35mm
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 19:20:42
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dappa1
Bandlab will allow Sonar users to crossgrade to an old DAW for free. A familiar DAW for all those old ones who don't like change. It will not move in a new direction and because those who have a stronghold will not allow the product to flourish cos they are stuck in their ways. Is that better 35mm?
Did you see each monthly update as a brand new DAW? I don't have anything against change or development. You seem to be having difficulty comprehending - father.
Splat, Win 10 64bit and all sorts of musical odds and sods collected over the years, but still missing a lot of my old analogue stuff I sold off years ago.
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35mm
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 19:23:41
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jafo360
Maybe I am missing it somewhere, but I still can not find any information about a permanent authorization code for Platinum for those of us using Command Center. Should I do an offline activation of my current software?
I don't think there has been anything specific mentioned about that, but the servers are staying up and I imagine the latest release will use the same system so I am sure we will be fine going forward.
Splat, Win 10 64bit and all sorts of musical odds and sods collected over the years, but still missing a lot of my old analogue stuff I sold off years ago.
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dappa1
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 19:32:56
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35mm
dappa1
Bandlab will allow Sonar users to crossgrade to an old DAW for free. A familiar DAW for all those old ones who don't like change. It will not move in a new direction and because those who have a stronghold will not allow the product to flourish cos they are stuck in their ways. Is that better 35mm?
Did you see each monthly update as a brand new DAW? I don't have anything against change or development. You seem to be having difficulty comprehending - father.
You are being silly now -Son
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dappa1
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 19:37:07
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---- UPDATE 3/3/2018 ---- Just wanted to drop everybody a note for the start of the weekend. Thank you again for the words of encouragement and support, it means a lot to the team and gets everyone excited! A lot of progress has been made this week and I'm looking forward to being able to share details with all of you officially in the coming weeks :-) In the past week, a lot of things have now been finalized and I'm excited to say that this will allow us to get the first iteration of our the new flagship product into circulation much sooner than expected. What I can confirm today (and apologies to those who are big fans of it) is that it won't be called SONAR. For the time being, we can all refer to it as TDDFKAS ( The Desktop DAW Formerly Known As SONAR)  until we have a proper announcement about it. Though I am a big fan of the name, I mentioned in my first note that there are some issues with continuing to use the name SONAR. For those who want to know why - apart from the problems with SEO, the complexity in the way the IP was transacted (not taking on the ongoing company) means that it could be altogether too confusing to have SONAR as the name for people who had done business with the previous company as well as in parallel with the legacy site which we would like to keep up for reference. The plus side of this, however, is that the new installation will not affect your older versions of SPLAT (not the new name haha). We've already got a firm timeline in mind internally already and are prepping our press releases & announcements which will be within the next 4-6 weeks, if not sooner. Can't wait to share with you all (especially existing SONAR users) what lies ahead for our beloved DAW - in case you've missed my posts around the place, it will absolutely be a desktop application so please don't worry about it becoming (cloud/web)-only.  For those who don't read...post from Meng (dappa1)
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SuperG
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 19:37:53
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I'm sure Meng and crew are putting together a product "roadmap" for the yet-to-be-named DAW... we'll get it when it's ready and not before...
You yapper-heads can carry on speculating....
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Brian Walton
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 20:14:38
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dappa1
Brian Walton
dappa1
It would be really sad if they are basing their new Flagship DAW based on the bugs that are still in the old DAW. I would expect some change to the code in its new form. I would not expect it to look similar but have similar features that we all know and love. But I do expect it to be a NEW DAW. There would be no incentive for new customers if it is solely based on what we have already.
dappa1
Yes I have SPLAT I also paid for lifetime updates. I will be happy with the crossgrade. I also have Studio One 3
So I guess I'm winning all the way around.
BTW. Brian Walton i am sharing ideas no need to be so touchy. However, in the future I would like to see a radical change in the way Sonar acts and performs. Don't you?
Many of your posts suggest an overhaul. You say things like "new DAW" most people would argue that Sonar 2017.05 and 2017.07 did not constitute a new DAW, but an update.
That is what most of us expect this new product to be generally speaking. Not a GUI overhaul, not a bunch of major new workflows, or major changes to the code. These are all assets to what Sonar was, it would be foolish to change them. Not to mention impossible in a short amount of time. It is safe to say you don't work as a Programmer.
As for the question would you like to see a radical change in the way sonar acts and performs....tweaks for it to run more efficiently (such as the load balancing idea they came up with), of course, but I don't experience a bunch of bugs or inefficiencies in my workflow using the product, so why would I want a major change?
