Helpful ReplyLooking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation

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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/28 17:58:43 (permalink)
Thanks!  It was a GOOD overwhelming!!!!  No complaints here!!  I am grateful for the info and the encouragement.  I haven't gotten the Nektar installed yet but will be doing so this week.  I'll keep you in the loop of my progress.  I had a little "hickup" with Sonar and have to do a clean install of it.  I was getting some errors.  I think it was from a corrupted record.  My PC accidentally lost power while running Sonar.  Got the error after that.  I had changed some MIDI settings and when I restarted ... Kaboom!  Sonar support has been very helpful.  Hopefully, it will back up tonight!!  I didn't lose any data.
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/28 18:02:19 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
Thanks!  It was a GOOD overwhelming!!!!  No complaints here!!  I am grateful for the info and the encouragement.  I haven't gotten the Nektar installed yet but will be doing so this week.  I'll keep you in the loop of my progress.  I had a little "hickup" with Sonar and have to do a clean install of it.  I was getting some errors.  I think it was from a corrupted record.  My PC accidentally lost power while running Sonar.  Got the error after that.  I had changed some MIDI settings and when I restarted ... Kaboom!  Sonar support has been very helpful.  Hopefully, it will back up tonight!!  I didn't lose any data.




+1

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#32
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/28 21:25:39 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
I'll let you know when the  is Nektar installed.  I'm expecting it next in the next few days.



Hey, check this deal out.  For a buck, $1, this is a no-brainer!  Break in the Nektar properly 
https://www.audiodeluxe.com/products/virtual-instruments/air-xpand2
 
AudioDeluxe is selling Air Xpand!2 for just $1 (RRP $100) until the end of November.
Xpand!2 is a powerful synth workstation instrument with over 2500 patches "covering nearly all instruments known to man".

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#33
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/28 21:50:16 (permalink)
Purchased!  Definitely a no-brainer!  Thanks for the tip!
#34
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/28 21:50:51 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
Purchased!  Definitely a no-brainer!  Thanks for the tip!




+2

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#35
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/01 09:27:36 (permalink)
OK - The Nektar is installed and working.  It worked with Drop Zone and Addictive Keys with no need for mapping.  I will be working on it this weekend to learn how to map when needed and will be also working with Addictive Drums and EXDrummer.
 
I did purchase and install AIR Xpand!2, but cannot find an executable for it.  Is there a trick to it or is there something else I have to buy?  I do have a question logged in to them.  Any thoughts on that?
 
 
#36
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/01 09:34:59 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
OK - The Nektar is installed and working.  It worked with Drop Zone and Addictive Keys with no need for mapping.  I will be working on it this weekend to learn how to map when needed and will be also working with Addictive Drums and EXDrummer.
 
I did purchase and install AIR Xpand!2, but cannot find an executable for it.  Is there a trick to it or is there something else I have to buy?  I do have a question logged in to them.  Any thoughts on that?
 
 




Glad to hear the Nektar worked out for you!  How are the rotary knobs - are they smooth or clicky?  That is high on my list to replace the aging Axiom 49 I have, with two broken sliders and a few pads that quit.  But the keys still work, LOL!
 
As far as I know the AIR Xpand!2 does not ship with a standalone executable.  It only runs as a plugin within a host.
 
In Sonar, try looking under Insert > Soft Synth > Uncategorized > Xpand!2 > Simple instrument track ...

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#37
Genghis
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/01 09:49:57 (permalink)
Awesome!  I have a Nektar coming my way today (hopefully).  The only downside is I'm getting ready to leave for a week long business/fun trip so I'll be away from my little home studio for a week as of tomorrow.  I guess I should download the manual to my Galaxy pad so I have some reading material while I'm away.

They call 'em fingers, but I've never seen 'em fing. 
My Music is Here
Studio Cat DAW
#38
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/01 10:03:15 (permalink)
I'll check Sonar this evening after work on the synth.  Maybe "excutable" is the wrong term.  Nothing displayed for me to enter the product code.  I just checked and it doesn't show in the path you mentioned.  I assume it will once I found out how to get the product code in there.  Sonar didn't show an updated number in the plugins scan.
 
