Helpful ReplyLooking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation

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Bigdaddyd54
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2016/11/21 14:01:09 (permalink)

Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation

I am looking for a $200 or less workstation that provides a keyboard and drum pads.  I have heard that some brands are not compatible or supported by Cakewalk.  I am intrigued with what Arturia products provide.  Any suggestions?
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/21 15:04:22 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
I am looking for a $200 or less workstation that provides a keyboard and drum pads.  I have heard that some brands are not compatible or supported by Cakewalk.  I am intrigued with what Arturia products provide.  Any suggestions?




The term "workstation" has a hardware connotation that defines a standalone MIDI keyboard systhesizer with internal sounds and a built-in sequencer.  No Cakewalk required, but it can be used via MIDI.  There are probably some used gear deals to be had on eBay.
 
But if you mean a keyboard "controller", any MIDI controller can trigger sounds in Cakewalk.  But if you want true DAW integration, i.e. enhanced mapping of the controller functions, like transport control. the choices are limited. Because the DAW application needs to support a template for the specific controller device.
 
The guys in the know around here will probably say that your best bets would be:
Roland A-Pro series (I have the A-300PRO - 32 keys + pads $219 new, but can be found used)
https://www.roland.com/us/products/a-300pro/
Nektar LX+ series (49 keys + pads $160 new)
http://www.nektartech.com/impact-lx49-61-plus.html
 

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/21 16:14:39 (permalink)
See this related discussion ...
 
http://forum.cakewalk.com...PLATINUM-m3515937.aspx

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/21 16:53:29 (permalink)
Thanks!  I was looking more for keyboard controllers.  I should have been more specific.  I'll check out the links you provided for the Roland and Nektar units and go from there!
 
I was looking at some units from Novation, but then, via Google, I found they were having trouble and were not supported by Cakewalk.
 
This is a great start!  Thanks again!!
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Jesse G
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/23 18:33:39 (permalink)
If you are not looking for a workstation, then you are looking for a MIDI keyboard instead. 
 
I just purchased the CODE 49 buy M-Audio, it's a good Midi Controller and boy do I love using it.  I have a Korg TR 61 workstation that I use with Sonar, but That's connected to a keyboard amplifier as well to use when I don't want to have  to turn on my computer on to use it.
 
Back to the M-Audio CODE 25, 49, or 61  Take a look here  M-Audio CODE  
  • From Nov 1, 2016 to Jan 31, 2017 Get $50 back if Purchasing the  Code 25
  • From Nov 1, 2016 to Jan 31, 2017 Get $75 back if Purchasing the  Code 49
  • From Nov 1, 2016 to Jan 31, 2017 Get $100 back if Purchasing the Code 61
  • See the Wonderful  M-Audio CODE Rebate Form
  • Also purchase a M-Audio Code and get Music Air Tech - Velvet, DB 33, and Mini Grand Software for Free!
  • That's not all, Purchasers of CODE 25 and CODE 49 will also get UVI Synth Legacy For Free!
  • These 3 deals are offered by Musiciansfriends.com  Other stores may have other Deals.
 


 
 
 
post edited by Jesse G - 2016/11/29 14:51:14

Peace,
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==============================
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/25 08:32:22 (permalink)
Thanks for offering the information on the M Audio controllers!  I checked them out.   I have read there are some difficulties in Sonar connection with them.  It appears the 2 best candidates, for around $200.00, is either Nektar LX+ series or Roland A-Pro series (300, 500, etc). I am focusing on 49 Key units as I am primarily a guitar player that can somewhat work my way around a keyboard.  I waiting to see what kind of deals pop up for this Black Friday and Cyber Monday.  
 
Thanks to all for your posts!  They certainly helped!
 
 
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/25 12:21:25 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
Thanks for offering the information on the M Audio controllers!  I checked them out.   I have read there are some difficulties in Sonar connection with them.  It appears the 2 best candidates, for around $200.00, is either Nektar LX+ series or Roland A-Pro series (300, 500, etc). I am focusing on 49 Key units as I am primarily a guitar player that can somewhat work my way around a keyboard.  I waiting to see what kind of deals pop up for this Black Friday and Cyber Monday.  
 
Thanks to all for your posts!  They certainly helped!


Hope you find what you need! 
 
I'll just add one last comment about using controllers with Sonar.  As mentioned, some can more easily integrate with Sonar software, but all MIDI controllers can send MIDI data to Sonar such as keyboard notes, pitchbend, and modwheel, etc.
 
