Jonbouy
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/13 17:09:41
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Melodeath, the phenomenon that you were seeing here appears to be solved in 8.5.2.
HTH
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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RTGraham
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/14 10:16:56
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Jonbouy
Melodeath, the phenomenon that you were seeing here appears to be solved in 8.5.2.
HTH
I hesitate to ask this, because of the can of worms that may re-open, but... Can we take this bug-fix, and the fact that it was fixed at all, as validation of Melodeath's original question? 
~~~~~~~~~~ Russell T. Graham Keys, Vocals, Songwriting, Production russell DOT graham AT rtgproductions DOT com www DOT myspace DOT com SLASH russelltgraham
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Jonbouy
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/14 15:28:38
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Can we take this bug-fix, and the fact that it was fixed at all, as validation of Melodeath's original question? It certainly looks that way to me, which makes some of the answers even more amusing than they were at the time... 
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RTGraham
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/15 11:50:07
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Jonbouy
Can we take this bug-fix, and the fact that it was fixed at all, as validation of Melodeath's original question?
It certainly looks that way to me, which makes some of the answers even more amusing than they were at the time...
~~~~~~~~~~ Russell T. Graham Keys, Vocals, Songwriting, Production russell DOT graham AT rtgproductions DOT com www DOT myspace DOT com SLASH russelltgraham
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frankandfree
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/15 15:24:40
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Brilliant :D But I worry, ain't the sky blue anymore now and black isn't black? Do guitars still sound when CJ plays them? I couldn't care much less if -3+-3 ain't -6 anymore, but wouldn't that imply 1+1 != 0 ? The more I think about it the less I think it was a good idea to fix this.
post edited by frankandfree - 2009/12/15 16:07:47
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RTGraham
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/15 18:05:17
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frankandfree
Brilliant :D
But I worry, ain't the sky blue anymore now and black isn't black? Do guitars still sound when CJ plays them? I couldn't care much less if -3+-3 ain't -6 anymore, but wouldn't that imply 1+1 != 0 ? The more I think about it the less I think it was a good idea to fix this.
LOL. It's certainly a double-edged sword, and a difficult decision. Leave it "broken," or "break" the playback of old projects in favor of new ones being "correct"? Once more time has passed, "breaking" old projects will probably be less of an issue, and the benefits of "fixing" the pan law implementation will probably be seen to outweigh the negative aspects. We'll see though.
~~~~~~~~~~ Russell T. Graham Keys, Vocals, Songwriting, Production russell DOT graham AT rtgproductions DOT com www DOT myspace DOT com SLASH russelltgraham
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brundlefly
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/15 18:36:03
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It certainly looks that way to me, which makes some of the answers even more amusing than they were at the time... Kind of glad I wasn't paying attention to the forum at the time this thread went down. Seems there should be a flurry of "Sorry, Melodeath. You were right, and we were wrong." posts. The silence is deafening.  But kudos to the few who actually checked things out, and came to the conclusion that there was a problem. There's a lesson to be learned here on the dangers of groupthink, as opposed to the wisdom of crowds.
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The Maillard Reaction
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/15 18:53:38
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Actually, Jonbouy, RT GRahm and Brundlefly... you may easily see from this excerpt of the statement in the OP, "I thought maybe the answer was hidden in the panning controls. Sonar was on the first option, 0dB with sin/cos taper."
That Melodeath's observations were not catylized by the pan law bug that was fixed in Version 8.5.2. The bug and bug fix only effected non 0dB choices. Several of us stressed that the pan laws change the output levels of exports and mixes arbitrarily. We explained that while we did not necessarily know why this was so... we did recognize that the circumstance existed. As Noel has explained this bug has existed since Sonar version 4. What, exactly, are any of you suggesting should be the premise of an apology? Honestly, this seems a bit like deep sea fishing with the forum search engine. :-) best regards, mike
post edited by mike_mccue - 2009/12/15 19:13:41
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RTGraham
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/15 19:33:45
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mike_mccue
Actually,
Jonbouy, RT GRahm and Brundlefly... you may easily see from this excerpt of the statement in the OP,
"I thought maybe the answer was hidden in the panning controls. Sonar was on the first option, 0dB with sin/cos taper."
