ORIGINAL: wogg
You suppose enabling the SATA device won't cause a problem when I get it off the same IRQ?

I don't expect so, but it could.

The next better thing would be to atually get glitch-free audio on the SATA drive too. I think you'll be extremely lucky if you do. More than likely, you'll still experience interference through PCI contention (a layer above IRQ contention). For some strange reason, SiI and M-Audio devices hanging on the same side of the PCI bridge (in this case, the PCI slot bus) just don't seem to work and play well together. Unfortunately, adjusting PCI latency doesn't seem to be able to help it. It could be another bit of the PCI bus protocol that we don't have proper tools to adjust post-driver.

I haven't experimented with it myself, mainly because I don't use an M-Audio PCI interface. If you do happen to experience audio glitches, perhaps you could experiment some.

That's great, gb. Glad to hear it. Congrats to you.

For the record, over on page 20 of the Reclaiming SATA thread, jredfern successfully got glitch-free SATA audio with an m-audio Audiophile by plugging in a Promise Fasttrak S150 SATA RAID controller card. His MOBO had an SiI controller and he wanted internal SATA. So, there's an option for internal SATA drives that gives the added option for RAID setups too.

Edit: This clearly shows that it's some kind of bad interaction specifically between the m-audio and SiI drivers and/or hardware.

The good news it... I think you may be overreacting. As long as the MOBO manual says that the port comes off of the chipset and is not fed by an SiI controller, then you should be fine with regard to this issue.

The real issue is that you went and got a PCIe MOBO. Search around regarding PCIe and nForce4. Sorry to say, you may not like what you find.

>>>>The real issue is that you went and got a PCIe MOBO. Search around regarding PCIe and nForce4. Sorry to say, you may not like what you find. <<<<<


Huh? Can you explain please? i'm searching now....
links?

can you tell me what you found out please? Because I can change my order real quick.
Is it related to all socket 939 mobos...or just my MSI order?

Is this a better mobo? normal pci slots?
Gigabyte GA-K8U-939 Socket 939 ULi M1689 ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail (I'm leary about the chipset...it isn't VIA, is it?)

I guess I can save $ on a new pci-e vid card and use my dual-head agp then (el cheapo) - but I'm NOT gamer so ...hmmm
might end up going that route.
It has 5 pci so I guess I can add my firewire card for that then.

thanks for any help guys

I still don't find anything about nforce and pci-e. More info?

Just follow Jim's advice on that MOBO. He knows what he's talking about. If you doubt it, search for posts by him and try to find one instance where he was wrong. If you doubt me, then search for posts by me. HTH!

There is nothing for "pcie glitch" in a search.
No time for links....search youand "Jim" for any faults? (on a msg board - lol)
Oh brother. Give me a f'n break. Check the ego horsesh*t , we need to get down to details now.

Note: Via blows - they're awful, and I know this from experience working in hardware labs for over 7 years. You'd have to have it crapping diamonds before I buy via - it's NOT AN OLD HABIT, IT'S HISTORY SET. This much, 99% of the daw/a-v community is SOLID on.
This was a plague with via since day 1. The P3V4x for just one example - needed soooo much tlc, workaround autoloaders, etc. till the cows come home - until it was SOMEWHAT STABLE (read: forget above average). The problems stay all they way up to their latest boards (which I can still find negative info on in ANY search).
4in1's? No way - move on.

I've read from "Jim". But, why should I follow only his advice ...especially when it's pointing only to an ALi chipset? Red F'n flag baby. ALi has provision over the 2nd worst chipsets in history. I'm not sold yet on why one should HAVE to move to this and ONLY this right now (read: I'm willing to wait until the issues are resolved before going to ALi blindly). I question the ide and sata ctrlrs, board arrangement, it's got near nothing as far as adjustment of RAM TIMINGS (this isn't ONLY for OCing), no SATA II support...plus this mobo is MINI atx (not full atx).
BTW: the SATA ctrlr on that ALi board is a sil3112 chip - hello?

I've got zero trust in ALi chipsets (btw: they aren't "unknown" to those who've been around the block, they've been known for the below average chipsets OVERALL in mobo's for quite some time. Hell, all the history is there baby. Are you saying they are better in ovcerall stability, speed, and features for the socket 939 x2 cores than ...say...the nforce4 ultra, nforce4, nforce 3, etc? There's more to the word "stability" than catering to AN INCREDIBLY ASSININE MAUDIO F-UP/incompatibility.

And let me add this, that ALi board is a piss poor oc'r mobo. Now hold on before you reply to the lettrs "OC" and check this. History will show mobo's that are capable of even nominal fsb/memory oc's are built better and/or follow a better design. That ALi board has been known to funk out at even the most minimal OC.
How does that translate to longevity in a mobo when you're not OCing? It doesn't.
So there and above is where I draw caution line to "jims" advice.