Regarding the Nektar LX 49 ... The rotary knobs are smooth and not "clicky".  They feel good to me.  They're quick but show some resistance when you turn them, but that is something I prefer as they will stop when you want them to stop.  You can be pretty accurate with them.  The 8 sliders are smooth and with a little less resistance.  I wouldn't say they are "cheesy" but they fit what I would expect of a controller in this price range.  I am used to sliders found on PA mixers so I am not sure if that is a fair comparison.  All in all, I think the controls are very decent.  They exceeded my expectations.  All the push buttons feel good and you can feel them engage.  Their instructional video needs to be updated and some of their documentation refers to Panorama (Confusing).  It would have been helpful to have the "soup-to-nuts" instructions in 1 PDF.  Even though it's a bit fragmented they insturctions guide you in the correct order.  Just start with the manual first, then look at the PDF they provide.  It works but it could be a little smoother.  Bottom line is the Nektar was recognized by Sonar straight away and I was able to get Drop Zone and Additive keys immediately.  I happy so far.  Going to work on mapping on the weekend.
#39
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/01 10:15:15 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
I'll check Sonar this evening after work on the synth.  Maybe "excutable" is the wrong term.  Nothing displayed for me to enter the product code.  I just checked and it doesn't show in the path you mentioned.  I assume it will once I found out how to get the product code in there.  Sonar didn't show an updated number in the plugins scan.


Take a look at this page.  http://www.pluginboutique.com/products/1560?which=additional_info#description
 
Scroll down to where you see the installation instructions.  Pay attention to the little note at the top that says you need to install the iLok license manager before running the Xpand!2 installer.  There is a download link provided.  You will not need a hardware dongle, just the software license manager.  Setup a free iLok account.
 
The product installer shown is for a different AIR product, but it's the same process.  After entering your activation code, or "serial", you can choose to store your license on your computer.
 
And you are running a 64-bit host, correct?

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#40
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/01 10:30:11 (permalink)
Ok, I'll go from there.  Thanks!
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/02 15:22:58 (permalink)
Thanks for tip.  That got me farther but still not there.  I can't seem to get Sonar to recognize Expand!2.  ilok shows it is active and the location is My PC.  I was able to get the authorization code in ilok but Sonar doesn't see it.  I uninstalled and reinstalled making sure that ilok was active and had the correct location, but still no go.  I checked the VST / Plugins mgt utility and it is not there.  When I use Windows explorer the only place I can find the files are in Downloads.  Any suggestions?  I have a question into their support but haven't heard back yet.  I wonder if I should move the files into VST folder directly.  Do you think that might work?
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/02 16:01:19 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
Thanks for tip.  That got me farther but still not there.  I can't seem to get Sonar to recognize Expand!2.  ilok shows it is active and the location is My PC.  I was able to get the authorization code in ilok but Sonar doesn't see it.  I uninstalled and reinstalled making sure that ilok was active and had the correct location, but still no go.  I checked the VST / Plugins mgt utility and it is not there.  When I use Windows explorer the only place I can find the files are in Downloads.  Any suggestions?  I have a question into their support but haven't heard back yet.  I wonder if I should move the files into VST folder directly.  Do you think that might work?


 
The Xpand!2 VST2 plugin is a .dll file that was placed into a folder on your PC during the install.
 
If Sonar is not seeing the plugin, it means you have not added that folder to Sonar's plugin scan path yet.
 
Search your system for "Xpand!2_x64.dll", then add that folder to Sonar VST scan paths. 
 
Edit > Preferences > File > VST Settings > VST Scan Paths > Add> (Browse to the folder you found while searching). 
 
Rescan.  Done.
 
It seems that every 3rd party installer likes to put plugins wherever they like.  I have VST folders scattered all over my hard drive.  It's truly become a big PITA!  I suppose I could re-organize them by dragging them all into one place.  But then the next time I upgrade one, and take the defaults, it's hide-n-seek time again ...
post edited by abacab - 2016/12/02 16:31:41

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#43
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/02 17:35:57 (permalink)
I see.  I thought it would do that as a part of the installation process.  OK then, I'll give that a try.  I did see the dll.
Thanks!
#44
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/02 17:49:26 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby DrLumen 2016/12/06 15:15:18
The secret to happiness is to aim Sonar's VST scan to every nook and cranny on your hard drive that 3rd party installers have installed their plugins!  Then it's simple

