bapu
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 18:49:30
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I actually WANT all of them.
But in the meantime I'll get by with what I have.
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backwoods
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 19:20:23
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Sonar really has a great set of tools but my problem is that it is quite hard to dial in what you want quickly. Vintage Channel is really good I think but takes a while to learn how to use- but it has lots of useful presets to help you learn. EQ-64 or whatever sounds good but you can't sculpt a curve as quickly or elegantly as you can with Fabfilter Pro-Q or EQuickly (dmg audio). Boost 11 needs a revamp- they need a Boost-64, until then 3rd party options such as Fabfilter Pro-L or Ozone Limiter are almost 'necessary'.
Here is my 3rd party list with the ones I wish I hadn't bought or ones that have been superseded crossed out:
EQ: Pro-Q, Gliss EQ, EQuality, EQuick
Reverb: EOS, 2c Audio Breeze, (will probably get Valhalla Room also)
Compressors: Compassion, Pro-C, Voxengo Polysquasher
Limiters: Pro-L, Elephant
Channel Strips: Alloy, Nectar, Ozone (These are my goto plugins)
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bitflipper
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 19:25:05
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Most people, I guess, start off with the ones that come with the DAW.... then look around for some free ones..... then finally decide to buy some cheaper ones........ then decide to spring a little more money on a few of the nicer ones....then realize that most of them sound OK but pretty much middle of the road so they then buy the really, REALLY nice ones..... Actually, it goes like this: 1. Use the bundled effects that came with the DAW, but are disappointed with the results 2. Read the gushing reviews on KVR for miracle products - especially the ones with the phrase "night and day" or "like a veil had been lifted" in them 3. Happily download dozens of freebies, until the first one crashes your machine and puts you off freebies for good 4. Cough up semi-serious money for a third-party alternative, but are still disappointed with the results 5. Cough up more-serious money for the ones that come with pro-engineer testimonials, only to find that the magic pixie dust is still elusive 6. Study. Seriously study. Learn how the effects work and how to work them. Read books, read online forums, practice and experiment, talk to experienced users and professionals. Neglect your family and day job. To your delight, the plugins eventually start doing what you want them to do. 7. Reach an epiphany when you realize that you could have done the exact same thing all along using the effects that came bundled with your DAW, if you'd only known how.
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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ba_midi
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 19:26:20
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bapu
I actually WANT all of them.
But in the meantime I'll get by with what I have.
If you HAD all of them - that would change everything. 
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ba_midi
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 19:29:06
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bitflipper
Most people, I guess, start off with the ones that come with the DAW.... then look around for some free ones..... then finally decide to buy some cheaper ones........ then decide to spring a little more money on a few of the nicer ones....then realize that most of them sound OK but pretty much middle of the road so they then buy the really, REALLY nice ones.....
Actually, it goes like this:
1. Use the bundled effects that came with the DAW, but are disappointed with the results
2. Read the gushing reviews on KVR for miracle products - especially the ones with the phrase "night and day" or "like a veil had been lifted" in them
3. Happily download dozens of freebies, until the first one crashes your machine and puts you off freebies for good
4. Cough up semi-serious money for a third-party alternative, but are still disappointed with the results
5. Cough up more-serious money for the ones that come with pro-engineer testimonials, only to find that the magic pixie dust is still elusive
6. Study. Seriously study. Learn how the effects work and how to work them. Read books, read online forums, practice and experiment, talk to experienced users and professionals. Neglect your family and day job. To your delight, the plugins eventually start doing what you want them to do.
7. Reach an epiphany when you realize that you could have done the exact same thing all along using the effects that came bundled with your DAW, if you'd only known how.
While I would take issue with the "came bundled" statement (depending on the host and the bundle) at the end -- the post was brilliant Bit 
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dlesaux
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 20:33:58
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I use most of the bundles VST effects (especially the Pro Channel) but was never satisfied with any of the reverbs. Recently got Valhalla Room and I am now very happy! (because I can make it sound like my old Alesis Midiverb II).. Also love PushTec on my guitar tracks.. Also love TB Isone and Ferrox..
So I guess, yeah 42 sounds about right..
Peace! Daniel Sonar Platinum - 2017.10 and PreSonus Studio One 3.5.5
Windows 10 64 bit
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stratman70
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 20:41:24
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With the exception of Ozone 4, Alloy and a T Racks 3 Vintage compressor-I depend on the stuff that came with sonar.