The difference is that some keyboards also include control surface functions, and this is the part that needs the Sonar compatibility to automatically map these additional controls to function in the software.  This lets you interact directly with the Sonar software from the controller vs. having to use a keyboard/mouse to drive it.
 
So depending on how you intend to use Sonar, this might be more or less of an issue to you.  Some users even have a separate dedicated control surface (like a mixing desk) to assist with recording and mixing tracks, so then they can use any MIDI keyboard to trigger synths, or if they just want to record guitars or drums, for example. 
 
I'll use the transport controls included with some MIDI controllers as an example (start, stop, record, etc).  If you are recording tracks from the MIDI keyboard, it can be handy to just press a play or record button on the controller without having to reach over and click the mouse. 
 

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/25 12:53:32 (permalink)
Thanks for the input.  I am quite the beginner with all of this.  My guess is I will eventually evolve into having a mixing center as I become more proficient.  For now, I have ordered the Nektar LX49+ and will begin there and will see how I grow.  Time is my biggest commodity in going forward.  I really appreciate your comments!  I think this is going to be quite an adventure and am looking forward to it.
 
Peace!
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BobF
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/25 21:21:48 (permalink)
I have a Samson Graphite 49 that works great with SONAR Plat for basic DAW functions in Mackie mode.  Transport, faders, pan, solo and such work without any futzing about.  $180 is the normal street price.
 
Doing custom ACT stuff for plugs is a nightmare though.  If you're a tweaker, I'm sure you could use AZ Ctrl and make it do just about anything.

Bob  --
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/25 21:50:16 (permalink)
Thanks!  Earlier today I ordered a Nektar Impact LX49+ and it should arrive sometime next week.  It appears to be a good match for my needs.  We'll see how it goes.  
 
Thanks again everyone for your input and suggestions!  
 
Happy Holidays!
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/25 21:55:03 (permalink)
BobF
 
Doing custom ACT stuff for plugs is a nightmare though.  If you're a tweaker, I'm sure you could use AZ Ctrl and make it do just about anything.




Agreed!  All I ever bother with anymore for plugs is the MIDI learn function, for the knobs, or whatever I want to tweak when I play an instrument.
 
Many of the newer plugin instruments have some smart knobs that make this a breeze.  MIDI learn a few of those and you're good to go. 
 
In many cases the sound designer can pre-assign select parameters to these knobs, that you can easily assign by MIDI learn to faders or knobs on your rig.  The Rapture Session is a good example of this.
 
There are also programmable synths that let you assign your choice of one or a group of synthesis or effects parameters to a smart knob.  The possibilities are unlimited for morphing the sound during the performance.  The advantage of this is you can set this up on a project by project basis.   Leave ACT for the tracking and mixing stuff ...

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 07:04:51 (permalink)
I have just started exploring Rapture Session.  Once I have the Nektar 49+ connected I may need some help with MIDI Learn, how to do sequencing & arpeggios and so on.  Do you have suggestions for some videos or documentation for these subjects?  Synths are something I plan on getting deeper into.  I primarily am a guitarist/vocalist, but want to experiment with synths to add depth.
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 13:05:00 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
I have just started exploring Rapture Session.  Once I have the Nektar 49+ connected I may need some help with MIDI Learn, how to do sequencing & arpeggios and so on.  Do you have suggestions for some videos or documentation for these subjects?  Synths are something I plan on getting deeper into.  I primarily am a guitarist/vocalist, but want to experiment with synths to add depth.




MIDI learn is very easy to use if, the plugin supports it, and most of them do now.  Just right-click on any knob or slider in the plugin window > select "MIDI learn" > twiddle the knob or fader on your controller that you want to use for that control.  Done!  This setting gets stored in your saved project.  Re-open the project and it's still there
 
Just Google search on the topic you want and you are bound to find zillions of YouTube demos on synth programming, sequencing, etc.  Some suggested keywords are the name of your controller, the name of your softsynth, and/or the technique that you want to learn about.
 
Since you are running Professional, the Rapture Session and Dimension LE are good for setting up some sounds in your arrangement, but they are mostly presets that let you tweak some parameters.  Good to get comfortable with before taking the big leap!
 
It appears that the most programmable synth among the Sonar Professional included instruments is z3ta+ classic.  Has a built-in arpeggiator.  It's a keeper!  Insert it into a project, then hit F1 for the help manual 
 

"Z3TA+ is an award-winning analog-style synthesizer with incredible sound shaping capabilities. The exclusive bandlimited Waveshaping technology makes Z3TA+ one the best and most respected synths in the industry.  Whether you’re looking for lush, warm pads, slowly evolving atmospheres, searing leads or sparkling FM sounds, Z3TA+ delivers the goods, and includes hundreds of professional presets.  For more information, see the Z3TA+ online Help."
 