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#45
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/02 18:01:49 (permalink)
+1
#46
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/03 09:46:20 (permalink)
I was able to get Xpand!2 into Sonar.  I started getting errors with the Addictive Drums2 and Addictive Keys, but was able to modify their paths and the error stopped.  They work fine in Sonar and standalone.  I haven't tried Xpand!2 yet but its UI displayed when setting up an instrument track.  Today I'll be working on mapping the LX49 to soft synths and see how it works with Xpand!2.  I learned a lot about the Sonar plugin world.  Thanks for you help on this.  I guess it's time to start digging in to all the info you've sent me.  I'll let you know how it goes.  Until then ...
#47
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/03 10:09:10 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
I was able to get Xpand!2 into Sonar.  I started getting errors with the Addictive Drums2 and Addictive Keys, but was able to modify their paths and the error stopped.  They work fine in Sonar and standalone.  I haven't tried Xpand!2 yet but its UI displayed when setting up an instrument track.  Today I'll be working on mapping the LX49 to soft synths and see how it works with Xpand!2.  I learned a lot about the Sonar plugin world.  Thanks for you help on this.  I guess it's time to start digging in to all the info you've sent me.  I'll let you know how it goes.  Until then ...




Great!  I think that you will find that the included Cakewalk TTS-1 (16 track General MIDI multi-timbral) and the Xpand!2 (4-track multi-timbral) instruments will be the fastest way to set up a "band" for backing tracks for your use.
 
Also, don't forget to check out the included Cakewalk Studio Instruments, SI-Bass Guitar and SI-String Section.  They are good for quick backing tracks.  And since you have already found Addictive Drums, you are all ready to jam!
 
As I pointed out earlier, the included z3ta+ has a lot of cool synth sounds that you can use for pads (backgrounds), electronic basses, leads, etc, using just the preset sounds provided.  Then when you are inspired, it offers a deep dive into learning sound design, without getting seduced into buying fancy new soft synths with all the bells and whistles.  Use what you have! 

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#48
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/03 10:47:48 (permalink)
Well one thing is for sure.  I got to this point faster with your help!  I'll let you know how the LX49 mapping goes today.  Later!
#49
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/03 14:24:53 (permalink)
+1
 
Have fun!!!

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#50
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/03 19:43:47 (permalink)
OK - here is where I am ...
I am still trying to figure out how to get the soft synth controls to map.  
 
For now the keyboard, mixer faders and transport buttons work fine and I like that a lot!!  Nice for mixing multiple acoustic guitar tracks.  I am not able to get synth-related faders or rotary control to work with the soft synths.  I am sure I've missed something to setup.  Taking a break and reading the manual again. Other than that I am pretty happy!
 
 
#51
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/03 20:29:42 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
OK - here is where I am ...
I am still trying to figure out how to get the soft synth controls to map.  
 
For now the keyboard, mixer faders and transport buttons work fine and I like that a lot!!  Nice for mixing multiple acoustic guitar tracks.  I am not able to get synth-related faders or rotary control to work with the soft synths.  I am sure I've missed something to setup.  Taking a break and reading the manual again. Other than that I am pretty happy!
 
 




OK, I hear ya!  I really don't bother to map my controllers to particular soft synths globally.  I just use the mouse most of the time to setup the soft synth the way I want, then use "MIDI learn" for specific functions in the synth.
 
If there are some synth performance parameters that I want to control from the keyboard, I just right-click on that control in the soft synth, then select "MIDI Learn" from the context menu, and twiddle the control on my keyboard that I wish to map to that function.  Done.  Save the project and those settings stay with the project. 
 
Unfortunately, the next project you create and insert the same synth, you need to map again.
 
That is where certain keyboards that have dedicated soft synth maps, such as the Native Instruments controllers, make working with Native Instruments soft synths a breeze.  It's called plug-in integration.  Different thing from DAW integration, which is what you have now.  They would like for you to buy their software AND hardware!
 
This: https://www.native-instruments.com/en/products/komplete/keyboards/komplete-kontrol-s-series/
 
So you could end up needing two or more dedicated controllers. One for your DAW, and at least one more for your soft synths.
 
