SvenArne
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New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
I'm noticing that certain aspects of X1 (most notably the console view as well as the inspector) are noticably more sluggish than before. But then again my graphics adaptor is the oldest part in my computer (from 2005, I believe), so it might be time to upgrade. Which cards would be recommended to take full advantage of the new graphics enhancements?
Sven
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benstat
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 12:49:17
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I'm sure you would be absolutely fine with any modern ATI or nVidia based card that is capable of running the Windows Aero user interface for Vista and Win7. Assuming you don't want to use it for anything else (like games) of course. If it can run Aero comfortably, then Sonar won't stretch it much because I don't believe it takes advantage of any special GPU acceleration (yet) over and above what a normal Windows app does.
post edited by benstat - 2010/12/14 12:51:31
My DAW: Intel i5, Cakewalk UA-1G, Win7 64 bit, SONAR X1a Producer 64 bit
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Freddie H
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 12:53:10
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-Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds. -It really matters!
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Frank Haas
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 13:03:16
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2005 ?
is it a an AGP, PCI or PCIe slot you are using ? Do you have a PCIe slot ?
What size is your monitor and what is its native resolution ?
are you sure that a new graphiccard will solve your issue ?
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Freddie H
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 13:08:17
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-Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds. -It really matters!
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Frank Haas
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 13:27:57
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over 50% of those mentioned chipsets are for laptops..
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SvenArne
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 13:50:04
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Frank Haas
2005 ?
is it a an AGP, PCI or PCIe slot you are using ? Do you have a PCIe slot ?
What size is your monitor and what is its native resolution ?
are you sure that a new graphiccard will solve your issue ?
It's a Nvidia 7600GS PCIe card. I'm not certain a new card will fix it, but I'm curious as to what Cake means by that X1 is engineered to take advantage of modern GPUs. The console wasn't sluggish inside SONAR 8.5, so I'm guessing it has something to do with the new graphics engine. Sven
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djtrailmixxx
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 13:54:21
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SvenArne
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 14:04:30
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That looks interesting (and cheap and fanless) djtrailmixxx. I should mention that I'm on XP32 (but of course, won't be forever).
Have the bakers said anything specific on how the new graphics engine interacts with GPUs and which ones they recommend?
The sluggishness I mentioned seems pretty much unrelated to CPU load and project size. I have an Intel Q8550 CPU and 4GB of RAM so I should be in the clear, spec-wise.
Sven
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benstat
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 14:26:31
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By coincidence, I used to own an nVidia 7600GS in my last PC. I bought it because it was the bare minimum required for supporting Aero with Vista at the time. Things have moved on a bit since then, so I'm sure you would benefit from something a bit more powerful.
However, before upgrading, have you tried updating your graphics driver. I have seen different graphics drivers make a HUGE difference in my time.
As to the difference between nVidia or ATI, I have owned mid to high range versions of both. The only significant differences, in terms of performance etc, are only really apparent when you are dealing with high end graphic apps and games. For a Windows app with no special GPU accelleration requirements, I would say you would be fine with either. I'm using ATI at the moment with no problems at all - in games or in Sonar.
My DAW: Intel i5, Cakewalk UA-1G, Win7 64 bit, SONAR X1a Producer 64 bit
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SvenArne
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 14:38:28
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benstat
For a Windows app with no special GPU accelleration requirements, I would say you would be fine with either. I'm using ATI at the moment with no problems at all - in games or in Sonar.
Thanks for your input! My question is DOES X1 have 'special GPU acceleration requirements'? What's implied by Cakewalk new under-the-hood graphics engine improvements? They do mention taking advantage of the GPU. Sven
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Scott Lee
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 14:56:32
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Hi Sven,
If X! is using "CUDA" which is nvidias GPU hardware acceleration, I'd go nvidia. Personally I've had this 9800 GTX from nvidia and love it. GPU accelation in photoshop CS5 is out of this world.