This would be a good instrument to begin a deep dive into synths with.  Comes with some killer presets, has a lot of great sound mangling potential, and is well respected.  You can cover a lot of sound design ground there, before you get addicted and start buying new synth plugins

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
#13
mettelus
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 13:11:41 (permalink)
+1, can also insert it as an audio FX.

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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 13:24:42 (permalink)
Yes, I was taking a look at them and hoped they had potential.  Good to hear I was on the right track! Thanks for your help1
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 13:41:15 (permalink)
Good intro and overview here.  5 short videos available...
 
The Fundamentals of Synthesizer Programming Pt. 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leZP_s_z0DI
 
Moog Music Inc. is proud to present Dr. Joseph Akins' five part series on the fundamentals of synthesizer programming. Dr. Akins is an associate professor at Middle Tennessee State University and strives to teach his students a complete understanding of synthesizers and computers as tools for modern music production.

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 13:49:29 (permalink)
Thanks Again!!
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 13:51:13 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
Thanks Again!!




Have fun!
 
Be sure to let us know how you like that Nektar!

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 14:09:15 (permalink)
Will do!
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 14:13:27 (permalink)
mettelus
+1, can also insert it as an audio FX.

Can you clarify the "+1"?  Thanks!
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 14:34:06 (permalink)
Almost forgot. There's a free ebook that covers a lot of z3ta+ programming (one of the 6 synths used for examples) and includes a couple of z3ta+ patch banks along with the book.
 
"How to Make a Noise: a Comprehensive Guide to Synthesizer Programming"
http://noisesculpture.com/how-to-make-a-noise-a-comprehensive-guide-to-synthesizer-programming/
 
This book came out about 10 years ago, so the other 5 synth examples discussed are somewhat dated.  But a lot of coverage for z3ta+ here.
 
The author went on to publish 2 editions of the "Cakewalk Synthesizers, from presets to power user" books.

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
#21
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 14:42:17 (permalink)
Wow!  It looks like I got a lot of homework, which is a good thing!!  Much appreciated!
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 15:01:37 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
Wow!  It looks like I got a lot of homework, which is a good thing!!  Much appreciated!



But wait!  There's more!!!
 
There were so many chapters in the book Cakewalk Synthesizers - 2nd ed [chapters 14-29], that the publisher couldn't fit them all into the printed book.  So just like with How to Make a Noise, the author, Simon Cann has kindly made them available as a free ebook accompanied by downloadable program examples http://forum.cakewalk.com/Cakewalk-Synthesizers-From-Presets-to-Power-UserSecond-Edition-Published-m1911471.aspx
 
Cakewalk Synthesizers: From Presets to Power User—Second Edition Download Package
http://noisesculpture.com/cakewalk-synthesizers-downloads/
 
This chapter is dedicated to z3ta+ >Chapter 26: Creating Sounds in Z3TA+ [folder]
The programs to accompany Chapter 26 are included in a bank called CSFPTPU Chapter
26 [Z3TA+].128 in the folder chapter 26 [z3ta]. You can either copy this to your
default Z3TA+ programs folder or navigate to the location of the bank file.
To load the bank file, click on the Bank button and select Program > Load MIDI Bank
File (.128) from the drop-down menu.
 
Grab these freebies while you can ... the book appears to be out of print now ... I bought both editions while they were still available.  Very good stuff for synth programming, excellent if you have a bunch of Cakewalk synths

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
#23
mettelus
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 15:16:54 (permalink)
The "+1" simply means agreeing with the post above it. Z3ta+ classic has two plugins associated with it. One of those can be inserted as an Audio FX in an FX bin.

ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero (Wi-Fi AC), i7-8700k, 16GB RAM, GTX-1070Ti, Win 10 Pro, Saffire PRO 24 DSP, A-300 PRO, plus numerous gadgets and gizmos that make or manipulate sound in some way.
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 15:26:46 (permalink)
Just for grins, here are the results from the KVR One Synth Challenge OSC 31: Z3ta+ (finished).
 
The main rule is you must use only one virtual synthesizer for all sounds including percussion. Layering several instances of the synth is allowed.
 