I certainly don't want to learn a brand new system, otherwise I would have jumped ship with the cross grade offers that were being thrown around.
I expect future development, not a complete overhaul that throws away the last 7 years of progress with the Skylight interface, which is class leading, IMO.
Brian, Brian, Brian...have you read Meng's update. This is what I am referring to when I put up this post. Rebranding to some is classified as new with a new signature doesnt mean the content will change but they will be some variation. In the future they will be changes. Obviously if Meng is saying they maybe a cross grade withing four weeks then it goes with out saying that it is not an overhaul. Hence I asked the question in the FIRST PLACE will it include new VST's and Plugins. They may be additional but I do expect a new DAW to not be as buggy as the old one. 
Of course I read his post, and I believe I read it more carefully than you did given your posts about the change in code that pretty clearly overlooked what he was talking about. I think very few people would call a rebranding "new." Even your edited OP, suggests you want truly new things...and bright shinny things. Again, I get a strong feeling you don't understand coding. The vast majority of "bugs" are still going to be in the new platform as that is part of the code. Each of the previous monthly updates worked to try to address and eliminate a few of them. It is completely unreasonable to think that is going to magically disappear when they re-name the product and change just a few bits of code. (I'll say it again, I don't find Sonar to be buggy). I also don't expect an overhaul or many new plugins, only perhaps something Sonar previously had in the works but didn't put out there yet. In time, they will likely develop some, but this "new DAW" you speak of isn't going to have a bunch of new stuff along those lines out of the gate. They didn't hire on the entire previous Cakewalk team. I'm actually expecting a less complete package with less 3rd party things in the box. That stuff drives the cost of the product up. But the core will likely be basically the same thing to a very large extent, and that is a great thing.
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cparmerlee
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 20:24:57
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Brian Walton
I'm actually expecting a less complete package with less 3rd party things in the box. That stuff drives the cost of the product up. But the core will likely be basically the same thing to a very large extent, and that is a great thing.
I am also expecting the same. I understand vendors have a motivation to bundle a bunch of plug-ins so that they can claim "a complete music production system right out of the box." But the reality is that while I use some of the Cakewalk VSTs and VSTis, I really don't use much of the others. I use mostly Izotope for the effects, and a few Waves plugs for specific things. I think most of the long-term SONAR users are in a similar situation, having gone with other plug-ins they are most comfortable with. I thought Cakewalk was looking in a positive direction when they wanted to develop the tools to collect musical ideas outside of the DAW directly. This seems like the kind of thing Bandlab is involved with. I'd expect to see some of these things integrate with SONAR (or whatever it will be called), with less of the new development being "DAW features" per se. Also note that Bandlab is also a product distribution channel, primarily for Asia. That would seem to have some implications beyond what SONAR has been in the past.
DAW: SONAR Platinum Audio I/F: Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 gen2
OS: Windows 10 64-bit CPU: Haswell 4790 4.0 GHz, 4 core, 8 thread Memory: 16 GB Video: GTX-760Ti
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jafo360
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 20:47:01
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35mm
jafo360
Maybe I am missing it somewhere, but I still can not find any information about a permanent authorization code for Platinum for those of us using Command Center. Should I do an offline activation of my current software?
I don't think there has been anything specific mentioned about that, but the servers are staying up and I imagine the latest release will use the same system so I am sure we will be fine going forward.
Thanks for the reply. Statements like "it will absolutely be a desktop application" are clear and concise. Statements like "will not affect" are some what vague compared to something like " older versions will still be authorized for use". I just wanted to be certain I was not missing anything. There are many statements, posts, and replies to read through. Thanks again.
Sonar Platinum Win 10 Focusrite 8i6 Intel i5 3.5 Ghz
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Paul G
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 20:52:57
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I may have missed it, but I haven't seen anything definite about Melodyne, (ARA), being included in the new version of the "DAW Formerly Known as Sonar". This is a big issue for me. I do have the full 'stand-alone' version of Melodyne Studio, but ARA is very important to me going forward.
Any info? I do hope there are talks with Celemony happening.
Thanks.
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John T
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 20:58:51
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☄ Helpfulby Paul G 2018/03/04 21:05:46
I'm pretty sure that there are no licensing costs in supporting ARA; it's just a protocol that developers can suppport if they want to. The only licensing issue would be around bundling Melodyne itself.
http://johntatlockaudio.com/Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
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Paul G
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 21:05:40
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John T
I'm pretty sure that there are no licensing costs in supporting ARA; it's just a protocol that developers can suppport if they want to. The only licensing issue would be around bundling Melodyne itself.