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...wicked
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 15:54:24
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I have the same GPU and the same query, so this thread is very interesting!
Looking at the other threads, in addition I think I'd need to upgrade my monitors to take advantage of this new release. At least one of them.
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djtrailmixxx
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 16:07:03
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Scott Lee
Hi Sven,
If X! is using "CUDA" which is nvidias GPU hardware acceleration, I'd go nvidia. Personally I've had this 9800 GTX from nvidia and love it. GPU accelation in photoshop CS5 is out of this world.
Cuda is only for calculation assistance, which in PhotoShop shows up in the form of video encode/decode acceleration and FX rendering, not GUI stuff (if I recall correctly). Personally, Id like to see OpenCL adopted over CUDA. Oh well CUDA has been around for a bit longer.
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djtrailmixxx
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 16:11:41
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SvenArne
That looks interesting (and cheap and fanless) djtrailmixxx. I should mention that I'm on XP32 (but of course, won't be forever).
Have the bakers said anything specific on how the new graphics engine interacts with GPUs and which ones they recommend?
The sluggishness I mentioned seems pretty much unrelated to CPU load and project size. I have an Intel Q8550 CPU and 4GB of RAM so I should be in the clear, spec-wise.
Sven
XP 32 will not take much advantage of the GPU display acceleration wise, not like an AERO gui will. I have not heard about any HW requirements for thier new GUI. I have a pretty modern system with an ATI 5870 (noisy lil bastard, but I game somtimes) and switching screensets seems to have some more lag than the old GUI views, but this may be improved. I think that with all of the code and GUI changes, they are still optimising. Its surprising howmuch a new codebase will muck up the works.
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Scott Lee
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 16:12:05
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"Cuda is only for calculation assistance"
Yes, I know. I made a big post about CUDA and using the GPU for audio processing. What I was saying is, if X! goes down the line of GPU hardware processing support, an Nvdia card would be the way to go.
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djtrailmixxx
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 17:16:39
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Scott Lee
"Cuda is only for calculation assistance"
Yes, I know. I made a big post about CUDA and using the GPU for audio processing. What I was saying is, if X! goes down the line of GPU hardware processing support, an Nvdia card would be the way to go.
Sure, it will be nice when all functions which can benifit from GPU acceleration do so.
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 17:18:07
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While you don't need a high-end gamer card to run SONAR X1's new graphics engine, a reasonably new series card with a good amount of RAM (especially at high resolutions) will provide smoother graphics. Anything from the AMD 3000, 4000, 5000, or 6000 series should be fine as would anything from the nVidia 8000, 9000, 100, 200, 300, or 400 series. What I'd look for is a card with 1gig of RAM at least, no fan, and multiple digital outputs (DVI, HDMI, or Display Port). There's lots of fanboi-ism in the gaming world when it comes to video cards, but in the DAW world the brand of the GPU really doesn't matter. It's all about finding the right card with the right specs at the right price. If you happen to have a preference of either brand, that's fine, but one really won't perform better than the other. And X1 does not use CUDA or any part of the GPU for audio processing. If you want modified graphics cards that process plugins then get some UAD cards.  And then expect to deal with the downside of adding DSP cards to a native host, like latency. 
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 17:19:51
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Oh, and FWIW the cards I've got in my systems are 2 x AMD HD4350 1gig (fanless and dual DVI) and also 2 x nVidia 8600GS 1gig (fanless and dual DVI). They both run X1 exactly the same.
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SvenArne
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 17:51:03
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Thank you for this info, Seth! So you do believe that my old graphics card with little RAM is indeed the reason for the visual sluggishness even in XP32?
If so I'm off to get a new one! Hope this doesn't have the side-effect of me taking up gaming, though. I have enough distractions as it is...
Sven
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 17:57:11
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Sven, Yes, I would bet that upgrading your GPU will solve your issue. Again, you don't need a high-end card, just something with at least 1gig of RAM form the modern families of AMD or nVidia cards. If possible, purchase from a store that allows returns in case your issue persists. Here in the States we have a chain called Fry's which absolutely rocks for this.