Perfect Space is great to me for everything reverb-I have gathered quite an array of impulses, from vocals to drums.-Lexicon Patheon is OK also.
I also like and use the 2 LP 64's in Sonar. The LP 64 EQ is especailly powerful
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StarTekh
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 20:50:09
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I use Franks Red Hot Sauce. I put that **** on everything !!!
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yorolpal
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 21:29:34
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You, sir have the right idea!
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bapu
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 21:32:56
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yorolpal
You, sir have the right idea!
I was taught there were no right, only popular opinion.
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...wicked
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 21:33:36
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bitflipper
7. Reach an epiphany when you realize that you could have done the exact same thing all along using the effects that came bundled with your DAW, if you'd only known how. Hahaha, FTW! I might add a sub-section to one of your items that reads "realize you MUST have certain plugins because it's what everyone says."
=========== The Fog People =========== Intel i7-4790 16GB RAM ASUS Z97 Roland OctaCapture Win10/64 SONAR Platinum 64-bit billions VSTs, some of which work
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Middleman
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 22:15:07
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bitflipper
Most people, I guess, start off with the ones that come with the DAW.... then look around for some free ones..... then finally decide to buy some cheaper ones........ then decide to spring a little more money on a few of the nicer ones....then realize that most of them sound OK but pretty much middle of the road so they then buy the really, REALLY nice ones.....
Actually, it goes like this:
1. Use the bundled effects that came with the DAW, but are disappointed with the results
2. Read the gushing reviews on KVR for miracle products - especially the ones with the phrase "night and day" or "like a veil had been lifted" in them
3. Happily download dozens of freebies, until the first one crashes your machine and puts you off freebies for good
4. Cough up semi-serious money for a third-party alternative, but are still disappointed with the results
5. Cough up more-serious money for the ones that come with pro-engineer testimonials, only to find that the magic pixie dust is still elusive
6. Study. Seriously study. Learn how the effects work and how to work them. Read books, read online forums, practice and experiment, talk to experienced users and professionals. Neglect your family and day job. To your delight, the plugins eventually start doing what you want them to do.
7. Reach an epiphany when you realize that you could have done the exact same thing all along using the effects that came bundled with your DAW, if you'd only known how.
8. Realize you have spent as much money on plugins that you could have afforded a couple of high end hardware boxes. Sell all the plugins you can and vow to only use outboard. (Which causes you to upgrade your soundcard to accommodate more external hardware). Come to the realization that the problem all along was your crummy monitors and lack of room treatment. It never ends.
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mixmkr
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 22:24:49
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It amuses me that people might think their ART fxr unit or some ancient Alesis verb is better than the Lexicon Pantheon... or Perfect Space... Those are killer reverbs plugs. Unless you're recording solo tin flute or something, in a mix, those two are great.
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Jonbouy
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 22:30:39
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bapu
I actually WANT all of them.
But in the meantime I'll get by with counting what I have already.
........142,356, 142,357, 142,358. Darn I forgot about the 32 bit ones....142,359,... Fixst.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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Rain
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 22:53:07
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When working in Sonar, 90% of the work I do is accomplished with the bundled Sonitus plug-ins. Same in Logic - bundled plug-ins. I spent a lot of $ on plug-ins this summer, just to make sure I had everything I needed on my portable rig. And the truth is, even though I often try to justify the expenses by putting one of those fancy compressors or EQ on a strip, most of the time I'll revert to the bundled ones. I'm trying - I'm anxious to use them. I tried the demos and they blew me away, so I bought them. But in a real-world scenario, I can't seem to put myself in a situation where I need them or where they actually bring something truly "magic" to the mix. I try. I sometime sit there after a session and A/B compressors. Sometimes, they do a little something. Most of the time, it sounds "different" - no better, no worse. Volume, pan, automation, hi-pass filtering, a bit of parametric eq to take care of problematic frequencies, compression/noise gate - that's where the bulk of the work is done. Hype may lead us to believe that "coloration" is crucial, but you usually don't need that at that stage. And even then, it's more a matter of taste than anything that's actually "better" or not as good. Heck, even with reverb... Logic's reverb is nowhere near as good as Sonitus, yet I use it all the time. Seriously, how often do you need a loooooong lush and pristine tail on a reverb in the context of a mix? Most of the time, I'm sticking with just a tiny bit of early reflection - almost any reverb will do for that. I've bought the Valhalla reverb someone mentioned earlier - amazing and highly recommended! - but, I only use it every now and then. That and convolution are the big guns - I use them exceptionally. Spending time with bundled plug-ins and learning them inside out is much more rewarding and will do much more for your mixes than any of the latest must-have plug-in which supposedly works "magic".
post edited by Rain - 2011/09/19 22:59:45
TCB - Tea, Cats, Books...
