• SONAR
  • Midi latency in Sonar (p.2)
2012/11/10 10:18:49
CJaysMusic
The installation of the New X2 set up your audio sound card with a configuration that is favorable. That's what happened, if you wanted to know why.

When you install the new version of Sonar, it runs and defaults to a configuration. You may need to adjust the driver mode in the future, depending on what your doing

CJ
2012/11/10 14:39:18
brundlefly

dont play with input quantisation (personally i think its a weird feature because it is totally unnatural to play with it) since you can anyway quantize it later to your need with two clicks...



Just for reference, Input Quantize doesn't actually do anything while recording; it just automatically applies quantizing after you hit stop. It won't affect the live performance timing at all.


Think about it: There's no way it could automatically move something earlier that you played late to put it on the beat in real time (unless maybe you're playing on a train moving at very near the speed of light ). At best all it could do would be to delay stuff you played early, which would definitely be weird, and probably very unhelpful. 



2012/11/10 15:56:55
Tom F
brundlefly



dont play with input quantisation (personally i think its a weird feature because it is totally unnatural to play with it) since you can anyway quantize it later to your need with two clicks...

At best all it could do would be to delay stuff you played early, which would definitely be weird, and probably very unhelpful.  




hmm. and i thought that thats what it does - cos otherwise what is the use of calling it "input quantize" . it just should be called "auto quantize"


or... ? 
:-)
2015/06/19 17:11:54
normeughdge
 I have Sonar X3 Producer. I'm having some latecy, or delayed response while trying to record, with my Alesis QX49 Midi keyboard controller. It seems that when I open a soft synth, and play it by itself, it plays fine! But when hit the record button and try to record with the playback of the other tracks, thats when the problem starts. The keys have a delayed response, or sluggish, or some of them will cut out, or not sound at all! I've adjusted my buffer several times, but to no avail. I'm using the WDM drivers, on a windows 7 computer, 32 bit. I've just recently updated all my computer drivers, and up to date with my Sonar X3 Producer software. I also have a Focusrite 2i4 Interface. My keyboard is usb and plugs right into my computer. I'm not sure if its a latecy issue or timing. (But I do know the timing is off!) Or is it a way to record Midi with external instruments, (guitars, basses etc...), or with audio tracks that I'm overlooking? I've got the feeling there are some "settings" that I have that are incorrect and or are not compatible to what I'm trying to do. Would appreciate any help I can get! 
2015/06/19 17:20:55
scook
When this happens with an existing project, it is usually plug-in related. You can confirm this by hitting the "E" key or the FX button in the mix module. This will disable all plug-ins. The latency should dissapper. Here is a similar thread http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3241520
2015/06/19 18:05:20
robert_e_bone
I am curious - why are you using the WDM drivers for your interface, rather than ASIO?
 
I checked the web site for the interface, and indeed there are ASIO drivers available for it.  I generally attempt to install and use ASIO drivers first, for any audio interface I am using, however some folks do have better results when using WDM.  It is usually wise to try the ASIO driver mode, if issues with WDM, and also to try WDM driver mode if issues with ASIO.  One or the other should result in good performance and stability.
 
When you go into Preferences, you may need to remove the check box for the audio interface, in order for you to be able to select the ASIO driver mode.
 
The ASIO driver mode also will use a parameter that you need to set, for adjusting the size of a buffer for the interface to process the signal.  It is usually called ASIO Buffer Size, or sometimes the interface will control that buffer with a slider, or will have you pick from a number of samples - different manufacturers use different methods of controlling the size of the ASIO Buffer.
 
I mention this because for the rest of time you will need to switch the size of that ASIO Buffer, depending on what kind of processing you are doing in Sonar.  When tracking/recording, you need the ASIO Buffer Size to be fairly small, or you will hear a lag between when you play a note and when you hear it back.  On the other side of ot, when you have finished recording and move on to mixing/mastering, you will almost always want to jack up that ASIO Buffer Size to be very large - this is to accommodate effects that often need the larger buffer size for the type of processing they do, like convoluted reverbs and effects that use look-ahead processing.
 
