Helpful ReplyMixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones

Author
slincoln
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 37
  • Joined: 2014/12/20 12:26:36
  • Location: Minneapolis, MN
  • Status: offline
2016/02/17 13:29:27 (permalink)

Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones

I purchased a pair of JBL monitors with 5" woofers a few years back. However, I just couldn't get use to them. It appears that I don't like the sound of rear firing ports. For me, I tend to hear some type of time delay in the sub and low frequencies. It also could be some type of issue of the subs and low frequencies bouncing off the back wall, as well.
 
My monitors are 12" from the wall and are at the proper height for my listening position. I haven't been in any studios that have monitors with front firing ports, therefore, I can't be sure if it's the monitors or my ears. However, I can mix with headphones without any issues.
 
I have a very nice headphone setup and get a good speaker translation. Most people can't tell if my mixes were done on headphones or studio monitors. However, with that said, monitors are very useful to double check that my mixes are pushing enough air. That is one thing that is tough to judge when mixing with headphones.
 
My headphones came with a calibrated plugin which is within 0.5db flat throughout the frequency response. When I have gone through some of my old mixes were mixed with monitors, I hear a lot of stuff that needs to be addressed with EQ.
 
I know that mixing with headphones is usually frowned upon. However, using them to mix, is becoming more popular with plugins that emulate speakers, and high tech headphone amps.
 
I'm interested if other people have had similar issues using rear firing monitors. I am also interest from hearing for people who use quality headphones for mixing, as well.
#1
batsbrew
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 10037
  • Joined: 2007/06/07 16:02:32
  • Location: SL,UT
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2016/02/17 13:37:15 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby robbyk 2017/02/10 13:58:03

Bats Brew music Streaming
Bats Brew albums:
"Trouble"
"Stay"
"The Time is Magic"
--
Sonar 6 PE>Bandlab Cakewalk>Studio One 3.5>RME BFP>i7-7700 3.6GHz>MSI B250M>G.Skill Ripjaws 4 series 16GB>Samsung 960 EVO m.2ssd>W 10 Pro
 
#2
slincoln
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 37
  • Joined: 2014/12/20 12:26:36
  • Location: Minneapolis, MN
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2016/02/17 15:17:26 (permalink)
batsbrew
http://ehomerecordingstudio.com/studio-monitor-positioning/
 
http://thedspproject.com/studio-monitor-positioning
 
http://arqen.com/acoustics-101/room-setup-speaker-placement/
 
https://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar02/articles/monitors.asp
 
http://crossfadr.com/2013/04/22/a-crash-course-to-room-acoustics-and-studio-monitor-placement/
 
 
somewhere in there........
 



Thanks for the links:) From what I see there, it affirms some of my notions. The 38% factor won't work in my room, because of it's size. My monitors are placed where there should be, however, my chair is at the 50% mark of the room. With the room being 12ft deep, that creates another problem which explains some of the sub and low end frequencies, plus the fact my monitors have rear firing ports.
 
Looks like I need a bigger room and front firing port monitors, as well.
#3
Cactus Music
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8424
  • Joined: 2004/02/09 21:34:04
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2016/02/17 20:57:17 (permalink)
My first Monitors where Tanoy PBM 6.5, they are rear ported. In the instructions they recommended ( I think) something like 4 ' from anything behind them, preferably a dead wall. 
 
They were designed to go on a typical meter bridge in a control room. Home studios were not yet in full bloom, and professional studios always have lots of room between the mix position and the front wall. So my first studio had my mix position in the middle of the room So they worked great for many albums I recorded there.  It was all one big room in my attic. The artists where right there. 
When I built my studio in a commercial location I had a sound proof wall and a "W" window between me and the live room. So the monitors were now on a shelf 2" from a wall. They all of a sudden sucked big time. 
 
So I did a little reading about this and ordered my now long standing Yamaha NMS 10's. So my advice is to do the same. If your workspace requires near fields that do not rear port, don't even try it.
Headphones are OK for working for short sessions, but not for long periods of time, you get tired quickly. 
 
PS; the Tanoy's live on as a smoking home stereo and theatre system. Not bad after 27 years. 
post edited by Cactus Music - 2016/02/17 21:15:18

Johnny V  
Cakelab  
Focusrite 6i61st - Tascam us1641. 
3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
 http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
 
 
#4
slincoln
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 37
  • Joined: 2014/12/20 12:26:36
  • Location: Minneapolis, MN
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2016/02/18 00:00:03 (permalink)
Cactus Music
If your workspace requires near fields that do not rear port, don't even try it.
Headphones are OK for working for short sessions, but not for long periods of time, you get tired quickly. 
 
 



Thank you for the useful information. I'll be checking out monitors which have front firing ports. I actually limit my headphone usage to 1.0 to 1.5 hours. After that, I can't trust what I do because of ear fatigue. Learned that one the hard way..
#5
AndreyErickson
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1
  • Joined: 2017/02/10 05:43:34
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/10 06:55:33 (permalink)
Hi!
Thank you for information that I have got in this thread. 
#6
patm300e
Max Output Level: -74 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 845
  • Joined: 2007/09/28 09:14:18
  • Location: USA - Maryland
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/10 11:37:50 (permalink)
I typically Mix with headphones.  I use CHEAP ones:
https://www.amazon.com/Superlux-681-Dynamic-Semi-Open-Headphones/dp/B002GHIPYI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1486744485&sr=8-1&keywords=superlux+hd681
 
Sonarworks rescues these by having a plug in for them.  They are pretty accurate.
 
I also have a cheap pair of 6" Behringer Truth Powered monitors for when I actually want to listen.
 
