Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30

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Rasure
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2017/09/19 02:48:26 (permalink)

Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30

As title suggests, I went to normalize some vocal clips in a song I`m working on and it really messed up. Did this video test to show what I mean.
 
Steps to reproduce: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5tQxFQdXF4
 
*EDIT: (for reproduction)
For this test I simply opened a blank project, inserted an audio track then recorded some test vocals. *Crop recorded audio (not split just crop) after cropping, split them into clips, did some fades (although it makes no difference if you do that or not) selected them all to normalize and as you can see the results are in the video. 
 
post edited by Rasure - 2017/09/19 16:34:48

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#1

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    bitflipper
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 03:03:19 (permalink)
    Yeh, that was pretty durn weird. I was unable to duplicate that behavior here, though.


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    #2
    Anderton
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 03:28:11 (permalink)
    Let's try a diagnostic. Make a copy of the project if it contains material you don't want to lose. Please bounce each clip to itself, try to normalize again, and report back with what happens. 

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
    #3
    Rasure
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 03:36:59 (permalink)
    If you bounce the clips after splitting, but still keep them as separate clips its works as expected. It seems to be when you just split them, then normalize. Odd. 

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    ccm
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 03:49:20 (permalink)
    This was reported here in 2016-  http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3512358
    Seems to be the same problem.
    #5
    Rasure
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 14:20:36 (permalink)
    Not just me then! :-)

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    Anderton
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 15:09:15 (permalink)
    Rasure
    If you bounce the clips after splitting, but still keep them as separate clips its works as expected. It seems to be when you just split them, then normalize. Odd. 



    The clip is just a graphic representation of a piece of audio, not the audio itself. When you normalize a clip, it's pointing to the entire audio file containing that clip. So clips may be normalized to audio that you can't see. Bouncing the clip to itself makes it independent of the file from which it came.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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    Rasure
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 15:42:57 (permalink)
    Yeah I realise that, but it shouldn't mess with the audio, it randomly changes the order of the actual audio clips, as demonstrated in the video, not good. The only workaround is to bounce to individual clips after splitting, time consuming and unnecessary IMO.
     
    EDIT: Seems to happen on audio files that are cropped, if you do it on a file that`s directly imported, split in to sections then normalize, its fine. If you imported audio file, crop, then split in to sections and normalize, that`s where the issues happen.
     
    Steps to reproduce: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5tQxFQdXF4 
    post edited by Rasure - 2017/09/19 16:35:07

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    bitflipper
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 17:06:33 (permalink)
    I tested this by importing a 1000 Hz mono sine with a peak of -6 dB, and then duplicating it twice. I used Process -> Gain to lower the first clone to -7 dB, the second clone to -8 dB. I then selected all three and used Process -> Normalize to set them all to -3 dB, and then verified that they all do in fact now peak at -3 dB.
     
    I tried selecting them three ways: selecting the track, ctl-click on each clip, and dragging a selection box around them. How they were selected made no difference.
     
    I also tried normalizing to a lower peak, -10 dB, and that also worked as expected: all three clips peaked at -10 dB.
     
    I then split the clips to see if that made a difference, as described above. It didn't.
     
    I've run out of ways to test this. Whatever's going on here, it has to be data-specific. Want to send me a test project so I can try it on the same data?


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    #9
    Rasure
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 17:20:38 (permalink)
    Thanks Bitflipper, uploaded new video for steps to reproduce https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5tQxFQdXF4 happens when you crop the clip after import then split and normalize. No issues when no cropping is involved on imported clips :-) 
     

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    Anderton
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 17:36:34 (permalink)
    I was able to reproduce the behavior in the video, but I also think I've found a workaround to avoid having to bounce each clip. It worked every time for me, can you please try it and confirm.
     
    1. Crop the clip (beginning and end)
    2. Bounce the resulting clip to itself
    3. Apply trimming to the resulting clip
     
    Now if you separate it into multiple clips, select all of them, and then normalize, it works...or at least it did here.

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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    THambrecht
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 18:18:04 (permalink)
    I have posted this problem a several times over the last years.
    It happens when an audioclip is not one - or a part of an audiofile - but of 2 or more audiofiles.
    If you right-click on one of this clips and choose "associated audio files" it lists 2 or more files.
    Then this often happens.
    So bouncing to itself - to one audiofile - is the solution.
    But this should be repaired.

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    Rasure
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 18:41:48 (permalink)
    Anderton
    I was able to reproduce the behavior in the video, but I also think I've found a workaround to avoid having to bounce each clip. It worked every time for me, can you please try it and confirm.
     
    1. Crop the clip (beginning and end)
    2. Bounce the resulting clip to itself
    3. Apply trimming to the resulting clip
     
    Now if you separate it into multiple clips, select all of them, and then normalize, it works...or at least it did here.


    Thanks, still not right though. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHHnIzz3onI it`s the cropping that does it.
     
    @THambrecht yes it should be fixed.

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    Anderton
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/19 23:06:28 (permalink)
    Rasure
    Thanks, still not right though. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHHnIzz3onI it`s the cropping that does it.

     
    You didn't do step 3 to trim the clip (Clips > Apply Trimming).

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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    Rasure
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/20 14:23:57 (permalink)
    Yeah it works if you apply Trimming, still needs to be fixed :-)
     

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    Anderton
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/20 14:36:33 (permalink)
    Well it's not going to get fixed within the next week, and if you follow my steps you don't have to bounce every clip individually...saves a lot of clicks.
     
    Has anyone submitted a bug report with recipe to reproduce, or do I need to do that?

    The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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    THambrecht
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/20 17:39:59 (permalink)
    My projects are all too big for Cakewalk to reproduce.
    I had the same problem today. Not only normalizing, rather "GAIN" is producing corrupt audiodata in the same situation. My project today has 46GB audiodata.
    I had submitted a bug report with pictures (a few years ago) - but with no project to reproduce. I had already a few situations, where "apply trimming" and bouncing to itself no more helps.
     
     

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    bitman
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/22 01:26:21 (permalink)
    Yeah that's an old one.
     
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    Rasure
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/23 20:50:52 (permalink)
    Anderton
    Well it's not going to get fixed within the next week, and if you follow my steps you don't have to bounce every clip individually...saves a lot of clicks.
     
    Has anyone submitted a bug report with recipe to reproduce, or do I need to do that?


    I couldn't find the the page to submit to, maybe move this thread to the Problem reports forum? 

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    Rasure
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/23 20:50:59 (permalink)
    Double post

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    ampfixer
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/24 02:33:30 (permalink)
    We don't have bug reports. They were eliminated when support was re-imagined.

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    scook
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    Re: Normalize Bug Sonar Platinum V 23-08-0 Build 30 2017/09/24 03:04:44 (permalink)
    Open a tech support ticket
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