Thanks John. I hope the new owner will continue to support ARA! I think I saw where there are updates to it coming from Celemony. Paul
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Skyline_UK
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 21:21:59
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dappa1
Skyline have you read Meng's update?
Absolutely. That's what prompted my ponderings.
My stuff Intel Sandy Bridge i7 2600 @ 3.4GHz, 4 cores, 8 threads, 16GB RAM.OS & Programs drive: 240GB SSD
Data drives: 1 x 1TB drive RAID mirrored, plus extra 1TB data drive
Windows 10 Home 64 bit
Cakewalk by BandLab 64 bit, Studio One 3, Band In A Box 2016, Ozone 8+ too many other pluginsBandLab page
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dappa1
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 21:27:41
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Brian Walton
dappa1
Brian Walton
dappa1
It would be really sad if they are basing their new Flagship DAW based on the bugs that are still in the old DAW. I would expect some change to the code in its new form. I would not expect it to look similar but have similar features that we all know and love. But I do expect it to be a NEW DAW. There would be no incentive for new customers if it is solely based on what we have already.
dappa1
Yes I have SPLAT I also paid for lifetime updates. I will be happy with the crossgrade. I also have Studio One 3
So I guess I'm winning all the way around.
BTW. Brian Walton i am sharing ideas no need to be so touchy. However, in the future I would like to see a radical change in the way Sonar acts and performs. Don't you?
Many of your posts suggest an overhaul. You say things like "new DAW" most people would argue that Sonar 2017.05 and 2017.07 did not constitute a new DAW, but an update.
That is what most of us expect this new product to be generally speaking. Not a GUI overhaul, not a bunch of major new workflows, or major changes to the code. These are all assets to what Sonar was, it would be foolish to change them. Not to mention impossible in a short amount of time. It is safe to say you don't work as a Programmer.
As for the question would you like to see a radical change in the way sonar acts and performs....tweaks for it to run more efficiently (such as the load balancing idea they came up with), of course, but I don't experience a bunch of bugs or inefficiencies in my workflow using the product, so why would I want a major change?
I certainly don't want to learn a brand new system, otherwise I would have jumped ship with the cross grade offers that were being thrown around.
I expect future development, not a complete overhaul that throws away the last 7 years of progress with the Skylight interface, which is class leading, IMO.
Brian, Brian, Brian...have you read Meng's update. This is what I am referring to when I put up this post. Rebranding to some is classified as new with a new signature doesnt mean the content will change but they will be some variation. In the future they will be changes. Obviously if Meng is saying they maybe a cross grade withing four weeks then it goes with out saying that it is not an overhaul. Hence I asked the question in the FIRST PLACE will it include new VST's and Plugins. They may be additional but I do expect a new DAW to not be as buggy as the old one.
Of course I read his post, and I believe I read it more carefully than you did given your posts about the change in code that pretty clearly overlooked what he was talking about.
I think very few people would call a rebranding "new." Even your edited OP, suggests you want truly new things...and bright shinny things.
Again, I get a strong feeling you don't understand coding. The vast majority of "bugs" are still going to be in the new platform as that is part of the code. Each of the previous monthly updates worked to try to address and eliminate a few of them. It is completely unreasonable to think that is going to magically disappear when they re-name the product and change just a few bits of code. (I'll say it again, I don't find Sonar to be buggy). I also don't expect an overhaul or many new plugins, only perhaps something Sonar previously had in the works but didn't put out there yet. In time, they will likely develop some, but this "new DAW" you speak of isn't going to have a bunch of new stuff along those lines out of the gate. They didn't hire on the entire previous Cakewalk team.
I'm actually expecting a less complete package with less 3rd party things in the box. That stuff drives the cost of the product up. But the core will likely be basically the same thing to a very large extent, and that is a great thing.
You are thinking with the mindset of upgrade rather than cross grade
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dappa1
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 21:31:24
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John T
I'm pretty sure that there are no licensing costs in supporting ARA; it's just a protocol that developers can support if they want to. The only licensing issue would be around bundling Melodyne itself.
Now this is helpful the voice of reason John T
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RajahP
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 21:40:41
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Will Project 5 come out of retirement under Bandlab? Will love to see more 'Performance' features included as we go forward... Along with a Project 5 iOs version.... And Ableton Link on Sonar (Or whatever the new name for it is).
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cparmerlee
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 22:28:49
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Paul G
I hope the new owner will continue to support ARA! I think I saw where there are updates to it coming from Celemony.
I am sure they will. It is a big differentiator versus Cubase.