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StarTekh
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/19 22:59:05
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truth be known: I auctualy use Louisiana Hot Sause !! I can drink
that ****
..right outa the Bottle !! yeehaw
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bitflipper
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 01:08:22
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Rain, re: Valhalla - I've hovered over the Buy button on that one more than once. After all, it's only fifty bucks! But every time, I ask myself what it would really change and decide it would change nothing. Truth is, I've been dialing back my reverb year after year to the point where now I hardly miss it if I mute the bus entirely.
Maybe, someday, I'll do a Vangelis tribute and buy Valhalla Room for that.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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relpomiraculous
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 03:34:59
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I think 5 or 6 types of every processor is a good rule to follow, if you have the money.
Sonar X2 64 bit - Win 7 Pro 64 bit - Intel Core i7 870 - 8 gigs of ram - HP 3130 desktop
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tyacko
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 08:01:56
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ErikDeluxe,
Having used many plug-ins over the years, I've found a few that I consider my go to plugs. I got into the UAD stuff back when the UAD-1 came out, so I don't use anywhere near the number of native plugs at this point as the UAD just nails it for me.
1. Melodyne - to tighten up an vocals.
2. WaveArts TrackPlug - I really only use this for the real-time analyzer and to apply a low-cut on most tracks. But will use its gate from time-to-time.
3. UAD - using their precision limiter and buss compressor on the master, Studer A800 on most tracks, LA2A/1176, and the Helios EQ for air on tracks. I also use the Neve channel strip because it have a very nice "high sparkle" preset that I've used to apply on drum overheads as a send effect that works very well.
4. Sonitus delay - extremely effective all-purpose delay.
I've used EMT 140 for reverb, but no reverb has really hit the mark for me at this point.
Tom
Our SoundClick page ASUS P9X79 PRO, Intel i7 3930K, 32gig RAM G.SKILL Ripjaws, RME Babyface USB, GeForce GTX 550 Ti, UAD-2, Intel 510 120gig SSD Drive, Win7 64-bit, Sonar X1E 64-bit, Studio One V2
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ba_midi
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 10:38:36
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bitflipper
Rain, re: Valhalla - I've hovered over the Buy button on that one more than once. After all, it's only fifty bucks! But every time, I ask myself what it would really change and decide it would change nothing. Truth is, I've been dialing back my reverb year after year to the point where now I hardly miss it if I mute the bus entirely.
Maybe, someday, I'll do a Vangelis tribute and buy Valhalla Room for that.
The thing about reverbs/echos/delays, though - is that it's almost sacrilegious not to use them on "hit" records. Radio play enhances the sound of them as well due to the type of compression used. It's almost like reverb saturation.
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ltb
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 11:11:47
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ErikDeluxe
I find Sonar X1s Pro-Channel to work most of the time for my needs; the FX sounds fantastic.
There's your answer- 'what fits your needs' try out demo's & as you progress you'll aquire your own taste level. You'll attain your own set of 'go-to's' as many users have & it will change along the way.
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Rothchild
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 12:15:20
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I'm in agreement with bit here, 'cept I skipped the buying expensive plug bit and just spent time learning how to use what I had and weeding through the free stuff to make sure it was all killers no fillers.
I recieve a steady stream of mix work and have put out label albums using nothing more than freeware and the plugs included in Sonar (Sonitus and Timeworks). I recently bought my first paid for plugin and it's the only one I have (The Glue).
My audio fx folder is well equipped but not over stuffed.
I use 4 different EQ's three of which because their differing interfaces are suited to achieving different things and one because it's an interesting 'colour'
I have a fair set of compressors but most projects end up with 3 maybe 4 different varieties.
I have a larger folder of distortion, saturation and other 'grungebox' type effects and I'm always on the lookout for stuff that does character
Generally I only use 2 verbs (although I may well use more than 2 itterations) that's Sonitus and Perfect Space (with a pretty extensive impulse collection) I keep the Pantheon and another freeware verb knocking around if I find myself stuck and want to just play about.