But i digress, I'm not angry with "Jim" (or you...or anybody). I'm just ticked off that this IDIOTIC problem is holding back a proper upgrade for those in this scenario who actually create with their systems (it'd s festure laden hrdwr problem and it's mainly stemming from getting the most for the GAMERS out there - who DO NOTHING IN THE END EXCEPT RACK UP POINTLESS POINTS IN MOMS BASEMENT - AT AGE 28 NO LESS!
Let's face it, they now completely run the hrdwr market game that stems this bullsh*t. Ridiculous).

I may try the gigabyte board (risk), or wait and buy a Tyan server board at this point, or just simply wait longer until this bullsh*t is straightend out. Why? because having the ONLY option become moving to an ALi chipset is UNACCEPTABLE without any more data on the matter.

Now regarding your reply and my "tone" here now, if you ever "find the F'n time for links", I'm sure MANY would love to see your links regarding the above. Help me and many understand why ALi is a safe bet now. Years out of the hardware game now, I can't just "trust Jim" (or YOU) when I build my systems. Understand?
I need some data.

note: maudio SHOULD step up taking responsibilty for this, but basing it on Maudio of the past - we all know KNOW they won't. But...maybe since Avid aquired them, that has changed. Who knows. That said, I do love my delta 1010's for several extremely valid reasons, but if nothing is done over time, they might be forced to go.

Is the ALi chipset the ONLY answer right now?
I am NOT diggin the only answer (giga ALi GA-K8U-939) as of yet.

Hey jo, I apologize for my tersenes... this is a really busy month for me. I can see why you took it as dissing you, especially considering the urgency in your mood coming in, so please consider that I did not mean it that way. Can we start over?

I may have been a bit hasty knocking nForce4 completely. You may be OK as long as you use an X2 core and don't plan on using UAD cards. Here's a thread that may help. Here's another thread that may be of use to you.

Regarding name-dropping, FWIW, Jim R. is well-known in the DAW business and has loads of big-name experience. He's the go-to guy for a reason: he knows his stuff. More than that, he's as helpful as he is knowledgable. Another pro DAW builder around here is Scott of ADK DAW (jcschild on these forums). He also has a respectable client list, and is ahead of the curve on most DAW-related issues. And he's also helpful and a generally great guy on the forums. There are several others, but I won't bore you with them. I feel that you are a "just the facts" kind of guy, so I only give these names to give proper credit where it's due.

I understand your mistrust of face-value advice. Perhaps you have been burned by it in the past. But unfortunately, you will have a hard time getting an independent, impartial lab result for DAW performance because, well, the demand is so dang low. You said it yourself... the market is geared for gamers. That's precisely why it's so great to have real professionals sharing advice on forums like these. Sorry, but that's all I can give you, the sum total of my experience and theirs. If that's not enough for you, well, you can keep looking I guess, or ask someone else. Blessings, and good luck.

[Edited to add link and fix typos.]

Hey jo, I have no direct experience with the K8U (ULi chipset, I don't see any Ali, unless they are somehow the same by different names...). But Jim says that he has built more than one system with it, successfully, including the one in his own home studio. That's good enough for me.

These days, just about any nForce3 939 MOBO should work fine. I currently use an MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum, but that's no longer available. The Gigabyte ones mentioned on the other thread should be fine, though. The thing I hear the most about nForce3 is that you have to do some futzing with drivers and BIOS updates to get everything properly up-to-date, including 1T timing on memory and the whole multi-core thing. But us veterans aren't put off by a few updates, are we?

Another option is the ASROCK Dual SATA2 which I have seen used successfully around this forum. It's a kind of "sleeper" deal, too... a no-nonsense board, kind if like the K8U board, that just plain works. Oh... don't be put off by the PCIe slots. THis is a special board that features both PCIe and AGP 8X/4X graphics slots. Just use the AGP slot, and don't use the PCIe slots, and you'll be golden. Whoa... I took a look at the specs, and lo and behold, it's also using an ULi chipset. In fact, this board is similar in form to the K8U board, onl trading a couple of PCI slots for the two PCIe slots.

I don't believe this! I sent my delta 1010LT back to m-audio because of problems that sound just like this problem and, of course, m-audio said there's nothing wrong with the card and are sending it back! TS NEVER said anything about SATA! I have a SIL3112 PCI card in my system with a 80G SATA150 internal as my primary C: drive!

I also have a Delta 44 that I've been using since my 1010Lt has been "out for repair" and I have FEWER problems with it, but I still get pops and clicks with it! And I also have pops with my mouse, which someone else posted somewhere in this mess.

So I've got to get rid of my SATA PCI card to solve my problems?!