You can hear one of my recent mixes here:
https://soundcloud.com/patm300e/im-alright-2
 
This was my entry into the Mixing Challenge found here:
http://forum.cakewalk.com/Mixing-Practice-m3537464.aspx

SPLAT on a Home built i3 16 GB RAM 64-bit Windows 10 Home Premium 120GB SSD (OS) 2TB Data Drive.  Behringer XR-18 USB 2.0 Interface. FaderPort control.
#7
Bristol_Jonesey
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 16775
  • Joined: 2007/10/08 15:41:17
  • Location: Bristol, UK
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/21 10:03:11 (permalink)
Most monitors by Adam are front ported

CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughout
Custom built i7 3930, 32Gb RAM, 2 x 1Tb Internal HDD, 1 x 1TB system SSD (Win 7), 1 x 500Gb system SSD (Win 10), 2 x 1Tb External HDD's, Dual boot Win 7 & Win 10 64 Bit, Saffire Pro 26, ISA One, Adam P11A,
#8
BobF
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8124
  • Joined: 2003/11/05 18:43:11
  • Location: Missouri - USA
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/22 08:38:06 (permalink)
My ancient Event PS8s (front ported) do pretty good with ARC2.  I'm also in a less than ideal configuration.  For mixing, ARC2 fixes up the low end really well.
 
 

Bob  --
Angels are crying because truth has died ...
Illegitimi non carborundum
--
Studio One Pro / i7-6700@3.80GHZ, 32GB Win 10 Pro x64
Roland FA06, LX61+, Fishman Tripleplay, FaderPort, US-16x08 + ARC2.5/Event PS8s 
Waves Gold/IKM Max/Nomad Factory IS3/K11U

#9
Cactus Music
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8424
  • Joined: 2004/02/09 21:34:04
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/22 10:34:35 (permalink)
Ya I think rear ported monitors are actually I thing of the past. I can't say that I've ever seen a pair for a long time.  

Johnny V  
Cakelab  
Focusrite 6i61st - Tascam us1641. 
3 Desktops and 3 Laptops W7 and W10
 http://www.cactusmusic.ca/
 
 
#10
dwardzala
Max Output Level: -61 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1470
  • Joined: 2008/05/26 19:18:33
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/22 15:22:03 (permalink)
Yamaha HS line of monitors are rear ported.  I am sure there are others.

Dave
Main Studio- Core i5 @2.67GHz, 16Gb Ram, (2) 500Gb HDs, (1) 360 Gb HD
MotU Ultralite AVB, Axiom 49 Midi Controller, Akai MPD18 Midi Controller
Win10 x64 Home
Sonar 2017.06 Platinum (and X3e, X2c, X1d)
 
Mobile Studio - Sager NP8677 (i7-6700HQ @2.67MHz, 16G Ram, 250G SSD, 1T HD)
M-Box Mini v. 2
Win 10 x64 Home
Sonar 2016.10 Platinum
 
Check out my original music:
https://soundcloud.com/d-wardzala/sets/d-wardzala-original-music
 
 
#11
timidi
Max Output Level: -21 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 5449
  • Joined: 2006/04/11 12:55:15
  • Location: SE Florida
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/22 18:36:49 (permalink)
FWIW, Bob Katz says ported speakers are a no no.

ASUS P8P67, i7-2600K, CORSAIR 16GB, HIS 5450, 3 Samsung SSD 850, Win7 64, RME AIO.
 
https://timbowman.bandcamp.com/releases
 
#12
Kev999
Max Output Level: -36 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3922
  • Joined: 2007/05/01 14:22:54
  • Location: Victoria, Australia
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/22 19:54:18 (permalink)
Bristol_Jonesey
Most monitors by Adam are front ported

 
KRK too.

SonarPlatinum(22.11.0.111)|Mixbus32C(4.3.19)|DigitalPerformer(9.5.1)|Reaper(5.77)
FractalDesign:DefineR5|i7-6850k@4.1GHz|16GB@2666MHz-DDR4|MSI:GamingProCarbonX99a|Matrox:M9148(x2)|UAD2solo(6.5.2)|W7Ult-x64-SP1
Audient:iD22+ASP800|KRK:VXT6|+various-outboard-gear|+guitars&basses, etc.
Having fun at work lately
#13
fret_man
Max Output Level: -84 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 312
  • Joined: 2009/05/14 23:57:37
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/22 21:29:59 (permalink)
Yamaha MSP series is front ported.
#14
quantumeffect
Max Output Level: -47.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2771
  • Joined: 2007/07/22 21:29:42
  • Location: Minnesota
  • Status: offline
Re: Mixing with Studio Monitors and/or Professional Headphones 2017/02/22 22:59:20 (permalink)
I have a pair of these 80's era Tannoy System 8 NFM II speakers with concentric drivers.  I picked them up a few years ago and had them re-coned.  The are front ported (2 cylindrical ports) ... great speakers.
 
Also, I have a pair of first generation KRK Rocket 8's.  Also front ported (a wide slot) ... good speakers but a bit more on the cheap thrill side.
 
Bob Katz is not the only one who says ported speakers are a no - no.  The debate over the acoustic suspension (sealed) vs. bass reflex (ported) designs goes back to the original AR speakers of the 1950's.

Dave

8.5 PE 64, i7 Studio Cat, Delta 1010, GMS and Ludwig Drums, Paiste Cymbals

"Everyone knows rock n' roll attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact." H. Simpson

"His chops are too righteous."  Plankton during Sponge Bob's guitar solo 
#15
Jump to:
© 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1