Coupla delays, Love NastyDLA and Bionic Delay for musical stuff, Sonitus works for 'technical stuff' (stereo spread tricks, that sort of stuff) and a couple of really wacky ones like deeelay for more out there needs.
Sonitus gate does everything a gate should and in an easy to use way
There's 'modulation' folder for chorus, phasers and other more wacky stuff. It doesn't see a great deal of use but it has some additional rudimentary stuff like rotating speakers.
I like to keep my money for beer hardware these days!
Child
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Rain
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 13:10:58
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bitflipper
Rain, re: Valhalla - I've hovered over the Buy button on that one more than once. After all, it's only fifty bucks! But every time, I ask myself what it would really change and decide it would change nothing. Truth is, I've been dialing back my reverb year after year to the point where now I hardly miss it if I mute the bus entirely.
Maybe, someday, I'll do a Vangelis tribute and buy Valhalla Room for that.
In all honesty, I'm not sure I'd have bought it for my home set up. Sonar itself has pretty adequate reverbs - Sonitus is good, the old DSP FX reverb works just fine on some things and there's convolution for the rest. I may not be the best judge either as I don't use much reverb. Like you, I've been using less and less, and most of the time it's 80% early reflections. Or a little bit on the snare to breathe a little life back in. Different story for my portable Logic-based rig - I only had the bundled ones, and I don't think they're as good. I still use them quite a bit for early reflections, but I wanted to have a decent one for the rest. It was either CSR or Valhalla. I really wanted to get CSR but when I compared them, I just couldn't justify the expense. CSR has more reverb types, whereas Valhalla is a room reverb as the name implies. But between that and convolution, I'm all set. I just like the GUI on that plug-in - big, easy to read, tips for each parameters when you hover over each parameters, telling you what increasing or decreasing it actually do. I was more of a preset tweaker in the past, but with this one, I often find myself creating my own patch from scratch w/o even realizing it. And it sounds good. And, well, yes, it's only $50, part of the profits goes to the red cross international disaster fund, and the guy keeps on updating it - latest revision included 2 new algorithms and a resizable GUI.
post edited by Rain - 2011/09/20 13:14:23
TCB - Tea, Cats, Books...
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candlesayshi
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 13:52:09
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A lot of effects processing is a big part of what I do, but to be honest, I don't have that many plugins. Mostly I just use or build something in Reaktor to get what I'm looking for.
However, I do wish that SONAR had a nice bundled distortion, it seems a weird omission, and I love Alias Factor. So, it makes me wonder what a Cakewalk distortion would be like.
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don4777
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 14:38:31
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candlesayshi
However, I do wish that SONAR had a nice bundled distortion, it seems a weird omission, and I love Alias Factor. So, it makes me wonder what a Cakewalk distortion would be like.
Which version of Sonar do you have? In the Studio version there is TL‐64 TUBE LEVELER In the Producer version there is also VX‐64 VOCAL STRIP, PX‐64 PERCUSSION STRIP, ProChannel Tube Saturation You could also try Amp Sim, Tape Sim, or the distortion in Guitar Rig LE.
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musicroom
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 15:14:03
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Rain
bitflipper
Rain, re: Valhalla - I've hovered over the Buy button on that one more than once. After all, it's only fifty bucks! But every time, I ask myself what it would really change and decide it would change nothing. Truth is, I've been dialing back my reverb year after year to the point where now I hardly miss it if I mute the bus entirely.
Maybe, someday, I'll do a Vangelis tribute and buy Valhalla Room for that.
In all honesty, I'm not sure I'd have bought it for my home set up. Sonar itself has pretty adequate reverbs - Sonitus is good, the old DSP FX reverb works just fine on some things and there's convolution for the rest. I may not be the best judge either as I don't use much reverb. Like you, I've been using less and less, and most of the time it's 80% early reflections. Or a little bit on the snare to breathe a little life back in.
Different story for my portable Logic-based rig - I only had the bundled ones, and I don't think they're as good. I still use them quite a bit for early reflections, but I wanted to have a decent one for the rest. It was either CSR or Valhalla. I really wanted to get CSR but when I compared them, I just couldn't justify the expense. CSR has more reverb types, whereas Valhalla is a room reverb as the name implies. But between that and convolution, I'm all set.