All submitted tracks here were produced with only Z3ta+ used for this challenge 
https://sites.google.com/site/kvrosc/osc-31-z3ta
 
Some amazing stuff 

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
#25
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 18:42:14 (permalink)
mettelus
The "+1" simply means agreeing with the post above it. Z3ta+ classic has two plugins associated with it. One of those can be inserted as an Audio FX in an FX bin.

I get it.  Just showing how new I am to this.  Thanks!
#26
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 18:46:33 (permalink)
abacab
Bigdaddyd54
Wow!  It looks like I got a lot of homework, which is a good thing!!  Much appreciated!



But wait!  There's more!!!
 
There were so many chapters in the book Cakewalk Synthesizers - 2nd ed [chapters 14-29], that the publisher couldn't fit them all into the printed book.  So just like with How to Make a Noise, the author, Simon Cann has kindly made them available as a free ebook accompanied by downloadable program examples http://forum.cakewalk.com/Cakewalk-Synthesizers-From-Presets-to-Power-UserSecond-Edition-Published-m1911471.aspx
 
Cakewalk Synthesizers: From Presets to Power User—Second Edition Download Package
http://noisesculpture.com/cakewalk-synthesizers-downloads/
 
This chapter is dedicated to z3ta+ >Chapter 26: Creating Sounds in Z3TA+ [folder]
The programs to accompany Chapter 26 are included in a bank called CSFPTPU Chapter
26 [Z3TA+].128 in the folder chapter 26 [z3ta]. You can either copy this to your
default Z3TA+ programs folder or navigate to the location of the bank file.
To load the bank file, click on the Bank button and select Program > Load MIDI Bank
File (.128) from the drop-down menu.
 
Grab these freebies while you can ... the book appears to be out of print now ... I bought both editions while they were still available.  Very good stuff for synth programming, excellent if you have a bunch of Cakewalk synths




LOL!  Dude you're killing me with kindness!!!  Truly appreciated!  Peace!
#27
Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/26 18:50:09 (permalink)
abacab
Just for grins, here are the results from the KVR One Synth Challenge OSC 31: Z3ta+ (finished).
 
The main rule is you must use only one virtual synthesizer for all sounds including percussion. Layering several instances of the synth is allowed.
 
All submitted tracks here were produced with only Z3ta+ used for this challenge 
https://sites.google.com/site/kvrosc/osc-31-z3ta
 
Some amazing stuff 




I checked a few of them out.  All of that from one synth.  
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Bigdaddyd54
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/27 13:05:37 (permalink)
abacab
Almost forgot. There's a free ebook that covers a lot of z3ta+ programming (one of the 6 synths used for examples) and includes a couple of z3ta+ patch banks along with the book.
 
"How to Make a Noise: a Comprehensive Guide to Synthesizer Programming"
http://noisesculpture.com/how-to-make-a-noise-a-comprehensive-guide-to-synthesizer-programming/
 
This book came out about 10 years ago, so the other 5 synth examples discussed are somewhat dated.  But a lot of coverage for z3ta+ here.
 
The author went on to publish 2 editions of the "Cakewalk Synthesizers, from presets to power user" books.




I downloaded the material you sent!  I must admit all this info in overwhelming.   I'll let you know when the  is Nektar installed.  I'm expecting it next in the next few days.
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abacab
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Re: Looking for Sonar Professional-compatible workstation 2016/11/28 17:30:39 (permalink)
Bigdaddyd54
I downloaded the material you sent!  I must admit all this info in overwhelming.   I'll let you know when the  is Nektar installed.  I'm expecting it next in the next few days.



Hey, didn't intend to overwhelm
 
When you asked for some tutorials I thought it would be good to share some stuff that you could grow into gradually, as needed.  Or maybe help others that read this thread someday.  Nobody gets this stuff in a few days.  After all these years, I'm still learning, LOL!
 
How did you learn to shape your sound with the guitar?  You probably just experimented.  It's the same with synths.
 
Play around and have fun.  The guitar and a synth both generate sound signals with oscillators.  The sounds can then be shaped further along in the signal chain. 
 
A guitar actually has 6 oscillators (strings) that vibrate to create the sound waves.  You control the attack, decay, sustain, and release with your picking, fretting, and muting style.  Then you filter it with your tone controls, maybe some effects processors, and finally your amp.  At this point you probably no longer think much about it.  Just turn a few knobs and off you go. 
 
These controls are mostly all there inside of a synth, just hidden away in the box and exposed in a little window on screen for you to find.  Be patient and you will be rewarded 
 
Have fun!

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
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