Me, I just live with the "midi learn" and life is good.
 
But be sure to check your documentation for the Nektar. It may have built-in control maps for select soft synths.

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#52
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/03 21:02:41 (permalink)
 
To me it's not that big of a deal.  Just a loose end.  A couple of other things I forgot to mention before is that the "play" transport button is stuck in click mode and I can't seem to turn it off.  "Shift-Click" didn't work.  Sonar crashed and it's been that way since.  I can always use the spacebar if I don't get it figured out. I really don't want to re-install.  
 
The other thing I noticed when there are multiple synth tracks and you tap the LX49's instrument button it always defaults to the first synth you inserted.  You can easily launch the synth via the track but I found that kind of odd.  I tested it out. First project I started with EZ Drummer and that was the default.  New project I started with Addictive Keys and that was the default.  Do you think that has something to do with the Synth rack?  Again, to me it is not a big thing but a loose end I wouldn't mind addressing.
 
BTW - I checked out every Cake Walk synth provided.  WOW!  LOVE! z3ta+1 -- Xpand!2 -- Rapture Session -- Dimension --  Wow!  It looks like they'll keep me busy!!  It will be some time before I upgrade to Rapture Pro.  I've got to get start reviewing all the info you sent.
 
Overall, I am pleased with the Nektar -- I would recommend it others.  It was able run everything right from the start.  Love the mixer side of it and I'll keep exploring the synth mapping.
 
Later!
 
 
 
#53
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/05 13:15:47 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
 
To me it's not that big of a deal.  Just a loose end.  A couple of other things I forgot to mention before is that the "play" transport button is stuck in click mode and I can't seem to turn it off.  "Shift-Click" didn't work.  Sonar crashed and it's been that way since.  I can always use the spacebar if I don't get it figured out. I really don't want to re-install.  
 
The other thing I noticed when there are multiple synth tracks and you tap the LX49's instrument button it always defaults to the first synth you inserted.  You can easily launch the synth via the track but I found that kind of odd.  I tested it out. First project I started with EZ Drummer and that was the default.  New project I started with Addictive Keys and that was the default.  Do you think that has something to do with the Synth rack?  Again, to me it is not a big thing but a loose end I wouldn't mind addressing.
 
BTW - I checked out every Cake Walk synth provided.  WOW!  LOVE! z3ta+1 -- Xpand!2 -- Rapture Session -- Dimension --  Wow!  It looks like they'll keep me busy!!  It will be some time before I upgrade to Rapture Pro.  I've got to get start reviewing all the info you sent.
 
Overall, I am pleased with the Nektar -- I would recommend it others.  It was able run everything right from the start.  Love the mixer side of it and I'll keep exploring the synth mapping.
 
Later!



Hey, ran across this on the product page:  http://www.nektartech.com/impact-lx49-61-plus.html
 
INSTRUMENT
  • Open/close VST instrument window
  • Nektar Map System store and recall map settings for VSTi plugins
  • The Default  page maps  pots to parameters as per blue control labeling
  • User page for secondary mapping or user mapping
  • Faders 1-4 commonly mapped to amp ADSR envelope
  • Faders 5-8 commonly mapped to filter ADSR envelope
  • Fader 9 control VSTi Instruments main volume
  • All VSTi mapping is user customizable using Nektar "Grab" function including faders, fader buttons and both page assignments
  • User customization can be either temporary (active for as long a project is open) or saved

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#54
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/05 14:08:08 (permalink)
Yes I am looking into that.  I have a support call into them as well.  Haven't heard back yet.  I was looking at the ACT function in Sonar.  Is this the MIDI learn you are referring to?
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/05 15:09:25 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
Yes I am looking into that.  I have a support call into them as well.  Haven't heard back yet.  I was looking at the ACT function in Sonar.  Is this the MIDI learn you are referring to?




It's related, but different.  Midi learn is assigned and saved only on a per project basis. 
 
ACT uses a controller template within Sonar that can be used globally across any Sonar project.  It can utilize several modes, depending on whether you aim focus (active window) on the DAW itself, or an individual plugin. 
 