I just like the GUI on that plug-in - big, easy to read, tips for each parameters when you hover over each parameters, telling you what increasing or decreasing it actually do. I was more of a preset tweaker in the past, but with this one, I often find myself creating my own patch from scratch w/o even realizing it. And it sounds good.
And, well, yes, it's only $50, part of the profits goes to the red cross international disaster fund, and the guy keeps on updating it - latest revision included 2 new algorithms and a resizable GUI.
I too use Sonitus, fxreverb, and perfect space... and I have Wizooverb (very nice blow out price at the time and worth it). After a recommendation, I bought Valhalla Room and I'm far from disappointed. This is a pro-level reverb/do most anything at a bargain price. From reflections to grainy/smokey or clean smooth plates and halls... you can dial in what you need quickly. This would be my desert island verb if I had to only choose one. On another note, I recommend that it is worth reviewing the Jonas' templates to check out some of the presets he created for Cake's fx. Especially for the fxreverb. For me it was worth the time to save all of his presets for each plug. Great starting points!
Dave Songs___________________________________ Desktop: Platinum / RME Multiface II / Purrfect Audio DAW I7-3770 / 16 GB RAM / Win 10 Pro / Remote Laptop i7 6500U / 12GB RAM / RME Babyface
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EricDeluxe
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 16:16:19
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Hey
This thread turned out to be very interesting; thanks all for your thoughtful inputs...
I will go with the FX that ships with Sonar X1 (Producer) (PX-64 Percussion Strip, ProChannel etc. )as I think they work fine for most of my needs. At least to start with, I will try to "master these;)
I also have some FX from Absynth 5, FM 8, Kore 2, Studio Devil and TC Electronics M30 and M40 reverbs which may come handy...
Otherwise, Softube and Fabfilter and Lexicon are favorites from my "tests"
Thanks again!
http://soundcloud.com/ericdeluxe - my harder side https://soundcloud.com/cirque-du-sonique my softer side *************************************** Sonar Platinum, Windows 10 (64 bit), MOTU Ultralite MK3 Hybrid, Novation SL MKII 25, NI KORE 2, NI Maschine, NI Komplete 9, Yamaha HS50m, AKG K240S, AKG Perception 200, Z3TA 2+, Soundtoys Native Effects, PSP Mixpack 2, several VSTs****************************************
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Rain
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 16:44:27
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That's one of those things when testing plug-ins... Most of the time, the evaluation is by nature limited in time, so we (at least I) tend to set a specific time and session to try those tools.
We're also in a frame of mind that leaves us a bit more open to hearing things that we don't necessarily pay attention to in real world scenarios. We're listening for specific things. And since we're looking for it, we're likely to hear it.
As such, I've bought a lot of software that seemed to really make some things shine. But when the time come to actually integrate them in my workflow, I find that there's often little if any advantage. A slightly more pleasant coloration in certain cases. Nothing that makes a drastic difference in most cases. Then there are a few exceptions.
There is a lot to be squeezed out of any application's bundled set of tools nowadays. And Sonar has a lot of good tools.
TCB - Tea, Cats, Books...
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donbelisle
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 16:52:49
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Sonar`s latest stuff is great. After 2-3 years chasing the VST dream plugs.
I settled on nothing but Sonar, Melodyne and Izotope`s main 3.
Ozone 4 , Alloy ( mainly for guitars), Nectar ( vocal processor ).
Bitfilpper comments are right on,
you can usually get the same results, using the tools you already have.
Cakewalk`s effects are great, most of my mixes are done using their tools.
The Izotope`s tools help do very complex effect chains with intelligent GUIs I like.
But still, I could do the same with more time and patience with just using Sonar.
Great thread topic
Don Belisle
Win 7 32/64, Xp 32, i5 laptop, Q6600 desktop, Motu MKIII, ect ect
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candlesayshi
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Re:Pro-Channel and other fx - how many do you actually need?
2011/09/20 17:47:26
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don4777
candlesayshi
However, I do wish that SONAR had a nice bundled distortion, it seems a weird omission, and I love Alias Factor. So, it makes me wonder what a Cakewalk distortion would be like.
Which version of Sonar do you have?
In the Studio version there is TL‐64 TUBE LEVELER
X1 Producer. Yeah, the TL-64 is nice, and I use the Amp Sim all the time (such an awful sound on that one, but awful in a way I really like). However, they seem more focused towards overdrive. I'm thinking something more akin to a multi-distortion or wave-shaping distortion unit.
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