This is an older thread - has m-audio and/or SIL "solved" this problem by now? I would think NOT since I am using the latest drivers for both and am still experiencing some problems. SHEEZ!

@Beagle:
in the time being, the only way to get rid of M-Audio/SATA problem is:
-to ensure that you're not connecting your SATA drive on a SiI3112 controller (which is very popular as it is almost all 2-ports PCI SATA cards have it and as it is integrated in most nforce2 motherboards and some others)
-or if you don't want to replace your SATA add-in card,
to use ONLY IDE drives for audio.

Promise chips and add-in cards seems not to have this particular issue. but i can't confirm.

UPDATE:
M-Audio sent me a reply today.
they said: "use IDE or use another SATA controller"...
they incriminate the SATA chip NOT THEIR OWN CARDS (Delta series which are the only card to have the issue!).
i feel totally fooled as SiI doesn't provide end-user support nor any support for this discontinued chip.

i complained alot and asked for a digne support.
still waiting, still hoping.

getting in touch,
pipo.

well, well,
i was discussing with M-Audio France. they finally told me i'm the first french user to report the problem.
they ask me for a documented issue in order to forward it to the developpers...
there is still hope!
if someone is still interested in solving this issue, please provide help.

btw, is Zlartibartfast still concerned? can he share docs he has accumulated?

cu,
pipo.

PS:

ORIGINAL: losguy
Edit: P.S. The Delta isn't the only one that has shown this issue. The Audiophile has also shown it, and there may be others as well.

all M-Audio PCI card based on Envy24 chip are "Delta":
Delta Audiophile 2496
Delta Audiophile 192
Delta DIO
Delat 44, 66, 1010, 1010LT
...

Hey folks. First time listener first time caller.
I spent all day today troubleshooting mysterious clicks and pops that suddenly started appearing at random places in my audio stream. I couldn't figure it out until it finally struck me that the problem occured only when reading off my new Samsung SATA drive and only when playing back through my rackmount Delta 1010, under every program with the exception of Audition 2.x (don't ask me why).

"What chipset", I wondered to myself, "is controlling the SATA ports on my mobo*?" A quick peek at Device Manager revealed that it was the ubiquitous SIL 3512. I went about updating/reinstalling/replugging but nothing remedied the pops.

Off to Google for a little creative keyword searching ("clicks and pops playing back from sata hard drive") and I wound up here. Nice place you guys keep.

I will call M-Audio Canada in the morning and suffer the slings and arrows of first level tech support. I'll do if for the team, K? I'll report back with my findings. Maybe I'll dent the armour, but don't anyone hold their breath. At least up here they pick up the phone.

Piyono

*My mobo: Gigabyte GA-7N400 Pro2 v2

Thanks for your diligence in reporting back, Don. It is encouraging to see that M-Audio is at least standing behind their products like this. And it's also good to have some degree of closure on this.

I only hope that Zlartibartfast is out there somewhere watching, so that he can see the culmination of his work here. (At least this, if not Earth v2... he hasn't posted around here since last November).

Hi guys, long time Cakewalk/Sonar user here, first time poster! Sorry to bring this topic back to the top again, but I'm just wanting to double check on the whole SATA issue before I purchase an Audiophile 2496 for my setup. I have an Asus MOBO with Intel 915P chip... and according to Intels specs on their website, it has 'Integrated Serial ATA controller facilitates', which I assuming from reading topics all over the forum, means there is no SiI controller involved? Meaning I should be ok with the 2496?

It also mentions RAID in the Matrix Storage details, not sure if that's an issue or not, as I'm honestly not the best with pc lingo, but I'm getting there.

The specs of my pc can be found here if they help any!

Unfortunately I didn't realise when buying this pc over 12 months ago that it had a PCI-E graphics card, although I was slightly relieved to see that the 915 chips are supposed to be ok performance wise provided they are running a low powered graphics card such as the Geforce 6200. Mine is running Geforce 6600, so I'm really not sure where that puts me. I have been running onboard audio and using MME (yuck), but now I'm looking at using a few sampled drum kits and obviously the latencys are no good with MME, so I'm looking at doing the upgrade to something better than on-board (yes, it's the one and only... Realtek, which doesn't support ASIO and wont playback in Sonar with WDM for some reason). My Mackie Onyx has a firewire card in the back of it that supports ASIO and WDM, but performance with those was no good either, worse than my on-board with the ASIO4ALL driver installed. Hopefully my system isn't doomed and the 2496 will help. Sorry this post is all over the place, but can anyone help me out at all? Any other info I've missed just let me know! :)

Ok great, thanks for that. I'll take a risk and go for the 2496, and then at least if thing's don't work smoothly, I haven't wasted too much money. I'll also try out any updated chipset drivers I can find if I have any problems. Thanks again!