That Melodeath's observations were not catylized by the pan law bug that was fixed in Version 8.5.2.
The bug and bug fix only effected non 0dB choices.
Several of us stressed that the pan laws change the output levels of exports and mixes arbitrarily. We explained that while we did not necessarily know why this was so... we did recognize that the circumstance existed.
As Noel has explained this bug has existed since Sonar version 4.
What, exactly, are any of you suggesting should be the premise of an apology?
Honestly, this seems a bit like deep sea fishing with the forum search engine. :-)
best regards,
mike
<scratches head> Hmmm. Thanks for pointing that out, Mike. I hadn't looked *that* closely at the original post - only the new ones (and relied on memory for the rest of the thread - apparently a mistake). So does the new change in behavior not affect the original issue *at all* ?
~~~~~~~~~~ Russell T. Graham Keys, Vocals, Songwriting, Production russell DOT graham AT rtgproductions DOT com www DOT myspace DOT com SLASH russelltgraham
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The Maillard Reaction
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/15 20:00:31
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After a detailed re-read of the entire thread... I must point out that the OP does indeed make an accurate observation of the bug that was just fixed... and the observation does seem to be different from the results to be be expected if referencing altimaboy's charts. I do owe Melodeath an apology for my never really having understood the true narture of his original post. My previous post was a lame attempt to excuse my behaviour... and now I see where I made my error. So, I do apologize to Melodeath for my having been so... unnecessarily colorful. :-) I also owe Jonbouy a thank you for having pointed out the truth. all the best, mike
post edited by mike_mccue - 2009/12/15 22:16:18
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Jonbouy
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/15 20:50:51
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Mike
It wasn't a case of deep sea fishing at all the whole pan law ball of wax had me confused from this point on as I was finding similarly to MD and put it down to me not getting something that was on that chart.
That confusion had persisted all this time until I read about the 8.5.2 fix so really it has been a current issue with me since this thread, fortunately it put me off using anything other than the default 0db and I didn't need to send anything out meantime so I had nothing to fix.
As the OP wasn't around I figured it was time to flag it up as RESOLVED.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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The Maillard Reaction
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/15 22:10:43
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I was just dense in realizing that the old chart was not up to date... that never sunk in on my end.
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frankandfree
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/16 06:02:33
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Bravo. I appreciate that fine attitude, Mike.
Let's see if there's more gents that are able to admit they made a mistake in this thread.
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RTGraham
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/16 14:03:04
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mike_mccue
After a detailed re-read of the entire thread... I must point out that the OP does indeed make an accurate observation of the bug that was just fixed... and the observation does seem to be different from the results to be be expected if referencing altimaboy's charts.
I do owe Melodeath an apology for my never really having understood the true narture of his original post.
My previous post was a lame attempt to excuse my behaviour... and now I see where I made my error.
So, I do apologize to Melodeath for my having been so... unnecessarily colorful. :-)
I also owe Jonbouy a thank you for having pointed out the truth.
all the best,
mike
Oh, thank goodness. I was about to re-read the whole thread myself so that I could appropriately come and hang *my* head, but I guess it isn't necessary. I still will if y'all want, though.
~~~~~~~~~~ Russell T. Graham Keys, Vocals, Songwriting, Production russell DOT graham AT rtgproductions DOT com www DOT myspace DOT com SLASH russelltgraham
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Jonbouy
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RE: Mono bouncing Louder
2009/12/16 14:46:30
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Jonbouy
If I adopt a one-sided point of view, (say the left channel), and keep repeating it, will it have more emphasis than two people (stereo) replying to me with the same answers?
If not what pan law would I need to adopt in order that it did have more emphasis?
Perhaps there is a way of aligning them in phase so they cancel each other out, is that possible at all?....
RT No need to read it all again I made a brief synopsis at the time...
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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