DAW: SONAR Platinum Audio I/F: Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 gen2
OS: Windows 10 64-bit CPU: Haswell 4790 4.0 GHz, 4 core, 8 thread Memory: 16 GB Video: GTX-760Ti
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Faza_TCM
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 22:29:10
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For me, ideally, the new DAW - whatever it turns out to be - would have all the basic SONAR functionality (shouldn't be a problem, given it's what BandLab paid for), possibly including some changes to facilitate whatever direction BandLab wants to take it in the future. I wouldn't be surprised if there are some outstanding code changes by the last team that didn't ship before Gibson pulled the plug, so we may get a couple fixes or whatever. I'm not expecting too much to change, given the timeline. In terms of plugins and whatnot, I'm hoping all the old Cakewalk stuff (especially ProChannel modules) continues to work. Luckily, I ended up upgrading most of the stuff I really cared about (TH3, Melodyne, Rematrix, BReverb) to full versions, so it's just the Cakewalk stuff that's up in the air. Blue Tubes? Can't say I've ever really found much use for those plugins. I'm fine if they stay, won't cry if they don't (besides, I'm not sure if they're in that much danger of going away, if you already have them). 35mm
It's also tricky to work out what they could do about making it cross-platform which would ultimately be an advantage to the company - Bandlab. It would take a lot of investment, but maybe now would be the time to make that investment and perhaps release a multi-platform version next year. That could then change Sonar completely as to maintain a cross-platform product would require some changes to the code base. Although, that wouldn't be noticeable to us.
The good news on that front is that - while not a completely solved problem - there's been a lot of work done in the area of cross-platform code over the past several years. Without a detailed knowledge of the codebase, I really couldn't say how much work it would take to make a post-SONAR DAW cross-platform, but I'm guessing it's pretty doable if there's a will to do it. Also a good reason to refactor the code to allow maximum sharing between versions, which would doubtless be of great benefit.
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chuckebaby
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 22:34:17
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☄ Helpfulby backwoods 2018/03/04 23:17:10
dappa1
Are you not able to comprehend,
yeaaaaa. Okay.
Windows 8.1 X64 Sonar Platinum x64 Custom built: Asrock z97 1150 - Intel I7 4790k - 16GB corsair DDR3 1600 - PNY SSD 220GBFocusrite Saffire 18I8 - Mackie Control
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dappa1
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 22:59:06
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chuckebaby
dappa1
Are you not able to comprehend,
yeaaaaa. Okay.
Have you got any songs PS credible material. I would like to hear some lol
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35mm
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 23:13:04
(permalink)
Why the hell start a thread and then attack anyone who tries to respond to it? Rather than constructive replies, you just repeat yourself incessantly, saying people haven't read the update or can't comprehend you. I sure as hell can't comprehend you. You talk a load of bollocks!
Splat, Win 10 64bit and all sorts of musical odds and sods collected over the years, but still missing a lot of my old analogue stuff I sold off years ago.
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dappa1
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 23:15:59
(permalink)
35mm
jafo360
Maybe I am missing it somewhere, but I still can not find any information about a permanent authorization code for Platinum for those of us using Command Center. Should I do an offline activation of my current software?
I don't think there has been anything specific mentioned about that, but the servers are staying up and I imagine the latest release will use the same system so I am sure we will be fine going forward.
Are you a guitarist?
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backwoods
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/04 23:18:05
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if there is a new "flagship daw" i hope all the people who left to "greener pastures" just stay away forever
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Kamikaze
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/05 00:03:36
(permalink)
Re-Branding I'm expecting more than just re-branding, because this would be a project fr the graphics dept, not the bakers. With Theme Editor I was able to 're-brand' in a few weeks the Control bar using art software. This is all I expect, the same format in new style that matches Meng's Bandlab Portfolio.  Bug Fixes They would have had bug fixes ready for November and some in place for December. So we'd probably get these and anything that can be fixed that is in the same area and new develpment New Develpement (features) To make the release more than just a re-brand, they will want to sing abut something that shows that the software I something different. Features in line for November, and Decembers could be completed, we don't know what they had planned. If I were Meng I would have sat down with Noel and said 'OK show me the medium term goals. What do we think will 'pop' in a re-launch. Lets make them a pirity' One thing in the pipeline with Melodyne is ARA2. Melodyne have said: "ARA 2 was developed in collaboration with established as well as new ARA partners" So Cakewalk could have been planning a feature to coincide with the new ARA2 release, which is abut now. Remember how quick they gave us Extract Tempo Map when the other Melodyne DAW partner StudioOne had it after an ARA update. It was like 10 days. "ARA 2 specification allows, among other things, the simultaneous editing of multiple tracks, the transfer of chord track information between the DAW and the plug-in" One much requested feature was a Chord track, so if this was in the pipeline with discussions with Melodyne as they have implied, then this a a pretty good feature to sing about, to show that it's mre than just a re-branding. http://www.celemony.com/en/pm-ara2 Surely Meng want's to make a splash with this launch
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sharke
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/05 00:09:21
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backwoods
if there is a new "flagship daw" i hope all the people who left to "greener pastures" just stay away forever
Where does the bitterness come from
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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mariogag
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/05 01:19:22
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What if it's only going to be just a simple new launch page showing the new product name with bandlab written sonewhere on it....(-:
I'm just happy to know that we may no longer have to worry about a Windowa update killing something without having sw support to deal with it.