The DAW integration for some keyboards can work well.  I just recently discovered a ACT preset that allows me to use the transport controls and knobs on my old M-Audio Axiom 49, for Sonar start/stop/record/loop, and also use the faders and knobs for track control in Console View.  I haven't really used it to control plugins.  That is because the MIDI learn thing is so easy, it's a no-brainer for me. 
 
Using ACT with plugins really takes some customization. ACT is kind of like MIDI learn, but it's saved in the ACT function.  ACT switches focus as you switch to different windows, so certain controls can be used more than once, depending on the active window.  And it's always available when you connect your controller and start Sonar.
 
To see if you have an ACT profile for your controller, from Sonar's main menu click on Edit > Preferences > MIDI > Control Surfaces.  If you haven't yet added one, click on the "+" symbol to start the add dialogue.  Under Controller/Surface, select ACT MIDI Controller, if yours isn't listed.  Then select the input port for your controller below that.  Then from Sonar's main menu click on Utilities > ACT MIDI Controller.  This opens up the ACT window.  There is a preset window at the top that lists a lot of controller hardware.  Note: If you’re not using a Roland A-PRO controller, using ACT at this date means using either the ACT MIDI Controller Plug-in, or the Cakewalk Generic Surface Plug-in.   You could probably MIDI learn a few things into a generic ACT profile, but I think that in the case of Nektar, see what their integration can accomplish first.
 
Here's an article that Craig Anderton wrote a while back about Sonar ACT:  http://www.soundonsound.c...t-hardware-controllers
 
Sonar docs are here:  http://www.cakewalk.com/Documentation?product=SONAR&language=3&help=ExternalDevices.15.html

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#56
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/06 09:25:33 (permalink)
Thanks for the info!  I check that out and let you know how it works.  This is my busy time.  It may take a bit to get back you.  Thanks again!!
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/10 15:21:34 (permalink)
Follow up ... Sorry I took so long ...
 
Here is the response from Nektar support regarding Sonar Act and controls questions.  I have not had a chance to check them out yet, but the seem to be straight forward answers:
 
Instrument selection via Nektar:
Sometimes the Instrument selection in Sonar can get out of sync with Impact. To fix this click on the 1st instrument in the synth rack, then use the patch up/down buttons to select instruments. When you use this method the correct plugin GUI should appear when you press the Inst button. 
 
Synth mapping: 
We don't have maps for Rapture or z3ta+1. But you should be able to use the grab function to control parameters for those instruments. While in Instrument mode, hold Shift while moving a control in the instrument GUI, then release shift and move a control on the LX49+. The parameter should now be mapped.
 
Sonar Act:
You can use Impact with ACT in Sonar, but you shouldn't need to as our Instrument mode should handle most of that functionality. If a parameter you would like to control is not mapped by default, use the grab feature to assign it.
#58
abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/10 19:35:52 (permalink)
That sounds like good advice! 
 
In a perfect world all of the virtual instruments would magically map to our controllers, but we have a far from perfect situation.  Because of the flexibility and capabilities of having our synths virtualized, rather than being hardware based with dedicated controls, there are just too many variations in the possible controls available for one controller to map them all.  The exception here would be by bundling a soft synth with a keyboard controller from the same manufacturer.
 
So in my opinion, the best situation is for the VSTi developer to provide a few smart knobs, or morph controls, on the VST instrument GUI.  Some VSTi's allow user programming to assign these smart controls to deep parameters within the synth.  That lets us decide what we have control over when we play the instrument. 
 
In your case, using the grab function, which sounds equivalent to the MIDI learn function, lets you pick select performance controls for the instrument you are playing.  It's a customized effort, but it does keep things somewhat simplified.
 
For example, using Rapture Session, after selecting an instrument from the factory library, click on the Instrument tab next to the Browser tab.  You will see 8 knobs in the GUI.  You can setup any of them to be associated with a knob or fader on your controller.
 
Using Xpand!2 you can pick any knob or slider on the instrument.  The 6 knobs at the top are smart controls, that you can adjust from your controller as you play.  Just pick the controls you wish to use.  Enjoy!

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/12/10 19:56:16 (permalink)
I will!
 
I thought this would be good info to post for others.  I haven't tried the Grab function yet, but it sounds quite easy and it's really all I need.
 
Thanks again for taking me under your wing!!  You made it a much more pleasurable experience!!!
 
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