SOOOOO - I generally use a sample rate of 48 k, and an ASIO Buffer Size of 128 for recording, and then when I move to mixing/mastering, I jack up the ASIO Buffer Size to 1024 or 2048.  The high latency that comes from the big ASIO Buffer Size doesn't matter when mixing, because you aren't trying to record tracks while mixing.
 
So, I suggest you try the ASIO driver mode, with the above settings and report back with your results.  It may not fix things for you, but is certainly a reasonable place to start.
 
Bob Bone
 
2015/06/20 20:32:08
normeughdge
Guys I appreciate all your help, but so far, trying all your suggestions, didn't seem to make any difference. I Tried using "E" or "FX," and the latency was still there, and I tried using ASIO Drivers, (again) but I get no sound, and my play back wont start. I'm gonna try to "splain" how I got this hooked up. Maybe you guys can point out something I've done wrong. In Preferences/Devices, for Input drivers I have checked:  Scarlett 2i4. For output drivers I have checked: Scarlett 2i4 1/2 & Scarlett 2i4 3/4. Driver settings: Playback timing Master is Scarlett 2i4 1/2 & Record Timing Master is Scarlett 2i4. Audio driver bit depth is set to 16. Playback and recording: I'm using WDM/KS drivers. Tried to use ASIO, but no luck! In Midi>Devices: Input I have QX49 checked (My Keyboard controller) and in Output I also have checked the QX49. In Control Surfaces, in the Controller Connected/surfaces box there is ACT Midi controller-1, and I've put in the QX49 in the inport and QX49 in the outport. On the second line there is also ACT Midi controller -2 but "none" in both port boxes. In Playback and Recording: Under Recording/Checked boxes are - Notes, controller, patch changes, pitch wheel,  system exclusive, buffers 64, echo system exclusive. In the currently assigned box is 1 QX49. Under Playback is 250 millisecond buffers, and checked is: Always echo current midi track. Under Midi files is checked: Always use sysx banks for Midi files (instead of sysx data). I'm desperate to get this right. I hope this gives a better picture of what could be wrong. 
2015/06/20 21:13:19
scook
And yet with all that detail, you fail to mention the only other source of audio latency other than plug-ins. In this case the mixing latency buffer size slider setting. It might be possible to run the interface with a low enough setting using the WDM driver but from what I can tell most use ASIO with Focusrite hardware. If you are unable to get a sufficiently small buffer size using WDM, you will need to work with Focusrite support to figure out why the PC is refusing the use the preferred driver option.
 
The MIDI playback buffer might be too small at the default setting of 250. This does not affect latency but can cause dropped MIDI notes. Increasing the value to 500 or higher will prevent dropped notes but again will do nothing to affect the audio latency you have described.
2015/06/21 06:00:30
normeughdge
As you can tell I'm brand new to Midi. Before I got this Midi keyboard, I'd just hook my guitars and keyboards thru my audio interface and recorded everything just fine! People kept telling me to get a Midi keyboard, that I would have alot more options and be able to do stuff a lot better. But there is a whole lot of stuff about how this Midi thing works that I'm just not catching on too. I thought it was as simple as, hook it up and enjoy! And what do you mean by, "you fail to mention the only other source of audio latency other than plug-ins?" And as far as ASIO drivers, I used to use them with Magix, and FL Studios, but when I got Cakewalk, I tried to use them, but kept having trouble. And the quick start guide mentioned the WDM drivers. When I tried them, it worked, and that's what I've been using every since. Another thing I wanted to mention is that If I hook this Midi keyboard thru usb straight to my computer, how does it interact with my audio interface. I noticed that the Midi indicator is not on, on my audio interface, but I hear it fine through my desk monitors and can control the volume with my audio interface. Once again I appreciate you taking the time to reply, and being of great help! Thanks.
2015/06/21 07:29:28
Zargg
Hi. Have you checked that you have (and installed) the latest asio drivers for your Quad Capture?
As others suggested, I think ASIO would be the best drivers for your Audio Interface.
You will probably need separate drivers for your MIDI controller.
And including your specs in your profile will help people analyzing your problem(s).
Best of luck.
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