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Freddie H
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 17:58:49
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Sven! Don't bother to buy any lower then NVIDIA 9600 GT-series or ATI-chip. The NVIDIA drivers and control panels are far more advance then ATI's. Also all 3part reviews and benchmark tests, NVIDIA run over all ATI products and back up twice and run it over again. That's why APPLE today only delvier their products only with NVIDIA-cards. ASUS NVIDIA 9600 GT you can find in HEATSINK-version fanless. Best Regards Freddie
post edited by Freddie H - 2010/12/14 18:00:50
-Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds. -It really matters!
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 18:16:54
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Freddie, with all due respect, the battle between nVidia's and AMD's GPUs is a constant back and forth. One cycle nVidia has the lead, like when the 200 series came out. The next cycle AMD has the lead, like when the 5000 series came out. FWIW the benchmarks you see for GPUs are completely irrelevant for DAWs. Those benchmarks show the GPUs ability to do things in video games. A cards ability to compute 3d shaders and tessellation has nothing to do with DAWs. Apple has gone back and forth over the years between AMD and nVidia cards. The one thing that remains constant for them is that they always ship their products with outdated video cards and very rarely, if ever, offer the top of the line models. But then again, who uses their computers for gaming?  In my experience I've found the AMD and nVidia control panels to have the same feature set and abilities. I actually prefer AMD's Catalyst Control Center, but that's just personal preference. All the settings that are in the CCC are in nVidia's control panel, and vice versa.  In the end, for a DAW, finding a fanless solution with multiple digital outputs is far more important than what brand it is. Just make sure its a recent card with enough memory and you'll be fine.
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Freddie H
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 18:29:35
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True Seth! But why not go with best NVIDIA! LOL If you into Tuning your COLOR settings you can do that more VIVID with NVIDA-control panel. Best Regards Freddie
post edited by Freddie H - 2010/12/14 18:31:04
-Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds. -It really matters!
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 18:31:08
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Freddie H
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ducatibruce2
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 19:35:25
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Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk
]
Sven,
Yes, I would bet that upgrading your GPU will solve your issue. Again, you don't need a high-end card, just something with at least 1gig of RAM form the modern families of AMD or nVidia cards.
If possible, purchase from a store that allows returns in case your issue persists. Here in the States we have a chain called Fry's which absolutely rocks for this.
Seth, Does the 1Gig memory suggestion apply to XP32 (ie without Aero)?
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Karyn
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 19:48:47
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So if we're not going to see CUDA support in the near future, how long before get to use our GTX580 to display the console view in full photoreal 3D ( I mean real 3D) with audio clips floating by over the top like a shoal of fish in mid air?
(ok, maybe I need to log off and go to bed now...)
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A1MixMan
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 19:50:24
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djtrailmixxx
I reccomend this: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102882
NVIDIA drivers are responsible for the majority of BSODs in Windows since Vista and now Win 7
How do you know this? Is this a fact? Is there more info somewhere on this? I have NVIDIA 9600GT in Win7 do have some crashes now and then.
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koikane
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Re:New graphics card to take advantage of new GPU support. Recommendations?
2010/12/14 20:26:51
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Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk
]
Oh, and FWIW the cards I've got in my systems are 2 x AMD HD4350 1gig (fanless and dual DVI) and also 2 x nVidia 8600GS 1gig (fanless and dual DVI). They both run X1 exactly the same.
Good to see some recommendations. My card is definately not fanless and is a bit old as well. Can somebody that is a bit more tech savvy help me with a reccomendation for a new video card. A link to my mobo's info is http://www.intel.com/cd/channel/reseller/asmo-na/eng/products/desktop/bdb/dg33fb/feature/index.htm. My computer specs are below. The most confusing part to me is if the card will work with my mobo. Any help would be great. I need to have a dual output as I currently have two monitors. Thank you,
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