjack
#45
GregGraves
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 282
  • Joined: 2014/11/14 11:32:14
  • Location: florida usa
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/15 11:57:21 (permalink)
You must be talking about recording 4 or more tracks at once.  I do everything myself so never record more than a stereo track, one at a time.  By functioning solo, I find that I am never late to a session, and can drink just as many beers as I want without anyone giving me grief about being so blotto.

I am "Five Foot Wall" on Spotify, Deezer, etc.  Platinum, Windows 7 64bit, AMD FX-6100 hex-core @3.8ghz, 8 gig ram (never use more than 5 gigs), Delta 44, UM-2
[Note: join date reflects inability to migrate old account to new forum]
 
 
https://greggraves.bandcamp.com/track/whatcha-gonna-do
https://greggraves.bandcamp.com/track/true-believer-man
 
#46
SilkTone
Max Output Level: -59.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1566
  • Joined: 2003/11/10 17:41:28
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/15 13:52:28 (permalink)
It is not just about being able to get X number of tracks playing back at the same time.  When you audition instruments, loading the samples can be slow with a slow drive. For instance, I originally installed Komplete 10 on a MD, but auditioning instruments was so slow that I usually just gave up after loading a few. Since I moved the samples to an SSD, auditioning instruments became much faster, and no longer feels like it interferes with the process. It now only takes a few seconds to load even large instruments.
#47
5MilesHigh
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 131
  • Joined: 2014/12/17 11:48:57
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/15 20:08:55 (permalink)
I see 3 concerns with defaulting to the C: automagically and without parental control.
 
1) SSD sizes when used as C: -- Sure, they'll grow, but SW will outpace them. Already (as noted above) many of us are forgoing 'hibernate' (say RAM size -32GB sir?)  and disabling default paging to the SSD which should hold either really hot data or static data. SSD's are the WoRM (write occasionally, read all the time). I'm OK with a 120GB boot C: SSD and have about 65GB free even with SPro installed, but its a very new system and growing fast.
 
2) Speed of access -- This is marketing fluff, nuf said. With 16GB of RAM, even page file accesses to the HDD are rare. I'm still checking streaming of long audio stuf simultaneously, but I'm not expecting problems and have my fingers crossed. I can't believe that a SSD would help in any case.
 
3) BOOT DISK is for the OS! --- With this whole UEFI (I just got upgraded), I actually now get to spend time wondering how best to organize my system. Even M$oft advises us mere mortals to separate our data and 'programs' (not to mention all the add-ons like VSTs, etc). My perspective is a program like Sonar is data! It is really useful for manipulating other data, but it is not the OS needed to run the machine itself.
 
I keep my Boot disk small so I can back it up frequently and easily. Even just a BU to a fast HDD is ~20 min. The 500 GB partitions for my music stuff is overnight. So at that point, I probably BU all the other partitions (~2TB) so thats another couple days. It needed to get done, but not on some timeline based on Sonar releases. So, the C: gets a weekly update from a stable system to a SSD and a HDD. I don't need to really re-write a bunch of small samples and even worse the dir structures associated with lots of tiny files, most of which I will never even peruse. These things belong in archives. RAM isn't an issue any more (for awhile at least).
 
I vote for lean and mean. I'm not aware of any advantage of putting the .exe on a SSD vs a HDD.
 
BUing a UEFI boot image is not quite as easy as it once was. I already have a 220GB SSD available as well and have set it up as an optional boot source. The C: drive gets lots of stuff dumped on it, cleaning is risky and really boring. I'm not BUing my C: because of Sonar but all the other 3 updates a day I already get to choose about and reluctantly accept. If I didn't put it on my C:, it has no business being there. If it can't be moved then that is an installation problem.
 
#48
GLG
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 38
  • Joined: 2013/11/17 05:50:28
  • Status: offline
Re: I understand the C drive concerns with CCC...BUT 2015/03/15 22:37:51 (permalink)
GregGraves
You must be talking about recording 4 or more tracks at once.  I do everything myself so never record more than a stereo track, one at a time.  By functioning solo, I find that I am never late to a session, and can drink just as many beers as I want without anyone giving me grief about being so blotto.


 
Yes I agree. Depending on your scope of recording you may only need one drive. However down the track a bit you may morph into an orchestral arranger requiring greater demands on your system drive.
 
A good analogy would be your beer. Right now you most likely have all your beer stored in one fridge and you're happy with that. But what if you branch out into other concoctions such as bourbon, whiskey, wines, sherry, moonshine etc. You probably wouldn't want all of that mixed up and stuffed in the one fridge. You'd want it organised for ease of access and less demand on the motor drives. Just don't buy "green" fridges because if you don't open the door often enough they will idle down and turn your booze warm.
 
Cheers
Greg
#49
Page: < 12 Showing page 2 of 2
Jump to:
© 2025 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1