meng, please don't mess around with the GUI. That's the biggest "workflow" killer!
There is one thing I know for sure....Since I don't have two PCs available I sure won't be the first one to push the install button.....(-:
M
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bwbalint
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/05 02:13:28
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"if there is a new "flagship daw" i hope all the people who left to "greener pastures" just stay away forever"
Send all the impure to the CORNFIELD!
CbB latest incarnation, Focusrite Scarlett (2nd generation), WIN10 1809 build, , MCU pro , Yamaha Motif classic 6 , focusrite ASA one
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cparmerlee
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/05 03:40:35
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DAW: SONAR Platinum Audio I/F: Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 gen2
OS: Windows 10 64-bit CPU: Haswell 4790 4.0 GHz, 4 core, 8 thread Memory: 16 GB Video: GTX-760Ti
Storage: Sandisk SSD 500GB for active projects. ReadyNAS 20 TB for long-term storagesonocrafters.com
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jafo360
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/05 04:34:01
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dappa1
35mm
jafo360
Maybe I am missing it somewhere, but I still can not find any information about a permanent authorization code for Platinum for those of us using Command Center. Should I do an offline activation of my current software?
I don't think there has been anything specific mentioned about that, but the servers are staying up and I imagine the latest release will use the same system so I am sure we will be fine going forward.
Are you a guitarist?
Are you asking me or 35mm? Why does it matter? I started out with Pro Track Plus (Sonar 2) that came with my Digitech GNX4 in 2005-6. Over the next 8 years I would upgrade to the next levels of Sonar that I could afford until I worked my way up to Platinum three years ago and then upgraded to the lifetime updates in 2016, which at the time I bumped a few bills so that I could make the dateline. That's hundreds of dollars invested. I can not access my online invoices for the purchases I have made over the years. It just sends you to the Gibson/Cakewalk announcement. If all I got out of this was guaranteed Sonar updates that coincided with future Windows updates, I would be satisfied.
Sonar Platinum Win 10 Focusrite 8i6 Intel i5 3.5 Ghz
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Kamikaze
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/05 05:06:48
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mariogag
meng, please don't mess around with the GUI. That's the biggest "workflow" killer!
I realy can't see them having the time t recreate the whole GUI, a the documentation will need to be changed, and they'd be lef with a confused and probably un-happy user bass. As I shown here, it's possible to radically change the styling of the GUI, whilst keeping it exactly the same, just from within theme editor Noel had said at the end of the summer last year they had a new light or white (I can't remember which) theme in development. When he said this I immediately thought of styling of the new mastering plugs   So I can imagine if this theme had been sufficiently undertaken, then a fresh theme with a new name could be the choice. If they keep Theme Editor and the two old themes, then they just need to amend them on two images to have the new product and name BandLab. New light theme for the release to look Fresh, old themes still available to keep everyone happy
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AT
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Re: New Flagship DAW ready to come out the oven.
2018/03/05 05:22:43
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Meng seems to be working on a different level than the users here. He is talking about having a statement and plan ready about the "new" DAW in 4-6 weeks. A plan. Not the thing itself. It seems some here think a new rewrite, with notation and every bug fix, along with a "P5" emulation, is coming out in a few weeks.
Yea, and people in Hell want ice water.
Give Meng a chance to get the "deal" finished and find out what all he has before you start slagging this new DAW for things it can't do yet since it ain't out. Oh, and Meng and Noel have both stated the old "SONAR" will be available online (and no, I seriously doubt they are going to hand out free codes so any schmuck can get the last version of SPLAT so they don't have to buy Meng's new DAW, which will be SONAR with a new name, new look [maybe?] and hopefully some of the last bug fixes the old Cake finished).
I'm hopeful, but will continue to explore Mixcraft. I haven't even opened Samplitude which I went ahead and bought as others did too, and now I got Cubase Pro. But with all that, I would probably go back to the new SONAR when it becomes available.
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